15-17k commuter, 320d or Lexus IS300H

[CX53]

Hi all,

The time has come again for me to get a new car.

I do anywhere between 15 and 22,000 miles a year, so want something fairly comfortable, a good drive, and good on fuel.

I will be financing this car so depending on the deal I could go for something slightly more expensive.

The two cars I have been most interested in are the BMW 320d Msport, around 2017. Approved used with 40k miles can be had for around £16,500. Lexus IS300H, similar vintage around the same price, but speaking to the dealer I could knock a fair chuck off, works out a fair bit cheaper. Residuals should be good being a hybrid.

Any thoughts on these two motors? I've driven an older 3 series and tested the lexus which I liked, the cvt is a bit weird but it's a nice drive. BMW probably better suited Image wise as I'm only 28! Lexus customer service has been excellent so far, bmw terrible, and the finance for the lexus will work out around 50 quid a month cheaper as they have cracking APR at the moment. I like the idea of the Lexus as a long term ownership prospect but do worry it coild be thirstier and more boring, even though its just a dull commuter for the, erm, dull commute.


Cheers

[ZX10R NIN]

The IS300 will be worse on fuel but if it is a (spec dependent of course) nicer place to be then it may be worth it,

Vignale I'm a bit bias as I choose one of these (the diesel version) but they're a very nice place to be

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

This is going to be no surprise to some but if you're looking at an IS300h then also look at these, as they're the pick of the hybrids imo, they're a very well put together car & are now part of Nissan group so servicing is simpler:

Q50h Sport but these are a bit more on fuel compared to the IS300/Mondeo

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...


Sport Tech (these come with adaptive cruise 360 cameras etc)

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

I have to say that depreciation will be your biggest cost considering the miles you'll be doing in which case in all honesty I'd be going for a high spec/low mileage car with as little finance as possible whilst still landing a reliable comfortable newish set of wheels.

It's a tricky tight rope but there are few good options:

Q50 Sport as you know these share the same drivetrain as a C220 so can be serviced by any decent Indy.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

Q70 Sport

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

DS5 Prestige

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

Mondeo Vignale

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

[anonymous-user]

CX53 said:

and the finance for the lexus will work out around 50 quid a month cheaper as they have cracking APR at the moment.

Out of curiosity why aren't you going down the personal loan route?

[CX53]

RaymondVanDerDon said:

Out of curiosity why aren't you going down the personal loan route?

So I have the option of giving it back if I've had enough after a few years, without having to deal with privately selling etc.

Not completely against a loan but would probably have to drop the budget and look at older cars. I prefer the newer generation of most cars looks wise as well.

Also, lexus are doing 2.9% at the moment which is as good as any loan I can get. This is what made me look at it as an option initially. I may have to still buy the car at the end and sell privately to change anyway due to mileage, but it does keep the monthly cost down. I'm aware of all of the pros and cons, although I'm sure someone will turn up to turn this in to another pcp hammering thread



Thanks for the links ZX, didn't realise they did a hybrid mondeo.. It looks fantastic! Unsure now they'd be reliability wise vs the Lexus, but I had a mk4 mondeo which was great. It would be nice to have the hybrid petrol vs diesel I think. Not overly sure on the car looks wise, it looks great but I got sick of comments aboit borrowing my dad's car with my old mk4! Infiniti have some interesting and good value offerings, I'm not entirely sold on the looks but definitely something to look in to. Also a good point about getting newest and lowest mileage possible for a good price to help with depreciation.

Edited by CX53 on Saturday 6th June 15:10

[ZX10R NIN]

Hi the Mondeo hybrid seems good reliability wise but a lot of people don't like the CVT gearbox those that have had CVT's in the past see it as a none issue but the CVT does put people off the same as it does some potential IS300h .

Fuel wise my cousin is averaging around 37.9mpg with his Q50h on his commute from Catford to Woking although he's seen this rise to 41.7mpg during covid which I think is pretty decent for a car with a 3.5 engine in comparison my Mondeo Vignale 210 is averaging 50.6mpg (180's are 2-3mpg better than the 210's) the IS300 will be similar on fuel to the Q50h.

So really it comes down to if you don't mind paying extra on fuel for a hybrid, now there is an exception & that's the diesel hybrid DS5:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

I've supplied a few & they've been seeing mid 60's real world.

[rustyuk]

What about an E-Class ?

[gangzoom]

We’ve had an IS300H from new since 2015, and I’ve had a 335i at the same time.

There are some very good points to the IS300H, especially as a commuter car, and for *most* people I think its a great alternative to something like a 320D and why used prices are very solid.

• A true 45-50mpg on unleaded, with no worry about turbos/DPF/timing chains
• £10 VED
• Decent spec on all models, which is simply not true for any BMW
• Very comfy cruiser, you really don’t notice the eCVT system when sitting at M-way speeds
• Good ‘in gear’ performance, its as quick as a 320D off the line and when rolling a bit quicker due to the instant boost of the electric motor.
• Did I mention its reliable!!

However the people on this forum aren’t *most* people when it comes to cars……

Despite been RWD, our IS300H is the MOST benign handling thing I have driven. My old Nissan Leaf had more character/playfulness than our IS300H. Even on light snow, summer tyres, I couldn’t get the thing to do a 180, let alone donuts. The tail 335i on the other hand loved trying to swap ends with the front, and often whilst I was actually trying to go in a straight line .

I cannot find a way to turn off the TC system fully on the IS300H, and even if you can over come the TC system the eCVT will stop any fun. It’s great at getting fuel economy and the noise I don’t mind, its the awful throttle lag couple with totally non linear power delivery which makes you never want to really thrash it. Its hard to describe, its kinda of like turbo lag but unlike turbo lag where you know after the 0.5s delay as the turbos spool up you get a hit of power, the eCVT will sometimes delivery all the torque almost instantly something you wait and wait and wait……So essentially is totally unpredictable when it comes to power delivery, which means its just isn't fun to really push on a B road, its not slow just not fun.

My wife absolutely loves the IS300H for all the points mentioned first, and also for the same points mentioned why it's a 'keeper' which isn't going to be sold for a long long time. She also drove the 335i for a good 8 months daily before getting the IS300H and honestly cannot tell you the difference between the two cars if you asked her, apart from the the fact the 335i was too loud and drank fuel.

However if I had to drive the IS300H daily it would have been sold a long long time ago, despite the fact its a very reliable, sensible, reasonably quick, well specced, and cheap to run car. I would rather go back to my old Leaf as a daily.

Some very rough half arsed timed runs I did when it was new.
https://youtu.be/qd-7ymKI1mg

Edited by gangzoom on Saturday 6th June 18:53

[ZX10R NIN]

There's always the one that's a mix of both & that's the 335i Active Hybrid:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

[colin79666]

Not sure about the BMW but on a Lexus you are looking at 2 services to budget for a year on your mileage.

I’d still take the Lexus though, had an IS as a courtesy car when my CT was last in for a service and it was a really nice place to be. Did 50mpg in the 50 miles or so I had it on a mix of busy dual carriageway and fast A roads.

[KnackeredSwede]

Mazda 3 or 6 with the 2.0 Skyactiv petrol will do 50 mpg, you can get one with about 15,000 miles on for 14 grand, and they do a version with 165 brake. Much better place to put that kind of money considering your annual mileage.

[CX53]

Thanks for the input everyone

Maybe it's just where I'm heading towards 30 but those DS5's look bloody fantastic! Massive though! To be honest, I didn't ever give them a second thought, but good to think outside the box for lower mileage cars which could last a bit longer.

Still looking in to the Infiniti range. I got to see a lot of them when I worked for Red bull racing as they had them on the company car scheme, but most people opted for nissans instead. They look great in a car park full of Qashqais that's for sure. I wonder how easy Nissan can acquire the parts etc..

I have thought about an E class but they're a bit taxi-ish, and the owner of my local hand car wash owns one. That bring said I'm sure they're a lovely cruiser.

The mazda 2.0skyactiv is ridiculously impressive if the MPG figures are accurate, I took notice of them recently when they were mentioned in another thread.

Lots to think about, I still like the lexus and I'm not completely sold on the cheaper diesel options but it's opened up a whole can of worms and I'm sure I'll be sat here browsing and planning test drives for a little while now but as a serial car changer I want to get something to keep for a while now, so it's got to tick all the boxes.

The car I've most enjoyed owning was my MK7 Golf R, but the depreciation is a bit of a killer with my annual mileage, as is the fuel bill even though it was fairly reasonable for the power. I did struggle leaving it in the tesco car park without worrying about dings etc and I was devastated when someone crashed in to it. I think I'd be more comfortable owning something that is slightly more a nice tool for the job than my pride and joy, and if I miss having a P&J I can always put a bit of money aside over time and buy a cheap MR2 or something for the weekends - I've still got to enjoy the daily though!!

[keo]

If you are thinking about a toy/ pride and joy for the weekends. Why not get something boring, cheap but competent for in the week so you won’t lose thousands by putting lots of miles on it. You can get a better toy for the weekend then that won’t lose so much money.

Of course its all personal preference. I’d get a cheap car for the week and a Lotus Elise for weekends.

[CX53]

keo said:

If you are thinking about a toy/ pride and joy for the weekends. Why not get something boring, cheap but competent for in the week so you won’t lose thousands by putting lots of miles on it. You can get a better toy for the weekend then that won’t lose so much money.

Of course its all personal preference. I’d get a cheap car for the week and a Lotus Elise for weekends.

I see your point, but I've got a cheap stbox at the moment and it's horrific spending 2+ hours every working day in it. Money wise it's excellent but it's not good for my sanity. I'd rather run one car to be honest, but if I were to get bored of the daily driver, having a little fun car like an MR2, mx5 etc to chuck around and take away for the weekend seems like quite a nice option.

[ZX10R NIN]

CX53 said:

Thanks for the input everyone

Maybe it's just where I'm heading towards 30 but those DS5's look bloody fantastic! Massive though! To be honest, I didn't ever give them a second thought, but good to think outside the box for lower mileage cars which could last a bit longer.

Still looking in to the Infiniti range. I got to see a lot of them when I worked for Red bull racing as they had them on the company car scheme, but most people opted for nissans instead. They look great in a car park full of Qashqais that's for sure. I wonder how easy Nissan can acquire the parts etc..

I have thought about an E class but they're a bit taxi-ish, and the owner of my local hand car wash owns one. That bring said I'm sure they're a lovely cruiser.

The mazda 2.0skyactiv is ridiculously impressive if the MPG figures are accurate, I took notice of them recently when they were mentioned in another thread.

Lots to think about, I still like the lexus and I'm not completely sold on the cheaper diesel options but it's opened up a whole can of worms and I'm sure I'll be sat here browsing and planning test drives for a little while now but as a serial car changer I want to get something to keep for a while now, so it's got to tick all the boxes.

The car I've most enjoyed owning was my MK7 Golf R, but the depreciation is a bit of a killer with my annual mileage, as is the fuel bill even though it was fairly reasonable for the power. I did struggle leaving it in the tesco car park without worrying about dings etc and I was devastated when someone crashed in to it. I think I'd be more comfortable owning something that is slightly more a nice tool for the job than my pride and joy, and if I miss having a P&J I can always put a bit of money aside over time and buy a cheap MR2 or something for the weekends - I've still got to enjoy the daily though!!

The DS5's are bloody good cars very underrated but once you sit in one you get out impressed.

Servicing & parts (not that any of the ones I've sold have needed anything apart from consumables) has been easy my aunt had hers serviced at Nissan last week with no fuss.

One thing I forgot to mention is that OEM tyres have sound deadening in them making them an expensive replacement but you can just go for a normal tyre.

Parts wise there isn't an issue remember the drivetrain is in the Skyline in Japan & Q50/60 in the USA & other world markets.

[CX53]

ZX10R NIN said:

The DS5's are bloody good cars very underrated but once you sit in one you get out impressed.

Servicing & parts (not that any of the ones I've sold have needed anything apart from consumables) has been easy my aunt had hers serviced at Nissan last week with no fuss.

One thing I forgot to mention is that OEM tyres have sound deadening in them making them an expensive replacement but you can just go for a normal tyre.

Parts wise there isn't an issue remember the drivetrain is in the Skyline in Japan & Q50/60 in the USA & other world markets.

That's really handy to know, thanks. I need to test drive a few cars I think before I make any decisions.

[CX53]

gangzoom said:

We’ve had an IS300H from new since 2015, and I’ve had a 335i at the same time.

There are some very good points to the IS300H, especially as a commuter car, and for *most* people I think its a great alternative to something like a 320D and why used prices are very solid.

• A true 45-50mpg on unleaded, with no worry about turbos/DPF/timing chains
• £10 VED
• Decent spec on all models, which is simply not true for any BMW
• Very comfy cruiser, you really don’t notice the eCVT system when sitting at M-way speeds
• Good ‘in gear’ performance, its as quick as a 320D off the line and when rolling a bit quicker due to the instant boost of the electric motor.
• Did I mention its reliable!!

However the people on this forum aren’t *most* people when it comes to cars……

Despite been RWD, our IS300H is the MOST benign handling thing I have driven. My old Nissan Leaf had more character/playfulness than our IS300H. Even on light snow, summer tyres, I couldn’t get the thing to do a 180, let alone donuts. The tail 335i on the other hand loved trying to swap ends with the front, and often whilst I was actually trying to go in a straight line .

I cannot find a way to turn off the TC system fully on the IS300H, and even if you can over come the TC system the eCVT will stop any fun. It’s great at getting fuel economy and the noise I don’t mind, its the awful throttle lag couple with totally non linear power delivery which makes you never want to really thrash it. Its hard to describe, its kinda of like turbo lag but unlike turbo lag where you know after the 0.5s delay as the turbos spool up you get a hit of power, the eCVT will sometimes delivery all the torque almost instantly something you wait and wait and wait……So essentially is totally unpredictable when it comes to power delivery, which means its just isn't fun to really push on a B road, its not slow just not fun.

My wife absolutely loves the IS300H for all the points mentioned first, and also for the same points mentioned why it's a 'keeper' which isn't going to be sold for a long long time. She also drove the 335i for a good 8 months daily before getting the IS300H and honestly cannot tell you the difference between the two cars if you asked her, apart from the the fact the 335i was too loud and drank fuel.

However if I had to drive the IS300H daily it would have been sold a long long time ago, despite the fact its a very reliable, sensible, reasonably quick, well specced, and cheap to run car. I would rather go back to my old Leaf as a daily.

Some very rough half arsed timed runs I did when it was new.
https://youtu.be/qd-7ymKI1mg

Edited by gangzoom on Saturday 6th June 18:53

Thank you for your write up, it's really good to have a real world owners perspective, as they're not the most common of cars.