stone chips and kerbed wheels!!?!
Discussion
This is in no way indirect advertising but my curiosity has really gotten the better of me and I need to ask you fellow Tuscaneers:
One is selling his immaculate-low miler-high spec-engine rebuilt-full history-beautiful colour-all niggles fixed-2001 Tuscan for an absolutely ridiculous 22K (new car on the way) and people are contacting him and asking about stone chips and kerbed wheels that can be fixed with a couple of hundred quid...
Is one missing something here?!?!
Please...please enlighten me!
One is selling his immaculate-low miler-high spec-engine rebuilt-full history-beautiful colour-all niggles fixed-2001 Tuscan for an absolutely ridiculous 22K (new car on the way) and people are contacting him and asking about stone chips and kerbed wheels that can be fixed with a couple of hundred quid...
Is one missing something here?!?!
Please...please enlighten me!
mercurius said:
This is in no way indirect advertising but my curiosity has really gotten the better of me and I need to ask you fellow Tuscaneers:
One is selling his immaculate-low miler-high spec-engine rebuilt-full history-beautiful colour-all niggles fixed-2001 Tuscan for an absolutely ridiculous 22K (new car on the way) and people are contacting him and asking about stone chips and kerbed wheels that can be fixed with a couple of hundred quid...
Is one missing something here?!?!
Please...please enlighten me!
I see yer point, but I'd ask too... it maybe could be fixed for a couple of hundred quid. But if it hasn't been, why ? (general case here, I'm sure yours is stone chip free!). Its a good question to find out if the owner really cared for the car imho.
same with kerbed wheels...if the bloke can't miss kerbs, christ knows what else he's cocked up/run into.
stu
I would suggest that priced at £22,000 they want the car to be perfect.
You have suggested that £22,000 is ridiculously cheap but if it was it is likey the car would be sold already. There are 45 Tuscan for sale on pistonheads and most of them have been for sale for a long time. In my opinion £22,000 is in the upper range for a 2001 car so the buyer are expecting it to be perfect hence the questions about stone chips. This is only my view from a buyer's perspective.
You have suggested that £22,000 is ridiculously cheap but if it was it is likey the car would be sold already. There are 45 Tuscan for sale on pistonheads and most of them have been for sale for a long time. In my opinion £22,000 is in the upper range for a 2001 car so the buyer are expecting it to be perfect hence the questions about stone chips. This is only my view from a buyer's perspective.
When I sold my Tuscan, I was expecting a similar amount. I was shocked when I reduced and reduced the price in successive weeks. I totally overestimated the market for early Tuscans. I guess if people have £40k to spend on a car they can get a new one with warranty which is perfect. If they have £20k to spend on a car and that is their absolute limit, if they have done their homework they will realise that they are gonna need a bit more that that to keep it running.
Even if you get past that hurdle and find a guy who says 'I have heard the horror stories but I dont care' and then they will have done their homework and will have the knowledge to go over with a fine tooth comb.
There is always the chance you will get lucky. Someone will arrive WITH the funds to buy it, love it and wont care.
I sold my X/2000 Tuscan for £17700, after I spent £1200 sorting out niggles. If I had chance again, I probably would have been better off saving my money, and sorting out a deal based on a realistic cost on getting the niggles sorted, as at the end of the day you will end up doing a deal anyway and dropping your price anyway.
There is also the fact that there is so many out there at the moment there are plenty more cars than buyers. So, to get the deal done as I found out unfortunately it is the seller who needs to do the work, rather than the buyer...
Good luck anyway and I hope you have a more enjoyable experience than I did!
Even if you get past that hurdle and find a guy who says 'I have heard the horror stories but I dont care' and then they will have done their homework and will have the knowledge to go over with a fine tooth comb.
There is always the chance you will get lucky. Someone will arrive WITH the funds to buy it, love it and wont care.
I sold my X/2000 Tuscan for £17700, after I spent £1200 sorting out niggles. If I had chance again, I probably would have been better off saving my money, and sorting out a deal based on a realistic cost on getting the niggles sorted, as at the end of the day you will end up doing a deal anyway and dropping your price anyway.
There is also the fact that there is so many out there at the moment there are plenty more cars than buyers. So, to get the deal done as I found out unfortunately it is the seller who needs to do the work, rather than the buyer...
Good luck anyway and I hope you have a more enjoyable experience than I did!
As it happens, the car is in good cosmetic condition however this is not the point here...
With regards to small marks on the alloys being an indication of careless driving I beg to differ...it is a 4 year old car selling at half the money of its original price; the wheels will not be perfect! I don't think that this means that you have driven onto any other objects at speed -and anyway, if you had you would certainly have to change or replace them in a Tuscan-. My point was that 5 services in 14000 miles and a stack of receipts are far more important than a small stone chip or a mark on the alloy for example.
With regards to the car not selling, I haven't advertised the car for that long and I have turned down offer which I am sure would appear reasonable to some of you, but this is also besides the point...
As far as the price is concerned, I am now certain that I have missed something. Dealers sell similar cars for up to 30K...22K is "the upper end" for 2001 Tuscans now? Since when?!?
Are we shooting ouselves in the foot here people? This is a car that beats Ferraris in performance and looks at a fifth of the price! 45 cars in the Tuscan oriented PH classifieds are not a lot in my opinion. Hell, there are 125 911s! Does that mean that I could pick up a 2001 911 for 22K? (Not that I would want to anyway) Try any other private advertiser (e.g. autotrader) and you will see what I mean. The Tuscan remains a rare and rewarding car, with all the temperament that accompanies her...I have not treated her like a Eurobox when I had her and I will not treat her like one, now that we are parting!
There, I feel much better now!
With regards to small marks on the alloys being an indication of careless driving I beg to differ...it is a 4 year old car selling at half the money of its original price; the wheels will not be perfect! I don't think that this means that you have driven onto any other objects at speed -and anyway, if you had you would certainly have to change or replace them in a Tuscan-. My point was that 5 services in 14000 miles and a stack of receipts are far more important than a small stone chip or a mark on the alloy for example.
With regards to the car not selling, I haven't advertised the car for that long and I have turned down offer which I am sure would appear reasonable to some of you, but this is also besides the point...
As far as the price is concerned, I am now certain that I have missed something. Dealers sell similar cars for up to 30K...22K is "the upper end" for 2001 Tuscans now? Since when?!?
Are we shooting ouselves in the foot here people? This is a car that beats Ferraris in performance and looks at a fifth of the price! 45 cars in the Tuscan oriented PH classifieds are not a lot in my opinion. Hell, there are 125 911s! Does that mean that I could pick up a 2001 911 for 22K? (Not that I would want to anyway) Try any other private advertiser (e.g. autotrader) and you will see what I mean. The Tuscan remains a rare and rewarding car, with all the temperament that accompanies her...I have not treated her like a Eurobox when I had her and I will not treat her like one, now that we are parting!
There, I feel much better now!
Well your absolutely right an early Tuscan offer fantastic bang for your buck. But if yours was priced very low it would have sold very quickly because a dealer would have been around your house with cash the same day. Where did you see a 2001 car up for £30k at a dealer's? Most are at £25K.
The Tuscan is a much better buy than the 911 IMHO. There maybe 125 911's for sale but there was probably 10 times as many made.
Justin is right you may get lucky and find a buyer who hasn't done the research give you the what you want. And your car does look like a very good example. Colour and spec are spot on.
I appreciate is must be very frustrating when you are selling a Tuscan and can't believe how little they are worth. I also find it amazing but that is the market at the moment for lots of different reasons. Notably not many people want to buy privately due to the S6, the arrival of the T2 etc. If you have been offered over £20k I would take it if you are serious about selling. Maybe you should keep it!
I heard recently of a very nice 2001 Red Rose being bought by a dealer for £18k! But don't take my word for it ask Rob Ingleby about Tuscan values-he knows about as much as anyone on the subject.
Good luck with the sale-you're right it is madness!
>> Edited by Greenie on Monday 20th June 18:21
The Tuscan is a much better buy than the 911 IMHO. There maybe 125 911's for sale but there was probably 10 times as many made.
Justin is right you may get lucky and find a buyer who hasn't done the research give you the what you want. And your car does look like a very good example. Colour and spec are spot on.
I appreciate is must be very frustrating when you are selling a Tuscan and can't believe how little they are worth. I also find it amazing but that is the market at the moment for lots of different reasons. Notably not many people want to buy privately due to the S6, the arrival of the T2 etc. If you have been offered over £20k I would take it if you are serious about selling. Maybe you should keep it!
I heard recently of a very nice 2001 Red Rose being bought by a dealer for £18k! But don't take my word for it ask Rob Ingleby about Tuscan values-he knows about as much as anyone on the subject.
Good luck with the sale-you're right it is madness!
>> Edited by Greenie on Monday 20th June 18:21
One in Castle for 28K one in Dream machines for 29K...identical to mine but high milers with no ICE...Sure there are more to back up my figures at the TVR Centre...
I don't want somebody to buy my car because they have not done their research. I want somebody who will say "Wow, I never thought I could have such an immaculate supercar this cheap!"
Thanks for all the feedback guys, it has been useful...although somewhat maddening!
>> Edited by mercurius on Monday 20th June 19:41
I don't want somebody to buy my car because they have not done their research. I want somebody who will say "Wow, I never thought I could have such an immaculate supercar this cheap!"
Thanks for all the feedback guys, it has been useful...although somewhat maddening!
>> Edited by mercurius on Monday 20th June 19:41
But those peple will think it is cheap for a reason?!!!!
Maybe you should put the price up, above, less good examples.
Unlikely strategy, but has worked for some people for other products...
I BET the dealers took those cars you mentioned in REALLY cheaply, they aim to make profit and Have a high'ish screen price, to allow the punter to haggle them down..
BUT in that case you'd need to get the wheels sorted, do not give the buyer ANY excuse to haggle you down, OR put doubts in their mind, about how you've looked after the car. Don't want the people that have done the research to think, scuffed wheels, maybe he also revs the engine from cold, is that why the engine needed a rebuild in the first place,doesn't have a lot of mechanical sympathy....
Not saying you have, just how people think...
THAT is HOW I think when buying a used sports car...
As do I believe many other enthusiasts, peoplewho've done the home work
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Monday 20th June 22:34
Maybe you should put the price up, above, less good examples.
Unlikely strategy, but has worked for some people for other products...
I BET the dealers took those cars you mentioned in REALLY cheaply, they aim to make profit and Have a high'ish screen price, to allow the punter to haggle them down..
BUT in that case you'd need to get the wheels sorted, do not give the buyer ANY excuse to haggle you down, OR put doubts in their mind, about how you've looked after the car. Don't want the people that have done the research to think, scuffed wheels, maybe he also revs the engine from cold, is that why the engine needed a rebuild in the first place,doesn't have a lot of mechanical sympathy....
Not saying you have, just how people think...
THAT is HOW I think when buying a used sports car...
As do I believe many other enthusiasts, peoplewho've done the home work
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Monday 20th June 22:34
I empathise with the selling of the car - but do believe that £22K is a cracking price for a 2001 car, in a strong colour and spec. Having seen the wide variance in condition of 2000/1 model cars, yours may be a good one. I have seen some terrible examples, and then again, some absolute minters. If yours is a good one, it just takes the one person to come and inspect it, and you are away. IMHO, the hardest part is getting a serious buyer to view in the first place. Also, being the type of car that most people buy with the head rather than the heart, and with "spare" money, you may get one or two people thinking, "I love it, but I can't afford it. Nah, you only live once, I should get it if I really want it. No, better not, what happens if something goes wrong." etc etc. It propably depends on where that prospective purchaser ends up in that cycle.
I would also recommend advertising the car in Sprint magazine as well. it costs nothing, but you are more likely to find a good customer, and them a good car, in the pages of the club magazine - enthusiast to enthusiast. I only advertised mine on PHs, and although I was getting calls, there was a heady mix of sensible and serious ringing me and saying stupid things. Broaded your audience, and it improves your chances (as well as a bit of competition between buyers). Good luck with, it looks a nice car.
I would also recommend advertising the car in Sprint magazine as well. it costs nothing, but you are more likely to find a good customer, and them a good car, in the pages of the club magazine - enthusiast to enthusiast. I only advertised mine on PHs, and although I was getting calls, there was a heady mix of sensible and serious ringing me and saying stupid things. Broaded your audience, and it improves your chances (as well as a bit of competition between buyers). Good luck with, it looks a nice car.
Thanks guys for your comments...the one person that came and inspected made an offer the next day...at the price that I am now advertising and at the time refused...again, I do not wish to use the thread to advertise but when you say "any inspection welcome" and offer to knock money off the price towards the cost of ANY mechanical fault that this inspection will yield, it just infuriates me that I have to be asked about marks on the wheels and feel like at 22K someone is doing me a favour to purchase my 2001 low mileage Tuscan! It gets even worse when I feel that this is a situation that we contribute towards as Tuscan owners! Especially with dealers selling at the near 30K mark...it seems a bit defeatist!
Apologies for the frustrated tone of the message and my going on a bit...this seems the most appropriate place to vent it out though!
Apologies for the frustrated tone of the message and my going on a bit...this seems the most appropriate place to vent it out though!
Further to what I said before, I can empathise with your frustration. At £22K it is a craking car for anyones money. However, for a car like the Tuscan, buyers are most likely going to look at a few. As there are many more cars than buyers, from my experience dealers and private buyers have the ability to literally play cars (sellers) off against each other to who wants to sell quickly first.
To add some sense of rationality I would add two points
1) The laws of supply/demand will always apply. i.e. the rarer something is compared to demand it will inflate its price and conversely the more common something is its price is deflated.
2) Something is only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it!! With also:
2a) Actually having the funds for a sale at the time
2b) With the pressure on you as you need the money for your car as time goes on 2a) becomes more important.
Dealers know this. From independant dealers with a 2000 without a rebuild I was offered between £12k - £14k. They can pick and choose their stock from the most desperate sellers. Plus they are looking to make £5k profit from each sale to cover their overheads. Plus they need to cover any liability due to mechanical failures during the warranty period, up to £4k for a rebuild.
What I found is, the asking prices in Autotrader and Pistonheads are just that, asking prices. Sometimes the final figure may be a different story.
To add some sense of rationality I would add two points
1) The laws of supply/demand will always apply. i.e. the rarer something is compared to demand it will inflate its price and conversely the more common something is its price is deflated.
2) Something is only worth what someone is prepared to pay for it!! With also:
2a) Actually having the funds for a sale at the time
2b) With the pressure on you as you need the money for your car as time goes on 2a) becomes more important.
Dealers know this. From independant dealers with a 2000 without a rebuild I was offered between £12k - £14k. They can pick and choose their stock from the most desperate sellers. Plus they are looking to make £5k profit from each sale to cover their overheads. Plus they need to cover any liability due to mechanical failures during the warranty period, up to £4k for a rebuild.
What I found is, the asking prices in Autotrader and Pistonheads are just that, asking prices. Sometimes the final figure may be a different story.
justinp1 said:
What I found is, the asking prices in Autotrader and Pistonheads are just that, asking prices. Sometimes the final figure may be a different story.
Hear hear. can't agree more. And the opposite is also true.
For example when I sold my 300zx TT (1990) most were advertised for around 2.5K, some even cheaper. I knew that these were all import dogs and prices mine at 4K. I sold it in 2 weeks.
Tuscans are a bit like that too. When I was looking for one last year 2000 cars were advertised for 23-26K private and 25-28K in dealers. But I was as likely to find a high priced car was a dog as a low priced one. Folk just see the highest price of a car and advertise theirs for that. Who knows, someone might buy it at the price, but I doubt it. And you don't see what they sell for.
Supply and Demand too.. I wanted a Red Rose. There were enuf Tuscans out there to choose from that I didn't bother with non red roses at all however cheap they were. Same goes for the colour.. it's a car bought with the heart, so colour (interior and exterior) is a very personal taste...what you like, others won't and visaversa.
I agree with others, even last year there were loads of tuscans to choose from and sellers were having trouble selling. This year seems to be even worse. It is a buyers market...an attitude that you are 'doing the buyer a favour' is probably not gonna help imho.
22K seems about right for yours assuming the rebuild is still under warranty (if not I think it matters not one jot that it's had one..mine has had 2 as have many others).
wheels: one of mine is a bit kerbed, the others are mint.. and that's 5 years old.....
But I'd still not be interested last year in your car, as it's not a RR and not my colour. Not picking a fight, just saying it's one of those cars that has to REALLY stand out to get top price, and sometimes that'll be as much about finding the right buyer for his own personal reasons.
Look at JSGs for example.. recent RR conversion, warrantied rebuild, nitron suspension, etc. All on a 2000 and that sold for XX amount (dunno what, but he advertised it at 25K and I doubt he took much less). With the rebuild warrantied and the nitrons it sold for more than a 2001 car probably and rightly so. It was an easy car to sell, but a standard car in the right colour that the right buyer found irrisistable might have made the same money...but you'd probably have had to wait a lot longer for them to come along.
stu
Well, the car is gone at what I perceive to be a bargain 21K. I believe 23K would have been the right price for a private sale but had little time to spare... This was proven by the fact that I had lots of calls...both of the people that saw the car placed an offer...the buyer felt he got a bargain and I will agree...I hope that when the time comes for any Tuscan owner here to sell their car they will not feel fortunate to receive sub-20K offers, provided they have looked after their pride and joy...as I said earlier...don't shoot yourselves in the foot Tuscaneers...you have a special car, treat it like one while you own it and also when the time comes to sell it...all this talk about 14K and 15K is science fiction to me...you are selling a super car, not a hot hatch!
>> Edited by mercurius on Thursday 23 June 17:30
>> Edited by mercurius on Thursday 23 June 17:30
Im thinking of selling my tuscan so found this stuff useful. I remember when i bought it i wanted to pay
as little as i could - now the shoes on the other foot i want to get as much as i can - People asking about kerbed wheels and stone chips are just trying to devalue your car eg you could have an A1 set of alloys
and your clutch is about to go bang ! your alloys may be a bit kerbed but your clutch is A1 - i know which car i want !!!!
as little as i could - now the shoes on the other foot i want to get as much as i can - People asking about kerbed wheels and stone chips are just trying to devalue your car eg you could have an A1 set of alloys
and your clutch is about to go bang ! your alloys may be a bit kerbed but your clutch is A1 - i know which car i want !!!!
You have hit the nail dead-centre on the head...my phone has not stopped ringing with dissapointed potential buyers from all over the country, which shows that 21K for a 2001 model is way, way under value...I am actually thinking of calling the lovely chap who bought my girl and asking him for an extra 2-3K. ;-)
Good luck with the sale.
>> Edited by mercurius on Thursday 23 June 19:42
>> Edited by mercurius on Thursday 23 June 19:42
Good luck with the sale.
>> Edited by mercurius on Thursday 23 June 19:42
>> Edited by mercurius on Thursday 23 June 19:42
Good luck with whatever you buy next. I think you just got the peak of the summer season, as the weather has started to perk up, and people are driving around with their roofs off. I think perhaps I would have got maybe £1000 more at this time than a couple of months ago when I sold mine. I think if mine had had a recent rebuild, it may have been worth £1500-2000 more, this all in all meant that we both got reasonable deals for what we gotfor our cars.
For the record, when I was offered £14k for mine, it was not science fiction, it was from a well respected independant TVR dealer...
For the record, when I was offered £14k for mine, it was not science fiction, it was from a well respected independant TVR dealer...
Glad you got it sold in the end. I think it was for about the right money for such a well looked after car. But the buyer sure does have a lot of car for his £21K. What are you planning to buy with the proceeds? Something nice.
I think Justin is right a recent full rebuild is crucial for the value of these cars. An rebuild 18 month or more ago will seriously dent the value of these car.
I think Justin is right a recent full rebuild is crucial for the value of these cars. An rebuild 18 month or more ago will seriously dent the value of these car.
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