Badly mixed music
Discussion
While on lockdown I'm working at home and streaming Radio 2 through headphones. "California Dreamin'" by The Mamas and the Papas was on a few minutes ago. The mixing is dreadful. A load of the tracks are panned left, a load are panned right and the middle is empty. It made my head feel like it was going to pop. I've heard a load of other stuff the same, all older stuff. Was it mixed like that originally or has someone tried to try to increase the width of the stereo field later by panning the high frequencies one way and the low frequencies the other? The effect is horrid!
MitchT said:
While on lockdown I'm working at home and streaming Radio 2 through headphones. "California Dreamin'" by The Mamas and the Papas was on a few minutes ago. The mixing is dreadful. A load of the tracks are panned left, a load are panned right and the middle is empty. It made my head feel like it was going to pop. I've heard a load of other stuff the same, all older stuff. Was it mixed like that originally or has someone tried to try to increase the width of the stereo field later by panning the high frequencies one way and the low frequencies the other? The effect is horrid!
AFAIK that was originally done in mono 1965 cf stereo 45s starting in '68. Might this be an electronically(!) remixed (the horror) stereo version?I looked on Discogs (great resource for the music nerd) and label pictures don't have stereo (or indeed mono) on them.
Even then early stereo stuff can be pretty odd. Mixes would have been individually done and it wasn't really understood what stereo was "for" nor how to use it
IMHO YMMVMitchT said:
While on lockdown I'm working at home and streaming Radio 2 through headphones. "California Dreamin'" by The Mamas and the Papas was on a few minutes ago. The mixing is dreadful. A load of the tracks are panned left, a load are panned right and the middle is empty. It made my head feel like it was going to pop. I've heard a load of other stuff the same, all older stuff. Was it mixed like that originally or has someone tried to try to increase the width of the stereo field later by panning the high frequencies one way and the low frequencies the other? The effect is horrid!
Low frequencies generally have to be in the centre because of the way a stylus works. If you had low frequencies panned far left or right you would lose detail.https://youtu.be/lzRvSWPZQYk?t=463
When stereo was still a relatively new thing (mid 60s and earlier) the producers and engineers hadn’t really figured out how best to use it. It’s quite common in this era to have stuff either panned full right or full left with likely the vocals in the middle; it results in a completely unnatural sound. It’s why many mono recordings of this era are the preferred listening experience.
The Metallica issue is a mastering for CD issue rather than mixing as such. Again many albums of this era are completely ruined by similar such butchery. Unfortunately this is still a thing and still results in many recordings losing most of the dynamics they should have.
The Metallica issue is a mastering for CD issue rather than mixing as such. Again many albums of this era are completely ruined by similar such butchery. Unfortunately this is still a thing and still results in many recordings losing most of the dynamics they should have.
Rod200SX said:
Metallica - Death Magnetic
Absolutely appalling that it was realised as it was. First thing I did when I got it was reduce the volume on it. Was a Rick Rueben album, too.
The top is as per release, the one below is the same song from when it was put on the Guitar Hero game.
It's shameful that this happened. You'd think a band with the budget and creative control of Metallica would have listened to the final product and said "This sucks, do it again". The fact that the Guitar Hero: Metallica versions of the tracks were remixed versions shows you that the original release was terrible. I remember people moaning about the clipping distortion on the guitars when the album was new. The bass guitar is completely buried on the album version too. It's disgraceful for a band of their size and calibre.Absolutely appalling that it was realised as it was. First thing I did when I got it was reduce the volume on it. Was a Rick Rueben album, too.
The top is as per release, the one below is the same song from when it was put on the Guitar Hero game.
Another famous cock-up was Cradle of Filth's "Cruelty and the Beast" album. It does have a cold sound and the drums are very boxy and clicky. I dont think it's bad but it often gets brought up in "bad mixes" discussion. It sounds appropriately cold, given that they're a black metal band. I find it doesn't have the fatiguing harshness that some fizzy sounding black metal albums have. The bass guitar in particular sounds great on this album.
Still, the band were obviously compelled to rectify the problem as they remixed the album last year (more than 20 years after release) but imo this isn't an improvement, all they did was turn the bass frequencies up to make it sound fat but to me it sounds mushy and loses the crispness and separation of instruments from the original release.
And yes, my personal preference for a mix is to have a bass guitar which can be heard as a distinct instrument. A common technique is to blow up the bass frequencies on the guitar and bass drums and cover the bass. People will often say "But you'd miss the bass tracks if they weren't there" and that may be true, but I'd rather just hear the bass guitar along with all the other instruments, thanks.
jet_noise said:
AFAIK that was originally done in mono 1965 cf stereo 45s starting in '68. Might this be an electronically(!) remixed (the horror) stereo version?
Possibly, but I'm amazed that someone managed to do it so badly.gmaz said:
Low frequencies generally have to be in the centre because of the way a stylus works.
And also because that's where they sound best. This is an odd mix though, low frequencies one way, high frequencies the other and nothing in the middle until the middle eighth where a wind instrument appears and is fairly central.Green1man said:
When stereo was still a relatively new thing (mid 60s and earlier) the producers and engineers hadn’t really figured out how best to use it. It’s quite common in this era to have stuff either panned full right or full left with likely the vocals in the middle; it results in a completely unnatural sound.
Tell me about it! Some of the early Beatles stuff is unlistenable through headphones.It ain't just early music, also with a lot of "modern" music being home made when you start listening to it on a decent setup / or headphones it sounds crap.... the over production of the 80's sounds fab, but surely there is a happy medium that's sounds the nuts without costing a million $
As a mix engineer and producer, it's a peril of the job when everybody with a laptop thinks they can mix. Hence treated rooms and varying degrees of reference equipment are utilised.
It's a knowledge and skillset that is easiest acquired on apprenticeship.
But agreed, there's some howlers out there, and whilst the mix may have actually been quite good, due to society and fiscal demands for the "loudness wars", many an album or song have been decimated in the mastering stage (again, something that anyone can now do - just without the knowledge)
It's a knowledge and skillset that is easiest acquired on apprenticeship.
But agreed, there's some howlers out there, and whilst the mix may have actually been quite good, due to society and fiscal demands for the "loudness wars", many an album or song have been decimated in the mastering stage (again, something that anyone can now do - just without the knowledge)
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