Mini Moke EV Project
Discussion
Hi all.
I have just bought a ‘72 Aussie Moke, for an EV conversion.
When the car arrives in a week or so it will be less the engine, The conversion will use 6 x 5.6kwh cells from a Tesla model X, I will most likely keep the gearbox, blank it off and mount the hyper 9 motor above, with direct gear or chain drive, another option would be to remove the gearbox and fit a chain drive diff off of a bike engined conversion, or more radically convert to RWD, but I haven’t found much info on RWD subframes.
With 120hp and 176fp of instant torque it’s bound to spin the wheels (just a bit) so if the wheels have to spin, it would be more fun if it’s the rears
So there you have it, I’m sure many of you will be crying sacrilege, and as a fellow car nut I don’t blame you at all, but since the governments announcement on accelerating the ban on (new) Petrol and diesel cars, it got me speculating that new electric cars will be getting ever cheaper and hence popular, normal/boring cars will end up at the scrappers, and only the cool stuff and classics will be left...but will fuel then be taxed to death... minimum unit pricing to save us from ourselves??
I also just fancied the challenge of an EV conversion and a moke made perfect sense.
For those interested some Pics and some other info here:
https://sec-marine.com/news/2020/03/our-first-non-...
[url]
|https://thumbsnap.com/huRx928N[/url]
I have just bought a ‘72 Aussie Moke, for an EV conversion.
When the car arrives in a week or so it will be less the engine, The conversion will use 6 x 5.6kwh cells from a Tesla model X, I will most likely keep the gearbox, blank it off and mount the hyper 9 motor above, with direct gear or chain drive, another option would be to remove the gearbox and fit a chain drive diff off of a bike engined conversion, or more radically convert to RWD, but I haven’t found much info on RWD subframes.
With 120hp and 176fp of instant torque it’s bound to spin the wheels (just a bit) so if the wheels have to spin, it would be more fun if it’s the rears
So there you have it, I’m sure many of you will be crying sacrilege, and as a fellow car nut I don’t blame you at all, but since the governments announcement on accelerating the ban on (new) Petrol and diesel cars, it got me speculating that new electric cars will be getting ever cheaper and hence popular, normal/boring cars will end up at the scrappers, and only the cool stuff and classics will be left...but will fuel then be taxed to death... minimum unit pricing to save us from ourselves??
I also just fancied the challenge of an EV conversion and a moke made perfect sense.
For those interested some Pics and some other info here:
https://sec-marine.com/news/2020/03/our-first-non-...
[url]|https://thumbsnap.com/huRx928N[/url]
Looking forward to following this one, restoring and converting a classic is definitely in my future somewhere.
Worth looking at lotus_elon on Insta if you haven't already, that has been a fascinating follow on converting a Lotus Elan.
How did you get the Tesla battery pack? I've been on the look-out for a self-build powerwall but the pricing of Tesla modules is all over the place.
Good luck!
Worth looking at lotus_elon on Insta if you haven't already, that has been a fascinating follow on converting a Lotus Elan.
How did you get the Tesla battery pack? I've been on the look-out for a self-build powerwall but the pricing of Tesla modules is all over the place.
Good luck!
JxJ Jr. said:
Coincidentally, I came across this company recently:
https://en.nosmoke.fr/
Brilliant... Would it be road legal for pottering around in the UK ? https://en.nosmoke.fr/
I'd have one
Hi All,
Well I've bottled in on going RWD, I have contacted a load of different companies and none of them seam to interested in parting me with my money, so it back to the original plan of FWD, so I am thinking about using either:
-Quaife QBAR5, nice but very pricey...https://shop.quaife.co.uk/quaife-universal-axle-unit-no-reverse
or a gearbox from a Fiesta/Nissan/Honda etc, without using the shift but mostly just to get the diff and range of ratios to play with. I can see there are a load of mini conversions with Vauxhall Red tops, Honda VTEC's, & Rover K's all I guess to get a good power/weight and Power/£ ratio, but I want to use the very lightest gearbox I can get away with and still handle upto 170 fp of torque, a bit of googling says a Nissan Micra K10 gearbox is only about 25Kg but would that be able to handle the torque ?, the easy option would be a civic GB but it would be great to keep the weight as low as possible (as the batteries are chuffin' heavy) , and I'm thinking that not changing gears is going to much better/easier for a box that potentially underrated.
Whats say you all ?
Well I've bottled in on going RWD, I have contacted a load of different companies and none of them seam to interested in parting me with my money, so it back to the original plan of FWD, so I am thinking about using either:
-Quaife QBAR5, nice but very pricey...https://shop.quaife.co.uk/quaife-universal-axle-unit-no-reverse
or a gearbox from a Fiesta/Nissan/Honda etc, without using the shift but mostly just to get the diff and range of ratios to play with. I can see there are a load of mini conversions with Vauxhall Red tops, Honda VTEC's, & Rover K's all I guess to get a good power/weight and Power/£ ratio, but I want to use the very lightest gearbox I can get away with and still handle upto 170 fp of torque, a bit of googling says a Nissan Micra K10 gearbox is only about 25Kg but would that be able to handle the torque ?, the easy option would be a civic GB but it would be great to keep the weight as low as possible (as the batteries are chuffin' heavy) , and I'm thinking that not changing gears is going to much better/easier for a box that potentially underrated.
Whats say you all ?
I'd say just stick a modern, brushless EDU in it. Get one from a Tesla, Leaf, an i3 or whatever, all your problems solved in one small, light package. The leaf and tesla have "open source" controllers now to enable you to drive the original power stages in their inverters.
Wind up the current a bit, and a leaf motor will peak at something like 150 bhp, plenty in a moke...... ;-)
Wind up the current a bit, and a leaf motor will peak at something like 150 bhp, plenty in a moke...... ;-)
Hi Max,
I can see that there are certainly cheaper and probably better ways to do this, but as a first build I wanted it to be as simple as it possiby can, hence the choice of a Moke, and the buying in the motor and controller.
I'm to deep into it now to make a changes on that, so it just deciding on how the drive is going to be put down, the lightest solution would be Pro-Motives chain driven diff would be the lightest solution, but Im not sure about chain drive, and the dimensions mean that chaining that to a belt drive would be extremely challenging- but I've not closed the doors on that.
So the cheapest drive solution would be a used gearbox that the motor cab direct couple too, but I'm not sure if the standard sub frame could be modified or if I need to go with an all-speed or similar custom sub frame.
https://www.instagram.com/mini_moke_ev/
I can see that there are certainly cheaper and probably better ways to do this, but as a first build I wanted it to be as simple as it possiby can, hence the choice of a Moke, and the buying in the motor and controller.
I'm to deep into it now to make a changes on that, so it just deciding on how the drive is going to be put down, the lightest solution would be Pro-Motives chain driven diff would be the lightest solution, but Im not sure about chain drive, and the dimensions mean that chaining that to a belt drive would be extremely challenging- but I've not closed the doors on that.
So the cheapest drive solution would be a used gearbox that the motor cab direct couple too, but I'm not sure if the standard sub frame could be modified or if I need to go with an all-speed or similar custom sub frame.
https://www.instagram.com/mini_moke_ev/
Forest Way said:
Hi Max,
I can see that there are certainly cheaper and probably better ways to do this, but as a first build I wanted it to be as simple as it possiby can, hence the choice of a Moke, and the buying in the motor and controller.
I'm to deep into it now to make a changes on that, so it just deciding on how the drive is going to be put down, the lightest solution would be Pro-Motives chain driven diff would be the lightest solution, but Im not sure about chain drive, and the dimensions mean that chaining that to a belt drive would be extremely challenging- but I've not closed the doors on that.
So the cheapest drive solution would be a used gearbox that the motor cab direct couple too, but I'm not sure if the standard sub frame could be modified or if I need to go with an all-speed or similar custom sub frame.
https://www.instagram.com/mini_moke_ev/
Given that the std mini box is gear driven down one end, it shouldnt' be very difficult to make some sort of adaptor plate to hold the motor, seal the oil in the gearbox, and run the drive down into it.I can see that there are certainly cheaper and probably better ways to do this, but as a first build I wanted it to be as simple as it possiby can, hence the choice of a Moke, and the buying in the motor and controller.
I'm to deep into it now to make a changes on that, so it just deciding on how the drive is going to be put down, the lightest solution would be Pro-Motives chain driven diff would be the lightest solution, but Im not sure about chain drive, and the dimensions mean that chaining that to a belt drive would be extremely challenging- but I've not closed the doors on that.
So the cheapest drive solution would be a used gearbox that the motor cab direct couple too, but I'm not sure if the standard sub frame could be modified or if I need to go with an all-speed or similar custom sub frame.
https://www.instagram.com/mini_moke_ev/
(I'd still sell the old fashioned motor and just put in an EDU, but it's not my project :-)
Max...do you have some experience yourself using the Toyota MGE or Nissan leaf Motor?
Adapting the std mini gearbox was plan A, but I have sat staring at it for hours and believe me it not as simple as it sounds, also I cant find anyone on the tiniterweb that has done it...lot of talk but no actual evidence that I can find, I have alsi been advised by a few mini modifiers that the stb box just wont take 170 odd FP of torque.
I'm too committed to this now to do it completely differently, there are obviously many different ways to get similar results, the way I have chosen is possibly the most expensive,and I was hoping that would simplify things, but its clear to me now that there is no simple way to turn an an old ICE car into a reliable EV.
What I really wanted was to make it RWD, and I had reached out to quite a few UK companies to help me toward that end (instead of buying the Minitec kit from the US), but if I stick with FWD and end up spending similar money on a custom sub frame and Honda/Vaux etc gear box, or some kind of chain or belt drive diff....i will be mighty pissed.
Adapting the std mini gearbox was plan A, but I have sat staring at it for hours and believe me it not as simple as it sounds, also I cant find anyone on the tiniterweb that has done it...lot of talk but no actual evidence that I can find, I have alsi been advised by a few mini modifiers that the stb box just wont take 170 odd FP of torque.
I'm too committed to this now to do it completely differently, there are obviously many different ways to get similar results, the way I have chosen is possibly the most expensive,and I was hoping that would simplify things, but its clear to me now that there is no simple way to turn an an old ICE car into a reliable EV.
What I really wanted was to make it RWD, and I had reached out to quite a few UK companies to help me toward that end (instead of buying the Minitec kit from the US), but if I stick with FWD and end up spending similar money on a custom sub frame and Honda/Vaux etc gear box, or some kind of chain or belt drive diff....i will be mighty pissed.
I have no experience with those motors, but a motor is a motor, and an inverter is an inverter, and they are easy to hack if you just chuck away the OE control boards and fit one of the open source FoC versions. Asking on EndlessSphere of the OpenInverter forum would probably get you most of the way there.
For what it's worth, i wouldnt' be messing around with rwd, because 1) it's a mini, they are classically fwd 2) it's never going to be a performance car, so the tiny performance loss from being fwd is irrelevant 2) stick the motor in the front, and the batteries in the middle for the safest conversion.
Even if you keep your current motor, i'd still get a proper EV transmission. Probably the cost saving of just being able to make a simple spline adaptor and circular adaptor plate and stick you motor onto say a leaf gearbox is going to pay for the s/h box. And you get usefull things like the parking brake too. Like i said, if it were my project, i'd just drop an entire leaf or zoe EDU in and get OE durability and driveability with zero effort.. All you'd have to do is make up some custom halfshafts with the apprpriate inner joints to suit the new box, plenty of people to do that.
if you try to use a ICE gearbox then it'll be
1) massive and heavy
2) complicated
3) Be a 'mare to fit a motor too probably
4) probably too wide for the mini
Finally, don't assume the std gearbox can't take the torque of a electric motor. Depsite being very torquey, they are also very smooth, ie no stab torques unlike am ICE. With a 4cyl engine the stab and inertial torques (clutch dump after reving enigne up) are significantly higher than peak static torque in most cases, without those, and with the box locked in a tall gear (you don't need 1st, nor 2nd, and probably not 3rd either!) i suspect the std box would be fine, espcially as i am assuming a moke isn't exactly a daily driver.....
For what it's worth, i wouldnt' be messing around with rwd, because 1) it's a mini, they are classically fwd 2) it's never going to be a performance car, so the tiny performance loss from being fwd is irrelevant 2) stick the motor in the front, and the batteries in the middle for the safest conversion.
Even if you keep your current motor, i'd still get a proper EV transmission. Probably the cost saving of just being able to make a simple spline adaptor and circular adaptor plate and stick you motor onto say a leaf gearbox is going to pay for the s/h box. And you get usefull things like the parking brake too. Like i said, if it were my project, i'd just drop an entire leaf or zoe EDU in and get OE durability and driveability with zero effort.. All you'd have to do is make up some custom halfshafts with the apprpriate inner joints to suit the new box, plenty of people to do that.
if you try to use a ICE gearbox then it'll be
1) massive and heavy
2) complicated
3) Be a 'mare to fit a motor too probably
4) probably too wide for the mini
Finally, don't assume the std gearbox can't take the torque of a electric motor. Depsite being very torquey, they are also very smooth, ie no stab torques unlike am ICE. With a 4cyl engine the stab and inertial torques (clutch dump after reving enigne up) are significantly higher than peak static torque in most cases, without those, and with the box locked in a tall gear (you don't need 1st, nor 2nd, and probably not 3rd either!) i suspect the std box would be fine, espcially as i am assuming a moke isn't exactly a daily driver.....
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