Would you take a pay-cut to have permanent remote working?
Discussion
Some suggestion in reporting today that Facebook will allow some staff to permanently work remotely, but in return they have to give up their location, which may be used to feed into salary adjustments dependent on local cost of living.
My regular commute cost works out to a bit over £45 a day, at a company that actively voiced against wfh until the current crisis- I'm now saving that money- but in normal times my travel costs the company around £20k a year, high by most standards, but not unknown. Cost savings by the employer clawing some of that back would be significant.
Obviously offshoring throws up differing costs and salaries by virtue of location, but as a side effect of more common wfh in this country are we going to see salaries adjusted by virtue of the worker's location- the worker hired from Middlesborough to work what was previously a London based role will presumably have vastly different costs to what they would face if living in Clapham.
So, if your company offered you the opportunity to permanently work from home, but deducted the cost of the season ticket, or more, from your pay, would you accept it?
My regular commute cost works out to a bit over £45 a day, at a company that actively voiced against wfh until the current crisis- I'm now saving that money- but in normal times my travel costs the company around £20k a year, high by most standards, but not unknown. Cost savings by the employer clawing some of that back would be significant.
Obviously offshoring throws up differing costs and salaries by virtue of location, but as a side effect of more common wfh in this country are we going to see salaries adjusted by virtue of the worker's location- the worker hired from Middlesborough to work what was previously a London based role will presumably have vastly different costs to what they would face if living in Clapham.
So, if your company offered you the opportunity to permanently work from home, but deducted the cost of the season ticket, or more, from your pay, would you accept it?
oobie38 said:
Some suggestion in reporting today that Facebook will allow some staff to permanently work remotely, but in return they have to give up their location, which may be used to feed into salary adjustments dependent on local cost of living.
My regular commute cost works out to a bit over £45 a day, at a company that actively voiced against wfh until the current crisis- I'm now saving that money- but in normal times my travel costs the company around £20k a year, high by most standards, but not unknown. Cost savings by the employer clawing some of that back would be significant.
Obviously offshoring throws up differing costs and salaries by virtue of location, but as a side effect of more common wfh in this country are we going to see salaries adjusted by virtue of the worker's location- the worker hired from Middlesborough to work what was previously a London based role will presumably have vastly different costs to what they would face if living in Clapham.
So, if your company offered you the opportunity to permanently work from home, but deducted the cost of the season ticket, or more, from your pay, would you accept it?
By travel I assume you mean commuting costs. if so, why does that cost the Company?My regular commute cost works out to a bit over £45 a day, at a company that actively voiced against wfh until the current crisis- I'm now saving that money- but in normal times my travel costs the company around £20k a year, high by most standards, but not unknown. Cost savings by the employer clawing some of that back would be significant.
Obviously offshoring throws up differing costs and salaries by virtue of location, but as a side effect of more common wfh in this country are we going to see salaries adjusted by virtue of the worker's location- the worker hired from Middlesborough to work what was previously a London based role will presumably have vastly different costs to what they would face if living in Clapham.
So, if your company offered you the opportunity to permanently work from home, but deducted the cost of the season ticket, or more, from your pay, would you accept it?
In terms of reduced salary in exchange for WFH...I think that's just another factor in the "Mix" that attracts candidates. Offering the option to WFH will increase the attractiveness of a role which will in turn increase the number of applicants for a particular role. An increased supply of applicants will reduce the salary the company needs to pay to recruit somebody to fill a particular role.
I don't think the company should or would take into account the cost of living per individual. It would be more hassle than it's worth.
For example, London weighting is applied because, generally, it compensates for having to live in expensive London to be near your London office which you're expected to work from. (Whether you actually live in London or somewhere further out and cheaper is irrelevant as there is a cost involved). If you're no longer required to work at the London office then the employer could just change the contractual base from office to home and say they no longer qualify for London weighting. I think that's fair.
Seanseansean said:
Why should you get paid less, when your company is spending less on office space?
Because someone else in a cheaper part of the country will do the same job for less while having the same living standards.Because demand (from employees) will likely outstrip supply (from employers) allowing them to set the terms.
While I'm saving a fair amount of commuting costs during this WFH malarkey I'd rather be in the office at least 3 days a week, as so much banter and knowledge transfer is lost WFH. While I've got a good office setup at home my productivity for certain queries Im running is about 3 times slower, which is really frustrating
As I'd already adjusted my hours to start at 7:15am 22 mins door to door isnt much of a commute and allows you to transition between work & home mode.
Having a Teams Virtual Pub isn't a substitute for working and interacting with colleagues you actually like. So I'll not be opting for a pay cut to WFH permanently.
As I'd already adjusted my hours to start at 7:15am 22 mins door to door isnt much of a commute and allows you to transition between work & home mode.
Having a Teams Virtual Pub isn't a substitute for working and interacting with colleagues you actually like. So I'll not be opting for a pay cut to WFH permanently.
Drezza said:
On a slight tangent, do we think there will be more outsourcing to cheaper labour markets (like India)?
Yes. I made the exact same point on the other WFH thread. If people can do all their work from home, then it can probably be done from someone else's home on another continent. If they can do most of their work from home, then the bit they can't do from home might be able to be assigned to someone else and the rest could be done from someone else's home.Seanseansean said:
Unless you’re getting paid travel, No one should get a pay cut from remote or home working, I really don’t understand this?
Why should you get paid less, when your company is spending less on office space?
Also shouldn't you be paid based on your skill and value to the company rather than where you choose to live?Why should you get paid less, when your company is spending less on office space?
oobie38 said:
Some suggestion in reporting today that Facebook will allow some staff to permanently work remotely, but in return they have to give up their location, which may be used to feed into salary adjustments dependent on local cost of living.
My regular commute cost works out to a bit over £45 a day, at a company that actively voiced against wfh until the current crisis- I'm now saving that money- but in normal times my travel costs the company around £20k a year, high by most standards, but not unknown. Cost savings by the employer clawing some of that back would be significant.
Obviously offshoring throws up differing costs and salaries by virtue of location, but as a side effect of more common wfh in this country are we going to see salaries adjusted by virtue of the worker's location- the worker hired from Middlesborough to work what was previously a London based role will presumably have vastly different costs to what they would face if living in Clapham.
So, if your company offered you the opportunity to permanently work from home, but deducted the cost of the season ticket, or more, from your pay, would you accept it?
Why wouldn't you if you no longer needed and are not paying for a season ticket? No brainer surely.My regular commute cost works out to a bit over £45 a day, at a company that actively voiced against wfh until the current crisis- I'm now saving that money- but in normal times my travel costs the company around £20k a year, high by most standards, but not unknown. Cost savings by the employer clawing some of that back would be significant.
Obviously offshoring throws up differing costs and salaries by virtue of location, but as a side effect of more common wfh in this country are we going to see salaries adjusted by virtue of the worker's location- the worker hired from Middlesborough to work what was previously a London based role will presumably have vastly different costs to what they would face if living in Clapham.
So, if your company offered you the opportunity to permanently work from home, but deducted the cost of the season ticket, or more, from your pay, would you accept it?
TX.
I wouldn't take a pay cut, but it would be a determining factor between a job from home or one where I was expected to be present in an office.
Regarding Facebook, I think their comment is more around the weighting their pay people for living in the Bay area, which is frighteningly expensive. Similar to a person in London and a person in Middlesborough being paid different amounts for doing the same job.
Regarding Facebook, I think their comment is more around the weighting their pay people for living in the Bay area, which is frighteningly expensive. Similar to a person in London and a person in Middlesborough being paid different amounts for doing the same job.
I effectively did this - a reduction in income but not commuting is totally worth it to me. The hours saved per day are hours I can spend with the kids, walking the dog etc. Rather than sitting on a train, paying the train fare, driving to the station, sitting in traffic to get to the train, cramming onto a train with a few hundred flu/cough/cold ridden commuters, standing on a platform waiting for a train in the rain, cold, dark etc. And that is only when they all work on time, you get the days per month when the trains go down etc.. No, totally and utterly worth having less money to not put up with that.
thepeoplespal said:
While I'm saving a fair amount of commuting costs during this WFH malarkey I'd rather be in the office at least 3 days a week, as so much banter and knowledge transfer is lost WFH. While I've got a good office setup at home my productivity for certain queries Im running is about 3 times slower, which is really frustrating
As I'd already adjusted my hours to start at 7:15am 22 mins door to door isnt much of a commute and allows you to transition between work & home mode.
Having a Teams Virtual Pub isn't a substitute for working and interacting with colleagues you actually like. So I'll not be opting for a pay cut to WFH permanently.
It's this for me. Yes we've seen a huge & very quick transition to WFH but what's made it feel seamless is that most of those close working relationships have already been developed. It's a whole other ball game to start a new role in a company completely WFH, it'd be so much harder building those relationships which facilitate knowledge sharing & transparency. Time and again we see efforts to outsource to India etc fail unless it's completely black & white which if that's the case then automation actually works better.As I'd already adjusted my hours to start at 7:15am 22 mins door to door isnt much of a commute and allows you to transition between work & home mode.
Having a Teams Virtual Pub isn't a substitute for working and interacting with colleagues you actually like. So I'll not be opting for a pay cut to WFH permanently.
Also, I've saving circa 45 mins commute time each way but I work at least an hour extra every day, probably more currently, but once we've quietened down and settled into the new norm the work life benefits of this are huge!
Typical day for me.
Leave home 8.15, Drop 2 kids of at school arrive at work around 9.35am.
Work till nearly 6pm and then home around 6.30pm.
Working from home
Wednesday
8am start, Log off 4.30pm. Cooked Tea and pit on my bike at 5pm. Back home at 6.30pm. Eat tea shower and that’s it.
Much better work life balance.
Leave home 8.15, Drop 2 kids of at school arrive at work around 9.35am.
Work till nearly 6pm and then home around 6.30pm.
Working from home
Wednesday
8am start, Log off 4.30pm. Cooked Tea and pit on my bike at 5pm. Back home at 6.30pm. Eat tea shower and that’s it.
Much better work life balance.
I’m currently starting to look for a new job, and I’d definitely accept a slightly lower salary/package for being home-based.
I live on the edge of London and most jobs will require me to commute to the centre. Best case, that’s 40 minutes door to door each way and £2k travel costs, worst case it’s over an hour and £2.5k (if I have to get the tube rather than just the train).
So, I’d say I’d be prepared to take 10-15% less if everything else were equal.
Taking a pay cut from an existing employer is somewhat more emotive, but unfortunately something which may become a reality for more now.
I live on the edge of London and most jobs will require me to commute to the centre. Best case, that’s 40 minutes door to door each way and £2k travel costs, worst case it’s over an hour and £2.5k (if I have to get the tube rather than just the train).
So, I’d say I’d be prepared to take 10-15% less if everything else were equal.
Taking a pay cut from an existing employer is somewhat more emotive, but unfortunately something which may become a reality for more now.
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