Sailing Portugal to N Wales
Discussion
Three years ago brother bought a 32ft sailing boat in Spain, took some courses and sailed it around the med in between his day job.
It has spent winter in Portugal, had some work done and my brother now has plans to sail it to North Wales in a sreight line. I have spent three weeks on the boat and it is fun, but wonder how challanging such a sea voyage is. How lo g does it take?
His plans after that is to sail to the Shetland Islands
Anyone experienced on here?
It has spent winter in Portugal, had some work done and my brother now has plans to sail it to North Wales in a sreight line. I have spent three weeks on the boat and it is fun, but wonder how challanging such a sea voyage is. How lo g does it take?
His plans after that is to sail to the Shetland Islands
Anyone experienced on here?
I don't want this to sound sanctimonious but if you have to ask questions like how long it will take, you'd be well advised to get someone else to sail it. Sea voyages can be plain sailing all the way, or they can be a total nightmare, with death a genuine prospect if you don't know what you are doing (and still on the cards, even if you do).
Would hire a professional skipper and probably a first mate, unless the owner is up to first mating.
What kind of boat is it? 32ft is probably going to be ok but you'd want it to be suitably kitted out for offshore - safety equipment, navigation kit, and proper structural check before you go etc.
Would hire a professional skipper and probably a first mate, unless the owner is up to first mating.
What kind of boat is it? 32ft is probably going to be ok but you'd want it to be suitably kitted out for offshore - safety equipment, navigation kit, and proper structural check before you go etc.
Krikkit said:
Out of interest would it be more approachable doing it by coast-hopping up the Atlantic French coast?
It's possible but there are some long stretches which makes a day sailing, hoping ports unfeasible. If the weather isn't kind accessing some of the ports is difficult. People generally take an offshore approach, so at least your aren't being driven to anything too solid.https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/sailing-skills/how...
If you don't want war stories to bore people with at yacht club bars another option is to lower the mast and go via the French canal network (this does depend on the draft of yacht).
Biscay has a reputation, even with the most casual sailors, so I doubt this is an idea that the OP's brother came up with on the spur of the moment.
Hi thanks for the replies, the boat is a Jeanneau 32 (if that helps anyone) although quite old 1996 I think it was rebuilt in 2012, it has had its electrics upgraded recently, new sails in 2018.
Andy was going to do the voyage sola, but I am loosing my job end of April and so I offered to come along, he hasn't thought of a excuse why I shouldn't, yet.
I have no idea about the courses he passed, think one was of the coast of Ireland although Andy Is a commercial pilot, so guess he knows a little about nevigation, you put the details into a GPS and voila
Most people seem to progress by crossing the Atlantic, Andy is planning to sail around Sweden, Norway and possibly Iceland next year.
As teens he sailed dinghies around the coast of Anglesey
Andy was going to do the voyage sola, but I am loosing my job end of April and so I offered to come along, he hasn't thought of a excuse why I shouldn't, yet.
I have no idea about the courses he passed, think one was of the coast of Ireland although Andy Is a commercial pilot, so guess he knows a little about nevigation, you put the details into a GPS and voila
Most people seem to progress by crossing the Atlantic, Andy is planning to sail around Sweden, Norway and possibly Iceland next year.
As teens he sailed dinghies around the coast of Anglesey
Edited by ConwyC on Thursday 16th April 16:46
Fittster said:
Krikkit said:
Out of interest would it be more approachable doing it by coast-hopping up the Atlantic French coast?
It's possible but there are some long stretches which makes a day sailing, hoping ports unfeasible. If the weather isn't kind accessing some of the ports is difficult. People generally take an offshore approach, so at least your aren't being driven to anything too solid.https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/sailing-skills/how...
If you don't want war stories to bore people with at yacht club bars another option is to lower the mast and go via the French canal network (this does depend on the draft of yacht).
Biscay has a reputation, even with the most casual sailors, so I doubt this is an idea that the OP's brother came up with on the spur of the moment.
Krikkit said:
Fittster said:
Krikkit said:
Out of interest would it be more approachable doing it by coast-hopping up the Atlantic French coast?
It's possible but there are some long stretches which makes a day sailing, hoping ports unfeasible. If the weather isn't kind accessing some of the ports is difficult. People generally take an offshore approach, so at least your aren't being driven to anything too solid.https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/sailing-skills/how...
If you don't want war stories to bore people with at yacht club bars another option is to lower the mast and go via the French canal network (this does depend on the draft of yacht).
Biscay has a reputation, even with the most casual sailors, so I doubt this is an idea that the OP's brother came up with on the spur of the moment.
It's doable, but probably better attempting in 3 or 4 legs rather than one hit if you're not experienced off shore... I'd do something like Lagos to Coruna, Coruna to Brest, Brest to North Devon, then on to North Wales. Each leg would take you around 3 days in a 32fter, depending on weather/wind direction. If something does go wrong you're not far from somewhere to pull in to.
Pick your time of year and weather windows - you don't really want to be beating upwind for 3 days across the Bay of Biscay, and you certainly wouldn't want to be doing it after end of August. Last time we crossed was end of May 2018, and we still had 12-15 hours of (unforcast) 30-35 knots, with gusts over 40. We were 3 up on a 45fter (fully set up for off shore racing), and it was downwind, but it was still a bit hairy when the wind picked up from a steady 15-18 to 30 plus in the space of 15 mins... getting the kite down, and putting reefs in, in the middle of the night, with 3-4m seas and horizontal rain isn't much fun even when you know what you're doing.
Having said that, the rest of our delivery trip from Plymouth to Baiona was one of the best sails I've ever had - 3 days 12 hours, all down wind, kite or code 0 up most of the time, beautiful sunshine most of the way, dolphins round the boat for hours on end, great food (pre-cooked on shore, frozen, and then re-heated when needed), and great company.
The stop offs would let you restock food and water, get some good food inside you and also get a good nights sleep... you won't sleep properly on board 2 up as you'll be doing 3 hour watch rotations... if you're not used to off shore you'll be knackered after 24 hours!
Goes without saying you need to make sure the boat is tip top, and you have all the proper safety equipment.
Pick your time of year and weather windows - you don't really want to be beating upwind for 3 days across the Bay of Biscay, and you certainly wouldn't want to be doing it after end of August. Last time we crossed was end of May 2018, and we still had 12-15 hours of (unforcast) 30-35 knots, with gusts over 40. We were 3 up on a 45fter (fully set up for off shore racing), and it was downwind, but it was still a bit hairy when the wind picked up from a steady 15-18 to 30 plus in the space of 15 mins... getting the kite down, and putting reefs in, in the middle of the night, with 3-4m seas and horizontal rain isn't much fun even when you know what you're doing.
Having said that, the rest of our delivery trip from Plymouth to Baiona was one of the best sails I've ever had - 3 days 12 hours, all down wind, kite or code 0 up most of the time, beautiful sunshine most of the way, dolphins round the boat for hours on end, great food (pre-cooked on shore, frozen, and then re-heated when needed), and great company.
The stop offs would let you restock food and water, get some good food inside you and also get a good nights sleep... you won't sleep properly on board 2 up as you'll be doing 3 hour watch rotations... if you're not used to off shore you'll be knackered after 24 hours!
Goes without saying you need to make sure the boat is tip top, and you have all the proper safety equipment.
Chris Stott said:
It's doable, but probably better attempting in 3 or 4 legs rather than one hit if you're not experienced off shore... I'd do something like Lagos to Coruna, Coruna to Brest, Brest to North Devon, then on to North Wales. Each leg would take you around 3 days in a 32fter, depending on weather/wind direction. If something does go wrong you're not far from somewhere to pull in to.
Pick your time of year and weather windows - you don't really want to be beating upwind for 3 days across the Bay of Biscay, and you certainly wouldn't want to be doing it after end of August. Last time we crossed was end of May 2018, and we still had 12-15 hours of (unforcast) 30-35 knots, with gusts over 40. We were 3 up on a 45fter (fully set up for off shore racing), and it was downwind, but it was still a bit hairy when the wind picked up from a steady 15-18 to 30 plus in the space of 15 mins... getting the kite down, and putting reefs in, in the middle of the night, with 3-4m seas and horizontal rain isn't much fun even when you know what you're doing.
Having said that, the rest of our delivery trip from Plymouth to Baiona was one of the best sails I've ever had - 3 days 12 hours, all down wind, kite or code 0 up most of the time, beautiful sunshine most of the way, dolphins round the boat for hours on end, great food (pre-cooked on shore, frozen, and then re-heated when needed), and great company.
The stop offs would let you restock food and water, get some good food inside you and also get a good nights sleep... you won't sleep properly on board 2 up as you'll be doing 3 hour watch rotations... if you're not used to off shore you'll be knackered after 24 hours!
Goes without saying you need to make sure the boat is tip top, and you have all the proper safety equipment.
This is the best advice out of this. Pick your time of year and weather windows - you don't really want to be beating upwind for 3 days across the Bay of Biscay, and you certainly wouldn't want to be doing it after end of August. Last time we crossed was end of May 2018, and we still had 12-15 hours of (unforcast) 30-35 knots, with gusts over 40. We were 3 up on a 45fter (fully set up for off shore racing), and it was downwind, but it was still a bit hairy when the wind picked up from a steady 15-18 to 30 plus in the space of 15 mins... getting the kite down, and putting reefs in, in the middle of the night, with 3-4m seas and horizontal rain isn't much fun even when you know what you're doing.
Having said that, the rest of our delivery trip from Plymouth to Baiona was one of the best sails I've ever had - 3 days 12 hours, all down wind, kite or code 0 up most of the time, beautiful sunshine most of the way, dolphins round the boat for hours on end, great food (pre-cooked on shore, frozen, and then re-heated when needed), and great company.
The stop offs would let you restock food and water, get some good food inside you and also get a good nights sleep... you won't sleep properly on board 2 up as you'll be doing 3 hour watch rotations... if you're not used to off shore you'll be knackered after 24 hours!
Goes without saying you need to make sure the boat is tip top, and you have all the proper safety equipment.
Break it into 3 or 4 legs and take it at your pace rather than do it in one go. You aren't racing. You are sailing across a bay, so whilst some of the Nancy's are playing this up as though it is drake passage in winter. You will be fine with the advice he spelt out and should either of you be feeling it is to much you can stop off.
sisu said:
This is the best advice out of this.
Break it into 3 or 4 legs and take it at your pace rather than do it in one go. You aren't racing. You are sailing across a bay, so whilst some of the Nancy's are playing this up as though it is drake passage in winter. You will be fine with the advice he spelt out and should either of you be feeling it is to much you can stop off.
Not sure why anyone would choose to do this in one hit...Break it into 3 or 4 legs and take it at your pace rather than do it in one go. You aren't racing. You are sailing across a bay, so whilst some of the Nancy's are playing this up as though it is drake passage in winter. You will be fine with the advice he spelt out and should either of you be feeling it is to much you can stop off.
The 3 of us on the delivery trip above have done, between us, 9 Fastnets, 3 Middle Sea races, 3 Caribbean 600's, >50 other 24h+ off shore races and loads of multiple day off shore trips... and our boat is proven off shore.... We wouldn't set out to do Southern Portugal to North Wales non-stop... even without the basic challenges of getting reliable weather forecasts more than a few of days out, or provisioning for 10 days, there's just no point in making life so uncomfortable.
What you say about the Bay is spot on - it's not the Southern Ocean, and as long as you're not attempting it in the winter, you'll be fine. If you get a good weather window, with 10-20knts from the W or SW (prevailing), it will be a very pleasant sail in the summer. The main danger in the Bay is big Atlantic storms pushing in and causing big seas... which aren't common from May to August, and you'd spot them on a forecast easily enough.
ecsrobin said:
I think you may have issues in doing it as a multi leg trip whilst covid19 is going on. Most marinas are closed around Europe aren’t they?
This ^I am based out of Plymouth and the port is effectively closed to all leisure traffic. Marine Police and QHM are stopping vessels in and out.
Fully agree with multi-leg approach. Why do it in a one'r when it is more fun/pleasant/safe to hop?
I've done Lagos, Portugal to Dublin and Gibraltar to Troon Scotland.
On the first trip, in a Moody 40, we coast-hopped up the Portuguese and Spanish coast, and ended up waiting in northern Spain for a weather window to cross Biscay. A factor to consider here is the Nortada, a "sea breeze" which sets in from the NW from mid-morning. Also, there's a contrary current. However, given the present restrictions, I don't think this option is on the cards.
The second trip from Gib', in a Beneteau 47 (or maybe 48) we did it in a one-er from Lagos to Baiona in N Spain, waited for a weather window in Porotsin and crossed Biscay to Crosshaven near Cork.
This is not a trip to be under-estimated. I was given two good pieces of advice: keep well to the west when crossing Biscay; and try to have a fair wind passing Cape Finisterre.
On the first trip, in a Moody 40, we coast-hopped up the Portuguese and Spanish coast, and ended up waiting in northern Spain for a weather window to cross Biscay. A factor to consider here is the Nortada, a "sea breeze" which sets in from the NW from mid-morning. Also, there's a contrary current. However, given the present restrictions, I don't think this option is on the cards.
The second trip from Gib', in a Beneteau 47 (or maybe 48) we did it in a one-er from Lagos to Baiona in N Spain, waited for a weather window in Porotsin and crossed Biscay to Crosshaven near Cork.
This is not a trip to be under-estimated. I was given two good pieces of advice: keep well to the west when crossing Biscay; and try to have a fair wind passing Cape Finisterre.
I don't think anyone would be doing even a direct crossing... I've got a mate with a boat in Lagos marina... according to friends of his who live aboard down there no one is being allowed to leave, never mind come in.
We were due to take another boat down there end of May (a 1st 45 on the delivery leg of the ARC Portugal), then sail them both round the Spanish coast to the Balleaics in the Autumn... but that's stuck in Southampton.
We were due to take another boat down there end of May (a 1st 45 on the delivery leg of the ARC Portugal), then sail them both round the Spanish coast to the Balleaics in the Autumn... but that's stuck in Southampton.
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