Bruntingthorpe...... not good news
Discussion
Just had a quick scan through the first pages of this board, couldnt find anything so.....
Just seen this go out on Social Media:
Where is an eccentric billionaire aircraft enthuiast when one needs them? If I had a lottery win I'd somehow save the lot.....
Just seen this go out on Social Media:
Post said:
The end of Bruntingthorpe
For months, rumours about the future of Bruntingthorpe airfield (UK) have been buzzing around. Almost coinciding with the COVID-19 lockdown, it was officially announced in April 2020: the curtain has fallen.
The home base of the well-known Cold War Jets Museum and the Lightning Preservation Group was closed and is very unlikely to be re-opened. The site, notorious for these collections and their fast taxi-runs, has found a new owner. The company, Cox Automotive, has bought the premises from the previous owners, C. Walton Ltd. Cox recognises the concern within the aviation community, but indicates that aviation is "not their business".
Mr David Walton, one of the owners of C. Walton Ltd, is currently investigating the construction of new buildings adjacent to the LPG ‘Q Shed’ (QRA – Quick Reaction Alert hangar for their Lightnings). These new buildings are meant to house some of the collection and safeguard their future on land excluded from the Cox Automotive lease. News of any progress on this front will be released by Mr Walton as and when available. As an exception on the closing, it remains the intention of Cox Automotive to hold the planned Cold War Jets Fast Taxi Day in August. Of course subject to the COVID-19 situation at that time.
The change of ownership of the airfield means that most of the aircraft will have to move. This will almost certainly be the deathblow for the larger machines in the collection. Because finding a new home for them is one thing, but funding their disassembly and transport to a new home is something else.
One of the groups active in the Cold War Jets collection is the VC-10 Preservation Group, which has been taking care of VC-10 K4 ZD241 (G-ASGM). In the past five years its volunteers have worked on ZD241 and made it possible to perform fast taxi-runs. Another VC-10, ZA147, resides there too. It is said to be destined for St. Athan. The cost of preserving an aircraft of this size is enormous. Disassembly and road transport can be done, but it’s going to cost GBP 300,000! The deadline is near: ZA147 & ZD241 have been given notice to leave Bruntingthorpe by the end of October 2020.
The Buccaneer Aviation Group, owner of taxiable Buccaneers XW544 and XX894, has even less time: they have to move before the end of September. They have made arrangements to relocate to Kemble, but still need almost GBP 19,000 to get there.
But is there a future for the Victor, the Comet, the Boeing 747, the Nimrod, the Shackleton, and the Super Guppy? Most likely not .... unless a miracle happens, these historic aircrat are destined to be scrapped. Then (again) important examples of Britain’s aviation heritage will be lost for ever.
Source: PPrune, VC-10 Preservation Group
If it is true that St Athan will be taking one of the VC10s (presumably that'll be GJD gaining another exhibit for their new museum) that's some positive, but of course it'll still have to cut to sections as I can't see a private company dismantling it rivet by rivet as the RAF did with the one at Cosford.For months, rumours about the future of Bruntingthorpe airfield (UK) have been buzzing around. Almost coinciding with the COVID-19 lockdown, it was officially announced in April 2020: the curtain has fallen.
The home base of the well-known Cold War Jets Museum and the Lightning Preservation Group was closed and is very unlikely to be re-opened. The site, notorious for these collections and their fast taxi-runs, has found a new owner. The company, Cox Automotive, has bought the premises from the previous owners, C. Walton Ltd. Cox recognises the concern within the aviation community, but indicates that aviation is "not their business".
Mr David Walton, one of the owners of C. Walton Ltd, is currently investigating the construction of new buildings adjacent to the LPG ‘Q Shed’ (QRA – Quick Reaction Alert hangar for their Lightnings). These new buildings are meant to house some of the collection and safeguard their future on land excluded from the Cox Automotive lease. News of any progress on this front will be released by Mr Walton as and when available. As an exception on the closing, it remains the intention of Cox Automotive to hold the planned Cold War Jets Fast Taxi Day in August. Of course subject to the COVID-19 situation at that time.
The change of ownership of the airfield means that most of the aircraft will have to move. This will almost certainly be the deathblow for the larger machines in the collection. Because finding a new home for them is one thing, but funding their disassembly and transport to a new home is something else.
One of the groups active in the Cold War Jets collection is the VC-10 Preservation Group, which has been taking care of VC-10 K4 ZD241 (G-ASGM). In the past five years its volunteers have worked on ZD241 and made it possible to perform fast taxi-runs. Another VC-10, ZA147, resides there too. It is said to be destined for St. Athan. The cost of preserving an aircraft of this size is enormous. Disassembly and road transport can be done, but it’s going to cost GBP 300,000! The deadline is near: ZA147 & ZD241 have been given notice to leave Bruntingthorpe by the end of October 2020.
The Buccaneer Aviation Group, owner of taxiable Buccaneers XW544 and XX894, has even less time: they have to move before the end of September. They have made arrangements to relocate to Kemble, but still need almost GBP 19,000 to get there.
But is there a future for the Victor, the Comet, the Boeing 747, the Nimrod, the Shackleton, and the Super Guppy? Most likely not .... unless a miracle happens, these historic aircrat are destined to be scrapped. Then (again) important examples of Britain’s aviation heritage will be lost for ever.
Source: PPrune, VC-10 Preservation Group
Where is an eccentric billionaire aircraft enthuiast when one needs them? If I had a lottery win I'd somehow save the lot.....
RalphyM said:
Maybe a dumb question but, if they are in fast taxiable condition, what would need to happen for a one off flight to a new home? Presumably in the most benign weather, minimal stress flight plan, etc.
The CAA would still never allow it, the same discussions came up over 558 when VTTS lost the hangar at Robin HoodChemicalChaos said:
RalphyM said:
Maybe a dumb question but, if they are in fast taxiable condition, what would need to happen for a one off flight to a new home? Presumably in the most benign weather, minimal stress flight plan, etc.
The CAA would still never allow it, the same discussions came up over 558 when VTTS lost the hangar at Robin HoodThe Shackleton MR.3 is assured of a future, as they posted on Facebook a few hours ago, that GJD Services team plus volunteers are on site at Brunty this week beginning to dismantle it to move it to the South Wales Aviation Museum at St.Athan.
I feel sorry for the group at Brunty that bought the until recently airworthy DH Venom G-GONE, and only at the beginning of last year bought the ex-Classic Flight Meteor NF.11 which made its retirement flight by Dan Griffth into Brunty in Jan last year to be maintained at Brunty in a fast taxi condition. They could have flown it into Kemble instead!!
There's a Canberra, Sea Vixen, Starfighter and other stuff there as well, which are likely to struggle to find byers or costs for moving to elsewhere. Although the Starfighter was roaded in, so could be roaded out as well again if a new location could be found.
I think the Sea Vixen was close to being taxiable a few years ago, and that's not an easy thing to move despite the foldable wings.
The Victor, Comet & Nimrod are owned by C.Walton, which is why they are looking at building something alongside the Q-Shed for these aircraft, so likely these 3 have a better future than others there.
I feel sorry for the group at Brunty that bought the until recently airworthy DH Venom G-GONE, and only at the beginning of last year bought the ex-Classic Flight Meteor NF.11 which made its retirement flight by Dan Griffth into Brunty in Jan last year to be maintained at Brunty in a fast taxi condition. They could have flown it into Kemble instead!!
There's a Canberra, Sea Vixen, Starfighter and other stuff there as well, which are likely to struggle to find byers or costs for moving to elsewhere. Although the Starfighter was roaded in, so could be roaded out as well again if a new location could be found.
I think the Sea Vixen was close to being taxiable a few years ago, and that's not an easy thing to move despite the foldable wings.
The Victor, Comet & Nimrod are owned by C.Walton, which is why they are looking at building something alongside the Q-Shed for these aircraft, so likely these 3 have a better future than others there.
Edited by aeropilot on Tuesday 16th June 23:16
RalphyM said:
Maybe a dumb question but, if they are in fast taxiable condition, what would need to happen for a one off flight to a new home? Presumably in the most benign weather, minimal stress flight plan, etc.
No chance in hell will the CAA ever give it an air worthy certificate. Think of a massive inconceivable number and multiply it by another massive inconceivable number. Add a few 0’s and still not a chance. (RAF engineer by trade with over 20 years experience on multiple aircraft types, including some (6 months) time working in a PT in the airworthiness and safety cell)
dhutch said:
Such a shame. Presumably they is just no way of taking the wings off a s loading them onto a specialist lowloader? Just too large?
Significant oversimplification, but that's basically all that's needed for the Buccaneer group, and that's still £20k when specialist cranes, road transport, escort etc are taken into account.lufbramatt said:
Elvington is the only place that springs to mind, I know they have taxied the Vulcan at Wellesbourne but I think that airfield has an uncertain future too.
They did fast taxi the Victor a few time at Elvington in the first few years after it arrived, but I'm not sure when they last did it, I have a feeling its been some time now because of other issues at Elivington. I don't thing anything other than the Victor was ever fast taxied at Elvington?As for Wellesbourne, last I heard (Jan this year) was that unlike other venues, the local council were actually pro-aviation and were trying attempting to complusary purchase the airfield in order to keep the aviation businesses going, which would be good news for the Vulcan.
aeropilot said:
lufbramatt said:
Elvington is the only place that springs to mind, I know they have taxied the Vulcan at Wellesbourne but I think that airfield has an uncertain future too.
They did fast taxi the Victor a few time at Elvington in the first few years after it arrived, but I'm not sure when they last did it, I have a feeling its been some time now because of other issues at Elivington. I don't thing anything other than the Victor was ever fast taxied at Elvington?As for Wellesbourne, last I heard (Jan this year) was that unlike other venues, the local council were actually pro-aviation and were trying attempting to complusary purchase the airfield in order to keep the aviation businesses going, which would be good news for the Vulcan.
aeropilot said:
They did fast taxi the Victor a few time at Elvington in the first few years after it arrived, but I'm not sure when they last did it, I have a feeling its been some time now because of other issues at Elivington. I don't thing anything other than the Victor was ever fast taxied at Elvington?
As for Wellesbourne, last I heard (Jan this year) was that unlike other venues, the local council were actually pro-aviation and were trying attempting to complusary purchase the airfield in order to keep the aviation businesses going, which would be good news for the Vulcan.
I thought Wellesbourne had already gone for housing? Could be wrong, but I'm sure there was planning in for it, and maybe already agreed. As for Wellesbourne, last I heard (Jan this year) was that unlike other venues, the local council were actually pro-aviation and were trying attempting to complusary purchase the airfield in order to keep the aviation businesses going, which would be good news for the Vulcan.
Condi said:
aeropilot said:
They did fast taxi the Victor a few time at Elvington in the first few years after it arrived, but I'm not sure when they last did it, I have a feeling its been some time now because of other issues at Elivington. I don't thing anything other than the Victor was ever fast taxied at Elvington?
As for Wellesbourne, last I heard (Jan this year) was that unlike other venues, the local council were actually pro-aviation and were trying attempting to complusary purchase the airfield in order to keep the aviation businesses going, which would be good news for the Vulcan.
I thought Wellesbourne had already gone for housing? Could be wrong, but I'm sure there was planning in for it, and maybe already agreed. As for Wellesbourne, last I heard (Jan this year) was that unlike other venues, the local council were actually pro-aviation and were trying attempting to complusary purchase the airfield in order to keep the aviation businesses going, which would be good news for the Vulcan.
There are still aspects up in the air, but all aviation tennants other the bizarrely the biggest flight school there have been given 1 year lease extensions.......but the council definately wants the place retained for aviation etc not for housing.
See here...
https://www.stratford.gov.uk/planning-building/wel...
MB140 said:
RalphyM said:
Maybe a dumb question but, if they are in fast taxiable condition, what would need to happen for a one off flight to a new home? Presumably in the most benign weather, minimal stress flight plan, etc.
No chance in hell will the CAA ever give it an air worthy certificate. Think of a massive inconceivable number and multiply it by another massive inconceivable number. Add a few 0’s and still not a chance. (RAF engineer by trade with over 20 years experience on multiple aircraft types, including some (6 months) time working in a PT in the airworthiness and safety cell)
I imagine there would be volunteers to fly them, so over the sea and non residential areas would mitigate risk? I realise it's a moot point I'm sure the vast majority would get there!
DKL said:
I know nothing about planes but reading the above and I've seen one or two things about aircraft who's lifespan has been reached and are now grounded, but flew there. Are these things actually not capable of flight or is it just that the potential risks of airframe or systems failure and the resulting fallout is deemed too great?
I imagine there would be volunteers to fly them, so over the sea and non residential areas would mitigate risk? I realise it's a moot point I'm sure the vast majority would get there!
You wont get too many volunteers to fly something that isn't airworthy, and the CAA aren't going to allow it anyway.I imagine there would be volunteers to fly them, so over the sea and non residential areas would mitigate risk? I realise it's a moot point I'm sure the vast majority would get there!
They are out of airworthy lifed parts......yes, technically the ones that have been maintained to anti-det procedures for all these years could technically take-off and might even stay in the air long enough to land again......might. If you could find a pilot/crew stupid enough to risk it of course.........
The idea of over the sea to mitigate risk is not relevant because Brunty isn't exactly near the sea.......
aeropilot said:
You wont get too many volunteers to fly something that isn't airworthy, and the CAA aren't going to allow it anyway.
I wondered if volunteers may feel the vehicle they have worked on is airworthy and hence they might be happy to fly it, whereas the CAA wouldn't pass it because of ...... lots of things that may not actually be relevant to that individual aircraft.aeropilot said:
They are out of airworthy lifed parts......
Again maybe said parts could be remade and fine but not certified in the way they need to be.aeropilot said:
yes, technically the ones that have been maintained to anti-det procedures for all these years could technically take-off and might even stay in the air long enough to land again......might. If you could find a pilot/crew stupid enough to risk it of course.........
Sort of as above. I suppose I'm aiming it at are the CAA decisions always "correct" purely on that individual aircraft or because that age/type simply can't pass the regs so they don't come and look. A bit like trying to get an Austin 7 through a rolling road brake test. It isn't going to happen but that car can stop (eventually).aeropilot said:
The idea of over the sea to mitigate risk is not relevant because Brunty isn't exactly near the sea.......
Fair point, they may need to divert!I realise this is entirely theoretical as they have to pass the CAA regs, that's the rules ( and for good reason) but if we are talking about the last one of a design its a shame to lose it on a technicality.
On another point might you be a person to advise on redesigning garage roof trusses to give more space?
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