Bugger ??

[666 SVT]

So the car has been running a bit rough lately and today it didn’t want to start at all? Upon further investigation it’s possible to freely spin the rotor arm which can’t be good? Anyone had this before and how awkward is it to remove the dizzy from the block?
Cheers
Col.

[blitzracing]

Easy enough. Take the engine to number 1 top dead center and on compression as a reference point. Take off the distributor cap with leads and put to one side. Mark the distributor shaft against the block with paint for position reference. The rotor should be pointing towards number one plug lead take off now if all was well. Unplug the ignition amp. Remove the 14mm nut and clamp at the base of the distributor and pull the distributor up and out. When you put it back together you need to make sure the rotor is back in the correct place towards number 1 lead when it meshes back in.

[666 SVT]

Thanks for that I’ll whip it out tomorrow. Mine is a 95 400 so wondering is there several different types and can you still buy a new one?

[Steve_D]

Yes you can buy new. fitted one recently.
If your rotor is just spinning then establishing No. 1 TDC will not be as simple so forget that for now just come back and ask once you know more on the failure.
For now use some tippex and mark where no. 1 lead is on the rim of the dizzy and take another photo for reference.

Here are some possible causes for 'free rotor syndrome'. Listed in O st order.

The fly weights inside the dizzy have broken up....new dizzy.
The teeth have stripped at the bottom of the dizzy drive......where have they gone and have they/will they cause further damage inside the timing case.
The drive gear on the end of the camshaft has sheared the drive key (Woodruff Key)
Broken camshaft
Broken timing chain.

Not a good day.
Steve

[Steve_D]

Further thought. When you say you can spin the rotor are you talking all the way round and is the shaft turning or just the rotor loose on the shaft.
Silly I know but had to ask.

Steve

[666 SVT]

Hi Steve, Yes I can turn it pretty freely either way. Aware that it could be quite serious if it’s a problem at the drive end so hoping for the best at the moment. Will try and whip it out today if the rain stops long enough and be back armed with some pictures. Timing wise I think all I can do for now is take out number 1 plug and get it at TDC prior to removal.

Col

[LLantrisant]

you need to remove the dizzy form the engine...its a job of 15min, just loosing 1 nut

than you will see whats wrong:

drive-gear on dizzy shaft loose or worn (the drive gear on the dizzy side is harder than the one inside the engine...so most likley the engine side has worn)
if this looks fine: itd the drive gear on the end of the camshaft.

means: exhaust y-piece out, timing-cover off, and replacing gear. in the same time you should replace also the timing chain (even it would still look ok)...and also check if the spacer on the camshaft behind the drive gear has been fitted the correct way around...

guess why i know? i had a similar problem:

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

but i must admit: mine is a pre-serpentine.

Edited by LLantrisant on Wednesday 1st April 10:35

[666 SVT]

Thanks, Just read through it, Interesting thread. I’m going to get the dizzy out this afternoon so should know a bit more later?

[666 SVT]

So it’s off and it looks like it’s collapsed internally? When holding the drive gear which looks in very good order you can still twist the shaft in any direction and if you give it a shake it sounds like the weights and springs etc are rattling around free in the body? Top plastic cover that says Do not remove doesn’t want to come off as the screw heads have been filled in with something to deter removal. Think I’ll try and find a new one somewhere and give it a try?

Col

[Caddyshack]

Call MSD in Blackpool and see if they have a more modern set up to do away with the need for the distributor to be used. I did that on my cossie, I now have a cam sensor trigger.

[Zener]

Dont be swayed to purchase a pattern dizzy (some new one's are of a moody construction IME) if your going cheap/easiest route then buy a S/H Lucas unit or brand new old stock (if your lucky) they are reliable units and get the job done IMO

[Steve_D]

Regard this as a good day afterall. It could have been way more expensive.

Steve

[Belle427]

Give these a call, they are very helpful and should have something.
https://simonbbc.com/

[blitzracing]

Another option would be the 123 ignition dizzy. Expensive but finely crafted. Fully programmable timing and no bob weights. Easier than messing around with trigger wheels and coil packs.

I think this is the one (?)

http://www.123ignition.nl/product.phtml?id=227

Edited by blitzracing on Wednesday 1st April 15:21

[666 SVT]

Some interesting options about. I’ve sent pics of mine to Rimmer Bros to see what they have in stock. Not really worth doing an expensive conversion as it’s a bog standard early 400 and was running perfectly until a couple of weeks ago.
Cheers Guys👍

[666 SVT]

So new distributor came and as I had no idea which way it was pointing when it came out, I removed no1 plug and placed my finger over the hole to feel for the compression stroke while turning the crank. Plug back in cap back on and car fires up right away and runs smooth and strong. After a couple of minutes it splutters and dies then will not fire up again? Leave it a few minutes and then it starts first turn and runs well until it dies again? I’m now stuck in this repeating pattern. I have just bought the Rover Gauge software and lead for my laptop so I suppose that should be my first port of call to get that up and running?
Col

[666 SVT]

Anybody know if this should be connected somewhere? I did here somewhere I think that there was a spare unused temp sensor on these engines? If so seems odd to have a lead on it but can’t see anywhere it would connect to.
Col

[Colin RedGriff]

The wire with the red crimp connector is the usually unused Rover temp sender looks like someone tried to use it to drive the gauge at some point but it being disconnected shouldn't affect the engine. The normal gauge sensor is usually (it varies) somewhere near the front of the engine possibly in the water pump.

The one next to it with the square brown connector is the TVR coolant sensor for the ECU. Hopefully if you get rovergauge you should be able to see if it is working. Faulty ones can cause problems with running.

[666 SVT]

Well Im making progress as it won’t start at all now.

[Belle427]

Have you verified the leads are in the correct order on the cap and the timing is correct?
Sorry if it’s teaching you to suck eggs but you have to go back to basics.
I’m not sure what dizzy you ended up with but some of the caps and rotors are very poor fitting.