Chassis ground points - stainless steel bolts OK?
Discussion
I’m not sure but I’d use bare coated with grease or valasine afterwards as a protector that’s easy to wipe away when looking for faults.
I replaced my front o/s chassis bolt a few years ago as it was very rusty so cleaned up wiring connections and used copper grease down the threads. All earths worked ok and then some 4 years later when removing the body that bolt came out good and grease was still very evident on threads.
Not sure if that was good practice but I had no wiring issues.
I replaced my front o/s chassis bolt a few years ago as it was very rusty so cleaned up wiring connections and used copper grease down the threads. All earths worked ok and then some 4 years later when removing the body that bolt came out good and grease was still very evident on threads.
Not sure if that was good practice but I had no wiring issues.
Any miniscule difference in conductivity is far outweighed by it being a bright shiny new bolt, bright shiny clean rings and area around the threaded insert, and all the above slathered in Copaslip. In fact, the bolt could be plastic and the rings would still earth as a stack.
Go for it!
Go for it!
The area where the stainless steal is in contact with a different steel will corrode
The electrical conductor properties of stainless steel won't be a problem because as everything else, resistance is calculated over length and you won't be relying on a length of stainless steel to conduct electricity
No don't use it, stainless is great but does cause corrosion where it is in contact with other metals
The electrical conductor properties of stainless steel won't be a problem because as everything else, resistance is calculated over length and you won't be relying on a length of stainless steel to conduct electricity
No don't use it, stainless is great but does cause corrosion where it is in contact with other metals
Penelope Stopit said:
No don't use it, stainless is great but does cause corrosion where it is in contact with other metals
Speaking from experience, I have had no issues using stainless nuts on mild steel studs welded to the chassis or stainless bolts into mild steel nuts welded to the chassis.Not an issue if Copaslip is used... not to be confused with lesser quality 'copper based greases'. Copaslip will even prevent corrosion on stainless bolts into aluminium castings eg motorcycle engine cases, which can be a really serious issue if used dry.
I (unfortunately) have no shares in Copaslip... although I do feel as though I have bought the company several times over in my 40 years of using it!
I (unfortunately) have no shares in Copaslip... although I do feel as though I have bought the company several times over in my 40 years of using it!
TwinKam said:
Any miniscule difference in conductivity is far outweighed by it being a bright shiny new bolt, bright shiny clean rings and area around the threaded insert, and all the above slathered in Copaslip. In fact, the bolt could be plastic and the rings would still earth as a stack.
Go for it!
Go for it!
TwinKam said:
Not an issue if Copaslip is used... not to be confused with lesser quality 'copper based greases'. Copaslip will even prevent corrosion on stainless bolts into aluminium castings eg motorcycle engine cases, which can be a really serious issue if used dry.
I (unfortunately) have no shares in Copaslip... although I do feel as though I have bought the company several times over in my 40 years of using it!
Yes, agreeI (unfortunately) have no shares in Copaslip... although I do feel as though I have bought the company several times over in my 40 years of using it!
Plenty of Copaslip will do the job
As long as there is no chance of water getting into any of the bolted up faces or on any part of the nut and bolt
Galvanic corrosion takes place when moisture gets in
This brings about another question
Q. Is it worth using stainless steel bolts for earth points?
A. No, there is nothing to gain from using stainless steel bolts for earth points due to them having to be fully covered in Copaslip just like a steel bolt needs to be covered in Copaslip
Having worked most of my life in design, engineering and manufacture for MOD contracts it has always been a requirement to use Duralac on all dissimilar metal interfaces.
On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
Steve, above, introduces a key word, 'interfaces'. This is key. This is where the Copaslip/ Duralec needs to be; out of sight, doing its job between various dissimilar metals. There is no point greasing over the top of the bolt head etc... apart from to attract dirt, if that is really what you want.
A shiny stainless bolt head is a thing of beauty, so let it shine and bring some bling, glitz and glamour.
A shiny stainless bolt head is a thing of beauty, so let it shine and bring some bling, glitz and glamour.
TwinKam said:
Steve, above, introduces a key word, 'interfaces'. This is key. This is where the Copaslip/ Duralec needs to be; out of sight, doing its job between various dissimilar metals. There is no point greasing over the top of the bolt head etc... apart from to attract dirt, if that is really what you want.
A shiny stainless bolt head is a thing of beauty, so let it shine and bring some bling, glitz and glamour.
Have you any conductive Copaslip to give away?A shiny stainless bolt head is a thing of beauty, so let it shine and bring some bling, glitz and glamour.
Don't need much
Thanks Gents, I went with all stainless in the end and I'll use copperslip and a bit of Vaseline on them. Ordered after the first reply and before a few suggested using regular bolts so I'll have to hope it works alright!
Steve_D said:
Having worked most of my life in design, engineering and manufacture for MOD contracts it has always been a requirement to use Duralac on all dissimilar metal interfaces.
On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
Steve this has me a bit worried as I've got A2 stainless screws going into A2 stainless nuts at the moment, should I change the nuts for A4 or something else?On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
TwinKam said:
Pop round and I'll brush it over your nads, then connect my trembler coil to them... if it's such a good insulator, you shouldn't feel a thing 
Can assure you that there won't be any clips in your workshop big enough to clip to my ballsMoving on
If you've been coating connector surfaces with Copaslip, have a think about what you're not achieving
Shed TVR said:
Thanks Gents, I went with all stainless in the end and I'll use copperslip and a bit of Vaseline on them. Ordered after the first reply and before a few suggested using regular bolts so I'll have to hope it works alright!
Don't be concerned, as TwinKam has commented, plenty of Copaslip will do the job. Don't put it on the surfaces that the terminals come into contact with and don't put it on the terminals, get it on the threads to stop gallingSteve_D said:
Having worked most of my life in design, engineering and manufacture for MOD contracts it has always been a requirement to use Duralac on all dissimilar metal interfaces.
On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
Steve this has me a bit worried as I've got A2 stainless screws going into A2 stainless nuts at the moment, should I change the nuts for A4 or something else?On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
Shed TVR said:
Thanks Gents, I went with all stainless in the end and I'll use copperslip and a bit of Vaseline on them. Ordered after the first reply and before a few suggested using regular bolts so I'll have to hope it works alright!
I had always known about stainless steel Galling but experienced it in person when we came to remove a customers 'bunch of bananas' exhaust system. we knew it had not been on there very long (months) but ended up shearing around half of the fixings (bolt and nyloc nut).Steve_D said:
Having worked most of my life in design, engineering and manufacture for MOD contracts it has always been a requirement to use Duralac on all dissimilar metal interfaces.
On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
Steve this has me a bit worried as I've got A2 stainless screws going into A2 stainless nuts at the moment, should I change the nuts for A4 or something else?On the same theme the worst thing you can do is use the same grade stainless for both the nut and bolt. The result of using the same is something called 'Galling' where the two materials actually cold weld together.
Steve
I was really concerned at how quickly they had failed so called in a favour where I used to work and had a sample sectioned in the metallurgy laboratory. I still have the test sample on my desk.
The report came back confirming galling and suggesting the A2/A4 mix.
In the sample you can only just make out the threads. If you did not know you were holding a nut you would likely not spot the threads.
Steve
Penelope Stopit said:
blah blah
If you've been coating connector surfaces with Copaslip, have a think about what you're not achieving
Not achieving corrosion.If you've been coating connector surfaces with Copaslip, have a think about what you're not achieving
Not achieving galling.
Not achieving seizures.
Not achieving electrical fails.
Not achieving earth faults.
Not acheiving unhappy customers.
All this, sustained over 40+ years working professionally on everything from classic to modern cars & 'bikes.
Now that is quite an achievement.
TwinKam said:
Penelope Stopit said:
blah blah
If you've been coating connector surfaces with Copaslip, have a think about what you're not achieving
Not achieving corrosion.If you've been coating connector surfaces with Copaslip, have a think about what you're not achieving
Not achieving galling.
Not achieving seizures.
Not achieving electrical fails.
Not achieving earth faults.
Not acheiving unhappy customers.
All this, sustained over 40+ years working professionally on everything from classic to modern cars & 'bikes.
Now that is quite an achievement.
Copaslip acts as an insulator
Why apply insulation to something that needs good electrical conductivity?
Never too late to change
Any chance of keeping to a sensible debate?
Penelope Stopit said:
Don't understand
Copaslip acts as an insulator
Why apply insulation to something that needs good electrical conductivity?
Never too late to change
Any chance of keeping to a sensible debate?
There’s a trade off between rusting threads or copper slipped ones. Having experienced the stress of removing the front o/s Chassis bolt with a number of earth points attached and the impending sense of doom your likely to snap off a very rusty bolt I’d go for a bit of copper slip everytime. There is no debate here if you have felt the pain of a snapped rusted bolt in a place that’s virtually impossible to drill it out without body off.... Practical reality me old mate is far more important than some 2% loss of connection, you tighten the bolt, it stands to reason it makes a very firm contact with the threads and steel it’s screwed into. Copaslip acts as an insulator
Why apply insulation to something that needs good electrical conductivity?
Never too late to change
Any chance of keeping to a sensible debate?
This is the reason I make sure the electrical lug is always in contact with clean metal, I never personally rely on the bolt threads even if it is correct.
Copper grease the bolt thread up after up as well and your good to go, some waxoil or more grease over it all afterwards when it's tight.
Copper grease the bolt thread up after up as well and your good to go, some waxoil or more grease over it all afterwards when it's tight.
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