VAT, buying a van, converting to camper, selling.
Discussion
Hi
I have a plan to buy two vans from auction to convert to proper motorhome/campers.
One camper will be kept for myself. While the other will be sold. The idea being the skills, time and process will be more economical doing two vehicles and I will hopefully recover the cost of converting both vans in the sale of the second vehicle.
Where do I stand when it comes to VAT. I believe I will pay vat on both vehicles at purchase. I'm not in business, therefore am unable to claim that back. When I sell the second vehicle, will I need to charge vat? Will I be expected to pay any more vat at that point? And do camper vans actually require vat to be applied.
If I'm missing any other questions I should be asking please do jump in. The vans are likely to be 3 or 4 year old Volkswagen transporters.
Many thanks
I have a plan to buy two vans from auction to convert to proper motorhome/campers.
One camper will be kept for myself. While the other will be sold. The idea being the skills, time and process will be more economical doing two vehicles and I will hopefully recover the cost of converting both vans in the sale of the second vehicle.
Where do I stand when it comes to VAT. I believe I will pay vat on both vehicles at purchase. I'm not in business, therefore am unable to claim that back. When I sell the second vehicle, will I need to charge vat? Will I be expected to pay any more vat at that point? And do camper vans actually require vat to be applied.
If I'm missing any other questions I should be asking please do jump in. The vans are likely to be 3 or 4 year old Volkswagen transporters.
Many thanks
Simpo Two said:
Is there VAT on a second-hand vehicle bought at auction? I've seen the term 'qualifying' but will leave Eric to explain. I bought a car at auction and they certainly didn't add VAT to the hammer price.
There is if it's a commercial vehicle, which is what the OP wants to buy. No that's incorrect.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
Outside of auctions here is where it get interesting: Normally a VAT reg business can't buy from a non vat reg source (to sell on) as they then can't claim back the VAT on the purchase, but have to charge it on the sale so it takes so much of the profit from it (unless the margin is fecking huge) it's not worth doing. BUT in the case of vehicle sales lots of VAT reg companies are buying from the public so the 'VAT margin scheme' applies, but only on vehicles. This reduces the VAT losses and makes the deal worth doing.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
Outside of auctions here is where it get interesting: Normally a VAT reg business can't buy from a non vat reg source (to sell on) as they then can't claim back the VAT on the purchase, but have to charge it on the sale so it takes so much of the profit from it (unless the margin is fecking huge) it's not worth doing. BUT in the case of vehicle sales lots of VAT reg companies are buying from the public so the 'VAT margin scheme' applies, but only on vehicles. This reduces the VAT losses and makes the deal worth doing.
Edited by Evoluzione on Friday 25th September 20:41
Evoluzione said:
Outside of auctions here is where it get interesting: Normally a VAT reg business can't buy from a non vat reg source (to sell on) as they then can't claim back the VAT on the purchase, but have to charge it on the sale so it takes so much of the profit from it (unless the margin is fecking huge) it's not worth doing.
That means in auction you can? Evoluzione said:
No that's incorrect.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I would argue that the vast majority of vans that go through an auction have been owned by a vat registered business. The chances of finding a van at auction that is not liable to vat must be vanishingly small.If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
Edited by Evoluzione on Friday 25th September 20:41
Evoluzione said:
No that's incorrect.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I would argue that the vast majority of vans that go through an auction have been owned by a vat registered business. The chances of finding a van at auction that is not liable to vat must be vanishingly small.If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
Edited by Evoluzione on Friday 25th September 20:41
Outside of VAT rules.
I would be concerned about weight!. All vans have a weight limit, some are very low.
Adding 'Camper' stuff inside is going to push you close to or over those limits if you are not careful. With or without passengers and liquids on-board.
I think a lot of home-brew campers fall foul of this without anyone realising.
V.
I would be concerned about weight!. All vans have a weight limit, some are very low.
Adding 'Camper' stuff inside is going to push you close to or over those limits if you are not careful. With or without passengers and liquids on-board.
I think a lot of home-brew campers fall foul of this without anyone realising.
V.
s2sol said:
Evoluzione said:
No that's incorrect.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I would argue that the vast majority of vans that go through an auction have been owned by a vat registered business. The chances of finding a van at auction that is not liable to vat must be vanishingly small.If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I did buy my first ever van VAT free at auction, as I'd just started out I wasn't VAT reg so it suited me. There are a lot of non VAT reg businesses out there and some just offload their vehicles at auction. Likewise a lot of private car owners who don't want the hassle of getting rid of old cars just stick them through auction too.
VEX said:
Outside of VAT rules.
I would be concerned about weight!. All vans have a weight limit, some are very low.
Adding 'Camper' stuff inside is going to push you close to or over those limits if you are not careful. With or without passengers and liquids on-board.
I think a lot of home-brew campers fall foul of this without anyone realising.
V.
There are lots of obscure rules to catch out the unwary. Transporting rubbish without having the correct licence is one, towing a car for someone else for a fee without having a tacho fitted is another.I would be concerned about weight!. All vans have a weight limit, some are very low.
Adding 'Camper' stuff inside is going to push you close to or over those limits if you are not careful. With or without passengers and liquids on-board.
I think a lot of home-brew campers fall foul of this without anyone realising.
V.
Evoluzione said:
s2sol said:
Evoluzione said:
No that's incorrect.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I would argue that the vast majority of vans that go through an auction have been owned by a vat registered business. The chances of finding a van at auction that is not liable to vat must be vanishingly small.If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I did buy my first ever van VAT free at auction, as I'd just started out I wasn't VAT reg so it suited me. There are a lot of non VAT reg businesses out there and some just offload their vehicles at auction. Likewise a lot of private car owners who don't want the hassle of getting rid of old cars just stick them through auction too.
Fast Bug said:
If a vehicle is VAT qualifying, then you'll pay the hammer price + VAT + any fees. I too would imagine that the amount of non VAT qualifying vehicles going through auction would be very small.
Be careful with using the term vehicles as there is a difference been passenger cars and commercials. VAT Qual commercials will have VAT added to the hammer. Passenger cars will include any VAT in the hammer regardless of VAT Qual status.
Fast Bug said:
If a vehicle is VAT qualifying, then you'll pay the hammer price + VAT + any fees. I too would imagine that the amount of non VAT qualifying vehicles going through auction would be very small.
VAT is added to the hammer price of a qualifying commercial vehicle. VAT qualifying cars the VAT is included in the hammer price and shown on the invoice.
CaptainSlow said:
Evoluzione said:
s2sol said:
Evoluzione said:
No that's incorrect.
If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I would argue that the vast majority of vans that go through an auction have been owned by a vat registered business. The chances of finding a van at auction that is not liable to vat must be vanishingly small.If the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg then there is VAT to pay on that, if they are not then there is no VAT to pay.
The auctioneer will be VAT reg so there will be VAT to pay on their fees only.
You can be a business and a commercial vehicle owner and not be VAT reg so there will be no VAT to pay on that.
I did buy my first ever van VAT free at auction, as I'd just started out I wasn't VAT reg so it suited me. There are a lot of non VAT reg businesses out there and some just offload their vehicles at auction. Likewise a lot of private car owners who don't want the hassle of getting rid of old cars just stick them through auction too.
Evoluzione said:
It isn't strange at all, it's very simple and has nothing to do with the vendor. As explained earlier at length it's whether the owner of the vehicle is VAT reg or not that matters.
When you say owner...do you mean the buyer or seller at auction? Let me know which you mean and I'll explain why you are wrong Gassing Station | Business | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff