GT4 manual or PDK
Discussion
I have spec'd a new one for spring 2021 delivery, didnt see or didnt know that PDK was available on the 718 GT4.
I know lots of people have some different opinions on this matter but interested to know whether its 50/50 manual/pdk or more people would spec pdk than manual now that its available.
I have had various 911's including a 996RS - manual as thats all they made and a 991RS PDK, current boxster S is pdk and to be honest I am on the fence as to whether I want to go back to manual or not on basically a track car. (I do have one manual car still which is nice to drive ) hey maybe it old age or laziness but its easier to live with on a day to day and its quicker on track,
it will make the car heavier again as well, but also something different in a digital world, ???
GT4 is planned as a keeper long term but wonder what people will look for in years to come. 996/998 tiptronics are less desirable than manuals, but PDK is good.
cheers all
scott.
I know lots of people have some different opinions on this matter but interested to know whether its 50/50 manual/pdk or more people would spec pdk than manual now that its available.
I have had various 911's including a 996RS - manual as thats all they made and a 991RS PDK, current boxster S is pdk and to be honest I am on the fence as to whether I want to go back to manual or not on basically a track car. (I do have one manual car still which is nice to drive ) hey maybe it old age or laziness but its easier to live with on a day to day and its quicker on track,
it will make the car heavier again as well, but also something different in a digital world, ???
GT4 is planned as a keeper long term but wonder what people will look for in years to come. 996/998 tiptronics are less desirable than manuals, but PDK is good.
cheers all
scott.
LunarOne said:
I'm a big fan of manual cars and my Boxster S is manual and I spent lots of time hunting down the perfect manual car. But I'm not a track driver. If you're going to be putting it on track regularly then I'd go PDK. If it's a weekend road car then I'd go manual.
Agree to a point, but depends what you mean by track car. If racing or doing competitive events then no argument - go for PDK.If all you do are non competitive track days then I would still have a manual box. Yes, the car will be slighter slower but I get more satisfaction getting the best from a manual car than letting the computer in the gearbox do it for me.
Hear what you are saying but comparing to old tech to new doesn't really hold up, the tips are far and away removed from PDK.
Some people get all emotional over 'its only a drivers car if its manual', others simply don't. As for predicting the future we're back to spec the car for yourself and enjoy it, no-one can know what will prove more popular in years to come. Either way enjoy what you choose.
For me driving a PDK Porsche the car 'knows' what gear I want and changes faster than I ever could, and if I don't agree with the gear its in can flick it up or down as I please, no hardship whatsoever. But, it's not a track toy, then again if it was I'd be wanting to be more concerned with steering than with what gear I'm in, and yes I'm well aware of weight transfer, balance, acceleration etc.
If you want to purchase and want the car to appeal to the maximum PH audience/approval go for a manual. For maximum personal enjoyment only you can decide. IMHO, and yes I'm well aware of the irony of IMHO
Some people get all emotional over 'its only a drivers car if its manual', others simply don't. As for predicting the future we're back to spec the car for yourself and enjoy it, no-one can know what will prove more popular in years to come. Either way enjoy what you choose.
For me driving a PDK Porsche the car 'knows' what gear I want and changes faster than I ever could, and if I don't agree with the gear its in can flick it up or down as I please, no hardship whatsoever. But, it's not a track toy, then again if it was I'd be wanting to be more concerned with steering than with what gear I'm in, and yes I'm well aware of weight transfer, balance, acceleration etc.
If you want to purchase and want the car to appeal to the maximum PH audience/approval go for a manual. For maximum personal enjoyment only you can decide. IMHO, and yes I'm well aware of the irony of IMHO
Do we need another PDK vs manual thread ?
This is the best manual vid for sure.
https://youtu.be/oaUCdAdaaj8
Also Randy Pobst puts it in a nut shell, easier to drive fast, and allows a ave driver to drive like a pro driver.
It's the wannabe gear box option, that simple, if you wannabe fast but lack the skillset and lets face it don't like enjoy driving and a bit lazy, the PDK is a great box to do it all for you.
Then in his manual GT3 vid he states "You need the manual gearbox to get the whole experience"
I would liken it to taking up golf, but taking Tiger woods with you, you can go along for the walk while he plays your shots and allows you to say you have a zero handycap.
Lets not forget you also remove the E-diff help in the manual also, it gets swaped for a real diff, also less RWS, and due to no PDK the cars better balanced than the 3RS in the same way the 3RS is better balanced than the 2RS.
The manual 991.2 GT3 is the perfect driving machine with the perfect engine, it's also atm the fastest car in gear and puts the most BHP to the ground and if Vmax is you thing it's also the fastest GT3 ever made if you want a car that can do 200mph and want to wear that cap the manual GT3 will do that also.
I love the 3RS, the looks, the tech , the lap time, but would only own one as part of a fleet or if I had a garage at the ring and a 3RS to use there to get the times.
I actually don't understand what drives the buyer to own the automatic car, but that's a problem on my part and one maybe I'll never understand.
To end off then every serious review by the people we have grown up with wants the manual car.
Motor trend did a best 991 911 feature not long ago, again the manual GT3 tops the list and is worth a read why.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/best-991-porsche-9...
to quote the last section:
"To summarize what I've been saying since 2017, and enthusiastically restating every single time I'm lucky enough to wheel a 991.2 manual GT3, it's basically the best car ever made. It has an intoxicating engine that rip-snorts to 9,000 rpm without the need of forced induction, 500 Porsche horsepower—meaning it's able to beat up on cars making much, much more power—and steering on loan from the gods. Everything about this 911 is glorious. Even and especially that big wing."
This is the best manual vid for sure.
https://youtu.be/oaUCdAdaaj8
Also Randy Pobst puts it in a nut shell, easier to drive fast, and allows a ave driver to drive like a pro driver.
It's the wannabe gear box option, that simple, if you wannabe fast but lack the skillset and lets face it don't like enjoy driving and a bit lazy, the PDK is a great box to do it all for you.
Then in his manual GT3 vid he states "You need the manual gearbox to get the whole experience"
I would liken it to taking up golf, but taking Tiger woods with you, you can go along for the walk while he plays your shots and allows you to say you have a zero handycap.
Lets not forget you also remove the E-diff help in the manual also, it gets swaped for a real diff, also less RWS, and due to no PDK the cars better balanced than the 3RS in the same way the 3RS is better balanced than the 2RS.
The manual 991.2 GT3 is the perfect driving machine with the perfect engine, it's also atm the fastest car in gear and puts the most BHP to the ground and if Vmax is you thing it's also the fastest GT3 ever made if you want a car that can do 200mph and want to wear that cap the manual GT3 will do that also.
I love the 3RS, the looks, the tech , the lap time, but would only own one as part of a fleet or if I had a garage at the ring and a 3RS to use there to get the times.
I actually don't understand what drives the buyer to own the automatic car, but that's a problem on my part and one maybe I'll never understand.
To end off then every serious review by the people we have grown up with wants the manual car.
Motor trend did a best 991 911 feature not long ago, again the manual GT3 tops the list and is worth a read why.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/best-991-porsche-9...
to quote the last section:
"To summarize what I've been saying since 2017, and enthusiastically restating every single time I'm lucky enough to wheel a 991.2 manual GT3, it's basically the best car ever made. It has an intoxicating engine that rip-snorts to 9,000 rpm without the need of forced induction, 500 Porsche horsepower—meaning it's able to beat up on cars making much, much more power—and steering on loan from the gods. Everything about this 911 is glorious. Even and especially that big wing."
Edited by Porsche911R on Wednesday 9th September 09:03
Porsche911R said:
Hang on. Hang on. This totally contradicts all your criticism of the gearing in the manual GT4, and I thought you said the GT4 with the PDK box and shorter ratios would be the better car?
julian987R said:
Please no more PDK v Manual debate. Close this thread down!!!!
Main points of discussion are as follows:- Yay! PDK
- Boo! PDK
- Manual is best
- No its not, PDK is better because its faster
- Faster does not equal better
- PDK is a manual too!
- No its not
- Yes it is
Porsches PDK as a semi auto box has not really dated but if you are planning the GT4 to be a long term keeper bearing in mind the likely technological advances over the next few years the PDK box will age quicker than the manual.
Basically auto boxes date manual boxes do not.
Having had many Porsche GTs both manual and PDK (S) the manual cars offer the far better driving experience at every conceivable level whether 911 or Cayster. Any 10 year old kid could drive a flappy paddle car where each pull of the lever is identical to the last and next.....not so a manual.
Basically auto boxes date manual boxes do not.
Having had many Porsche GTs both manual and PDK (S) the manual cars offer the far better driving experience at every conceivable level whether 911 or Cayster. Any 10 year old kid could drive a flappy paddle car where each pull of the lever is identical to the last and next.....not so a manual.
All i would say is pdk gives best of both worlds. Stick pdk into manual and works like a sequential box . Gives you that touring car experience.. or use the paddles and suddenly your in a f1 car.whats not to like.
I must say the sequential gear changes are much better and rev matches too.
I must say the sequential gear changes are much better and rev matches too.
av185 said:
Porsches PDK as a semi auto box has not really dated but if you are planning the GT4 to be a long term keeper bearing in mind the likely technological advances over the next few years the PDK box will age quicker than the manual.
Basically auto boxes date manual boxes do not.
Having had many Porsche GTs both manual and PDK (S) the manual cars offer the far better driving experience at every conceivable level whether 911 or Cayster. Any 10 year old kid could drive a flappy paddle car where each pull of the lever is identical to the last and next.....not so a manual.
1 sentence you say pdk hasnt really dated then say auto boxes date?Basically auto boxes date manual boxes do not.
Having had many Porsche GTs both manual and PDK (S) the manual cars offer the far better driving experience at every conceivable level whether 911 or Cayster. Any 10 year old kid could drive a flappy paddle car where each pull of the lever is identical to the last and next.....not so a manual.
The pdk in the 911 and caysters was designed for them unlike the the rest of the porsche range which is Audi box relabelled pdk.
Porsches pdk is years ahead and only gets tweaks as its that good. No limit on launch controls etc
Rojibo said:
Hang on. Hang on.
This totally contradicts all your criticism of the gearing in the manual GT4, and I thought you said the GT4 with the PDK box and shorter ratios would be the better car?
If you want to quote me, I said "the GT4 manual box is Sooooo longgggg MAYBE JUST MAYBE the PDK in the GT4 will be the better choice."This totally contradicts all your criticism of the gearing in the manual GT4, and I thought you said the GT4 with the PDK box and shorter ratios would be the better car?
It's a very hard choice on that model as even pressing a button in the GT4 WITH PDK is doing more work than leaving the manual GT4 in 3rd gear !!
To a point I have looked at the 718 GT4 and GTS and the PDK cars and cannot order either car, for £100k it's flawed and I don't think I could own a PDK Variant myself.
On track the PDK GT4 will be buzzing a lot of cars no doubt. Depends what you want from the car.
tedblog said:
1 sentence you say pdk hasnt really dated then say auto boxes date?
The pdk in the 911 and caysters was designed for them unlike the the rest of the porsche range which is Audi box relabelled pdk.
Porsches pdk is years ahead and only gets tweaks as its that good. No limit on launch controls etc
Save your breath ,the manual guys are always right and the worlds greatest drivers who know everything .The pdk in the 911 and caysters was designed for them unlike the the rest of the porsche range which is Audi box relabelled pdk.
Porsches pdk is years ahead and only gets tweaks as its that good. No limit on launch controls etc
v8ksn said:
Main points of discussion are as follows:
:-( you have ruined 32 pages of debate.....even though the 1st 6 have already been covered lol- Yay! PDK
- Boo! PDK
- Manual is best
- No its not, PDK is better because its faster
- Faster does not equal better
- PDK is a manual too!
- No its not
- Yes it is
franki68 said:
Save your breath ,the manual guys are always right and the worlds greatest drivers who know everything .
....and there it is! The first person to take offence and get all butt-hurt because someone prefers a manual gearbox to a PDK.It's ALWAYS a PDK fan who takes offence at their gearbox choice. Just be happy with what you have!
If YOU buy a PDK or Manual with YOUR money that YOU earned then YOU should be happy with YOUR choice and forget what anyone else thinks!
v8ksn said:
....and there it is! The first person to take offence and get all butt-hurt because someone prefers a manual gearbox to a PDK.
It's ALWAYS a PDK fan who takes offence at their gearbox choice. Just be happy with what you have!
If YOU buy a PDK or Manual with YOUR money that YOU earned then YOU should be happy with YOUR choice and forget what anyone else thinks!
Err maybe read all my other posts on the subject before reaching your wrong conclusion .It's ALWAYS a PDK fan who takes offence at their gearbox choice. Just be happy with what you have!
If YOU buy a PDK or Manual with YOUR money that YOU earned then YOU should be happy with YOUR choice and forget what anyone else thinks!
I really don’t care what such people think but I do care about the frankly crap advice they give to people seeking help on here.
Its horses for courses . Auto for me as its just easy to do everything but when i want to get involved its that too.
Auto boxes are so good now unlike the old days with 4 plus overdrive. Changes seamless now .plus cant overrev.
Have autoblipper on my bike . Thought was gimmick but so much better for track days gives me less things to worry about at speed but thats my choice.
Best thing is to do a pec day and try both and make your desision from that.
Auto boxes are so good now unlike the old days with 4 plus overdrive. Changes seamless now .plus cant overrev.
Have autoblipper on my bike . Thought was gimmick but so much better for track days gives me less things to worry about at speed but thats my choice.
Best thing is to do a pec day and try both and make your desision from that.
franki68 said:
Err maybe read all my other posts on the subject before reaching your wrong conclusion .
I really don’t care what such people think but I do care about the frankly crap advice they give to people seeking help on here.
Apologies if I caused offence or got the wrong end of the stick I really don’t care what such people think but I do care about the frankly crap advice they give to people seeking help on here.
I've said it recently in the Would you go back to a manual thread. I've said it in the Is the Alpine A110 dead thread. I've said it in countless other threads.
When you want to be the fastest, whether that's doing quarter mile runs or on track days or flying round the 'ring, then PDK is clearly a fantastic choice. When your driving is all about speed. And it's absolutely a valid choice if you have to use the car to commute in city traffic. And it's a valid choice if you have had a leg amputated. Hell, it's even a valid choice if you just prefer the car to change gear for you!
But none of those apply to me. I do my driving on the mostly free flowing but often congested roads of Surrey and Berkshire. And I drive into London maybe 15-20 times a year. And once or twice a year, I drive down to Southern Europe where I seek out mountainous roads. In all of these conditions and especially the latter, having a manual just makes the driving itself joyous. Choosing the correct gear, executing the gear change perfectly and slingshotting out of a bend while the exhaust reverberates off the rock makes me feel on top of the world. But it's not the speed that gives me thrills - it's the interaction with the car and getting it just right. It's like making all the right decisions to solve a Rubik's cube. Yes it's amazing to see one of those computers solve it in seconds, but it's surely much more fun and engaging to solve it yourself. I wouldn't know for sure though because I can't solve one. I'm sure in 100 years time changing gears with a lever and a clutch will seem just as antiquated as shovelling coal into a steam locomotive to go faster, seems to us. But most of us only have a few years left of driving internal combustion engined cars with manual controls. And I want to enjoy every last second of doing it the old-fashioned way. And yet, I don't consider myself more of a driving enthusiast than someone who loves to drive but prefers the car to execute gearchanges. That would be just as absurd as saying people who prefer starter motors over cranking handles are not as enthusiastic about their driving.
When you want to be the fastest, whether that's doing quarter mile runs or on track days or flying round the 'ring, then PDK is clearly a fantastic choice. When your driving is all about speed. And it's absolutely a valid choice if you have to use the car to commute in city traffic. And it's a valid choice if you have had a leg amputated. Hell, it's even a valid choice if you just prefer the car to change gear for you!
But none of those apply to me. I do my driving on the mostly free flowing but often congested roads of Surrey and Berkshire. And I drive into London maybe 15-20 times a year. And once or twice a year, I drive down to Southern Europe where I seek out mountainous roads. In all of these conditions and especially the latter, having a manual just makes the driving itself joyous. Choosing the correct gear, executing the gear change perfectly and slingshotting out of a bend while the exhaust reverberates off the rock makes me feel on top of the world. But it's not the speed that gives me thrills - it's the interaction with the car and getting it just right. It's like making all the right decisions to solve a Rubik's cube. Yes it's amazing to see one of those computers solve it in seconds, but it's surely much more fun and engaging to solve it yourself. I wouldn't know for sure though because I can't solve one. I'm sure in 100 years time changing gears with a lever and a clutch will seem just as antiquated as shovelling coal into a steam locomotive to go faster, seems to us. But most of us only have a few years left of driving internal combustion engined cars with manual controls. And I want to enjoy every last second of doing it the old-fashioned way. And yet, I don't consider myself more of a driving enthusiast than someone who loves to drive but prefers the car to execute gearchanges. That would be just as absurd as saying people who prefer starter motors over cranking handles are not as enthusiastic about their driving.
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