Replacement Clutch 993
Discussion
As said above, the engine and box have to come out to do it on a 4WD version - I know this to my cost because a so-called specialist in France tried to do mine just dropping the box. Because of the lack of room when putting the input shaft into the flywheel on reassembly, they buggered the pressure plate leading to clutch slip 5000 kms later. It has now been redone by another specialist and the insurance of the previous garage is paying because independent experts have judged that they did a crap job. I won't talk about the prices because it's more expensive here in France because there aren't many porkers here compared to the UK.
Take advantage of having the engine out to do other standard jobs like the cam-cover gaskets, spark plugs, etc. If your clutch assistance dies the moment that the engine is switched off then get the hydraulic accumulator on the slave cylinder done too.
Take advantage of having the engine out to do other standard jobs like the cam-cover gaskets, spark plugs, etc. If your clutch assistance dies the moment that the engine is switched off then get the hydraulic accumulator on the slave cylinder done too.
butzi said:
If your clutch assistance dies the moment that the engine is switched off ....
??? what do you mean by that? how do you tell?
On the 993TT and the 4S the clutch is hydraulically assisted from the central hydraulic system that does power steering, etc. This system depressurises the moment that the engine is switched off, so the clutch would immediately be very heavy if it relied only on that. There is an hydraulic accumulator on the slave cylinder that, when in good condition, will allow 5 or 6 clutch actuations with assistance when the engine is switched off. If you don't use this reserve of pressure up by actuating the clutch with the engine off (why would you?), then when you jump in the car and fire her up to go the clutch has normal functionality and feel from the outset - otherwise there is a few seconds wait during which the clutch pedal feels very stiff. My car had this symptom.
These accumulators have a tendency to wear out or lose their pre-charge pressure - doesn't stop the car being driven, it's just means the clutch does not have the full functionality designed into it by the engineers. Anyway, because the accumulator is on the slave cylinder and a bastard to get to, if it has stopped working then you might as well get it replaced while the engine's out.
Bit hot here to be wearing an anorak...
nel said:
nel said:
If your clutch assistance dies the moment that the engine is switched off ....
??? what do you mean by that? how do you tell?
On the 993TT and the 4S the clutch is hydraulically assisted from the central hydraulic system that does power steering, etc.
Thanks for the explanation, does that mean C2 has separate hydrolic system? I once had fluid leak for the power steering but did not affect the clutch.
I haven't examined the system for the C2, but if I recall correctly it shares part of the fluid reservoir for the brakes. In any case, it is a simpler (and thus some would argue better!) system that does not have the pumped hydraulic assistance of the 4WD versions. This also gives it the advantage of economy - a slave cylinder for a C2 about a tenth of the price of the one for the C4S/TT!
butzi said:
If your clutch assistance dies the moment that the engine is switched off ....
??? what do you mean by that? how do you tell?
BTW, you can look up JZM's site, they list the price of clutch change.
Yes, it's shown as £885 (plus vat) for the C4 (more expensive than the "2"
, but oddly do not show the price for the C4S. (But I guess would be the same.)One other thing to consider when you're having the clutch done. It is often recommended that the bimass flywheel is replaced at the same time as, in the past, they had problems with elastomer failure between the two metallic components and so propose this out of caution.
If you're considering performance upgrades anyway, you might want to consider replacing the bimass jobby with a monomass GT2 flywheel - it's a bit lighter so the engine revs more rapidly. There are drawbacks including a vague coffee grinder sound at very low revs and some of the rennlist forum crowd found that they stalled their cars much easier. I can only assume that they went for an even lighter flywheel, because I've had no stalling problems whatsoever and the revs really do pick up at an astonishing rate when the turbos light up. Just another idea to discuss with your chosen garage.
If you're considering performance upgrades anyway, you might want to consider replacing the bimass jobby with a monomass GT2 flywheel - it's a bit lighter so the engine revs more rapidly. There are drawbacks including a vague coffee grinder sound at very low revs and some of the rennlist forum crowd found that they stalled their cars much easier. I can only assume that they went for an even lighter flywheel, because I've had no stalling problems whatsoever and the revs really do pick up at an astonishing rate when the turbos light up. Just another idea to discuss with your chosen garage.
Thanks for you replies, very helpful.
I've just bought my 4S, it only has 32,000 miles on the clock.
I spoke to the Porsche specialist who had the car in for a service by the previous owner and he said it needs a new clutch.
The clutch is very heavy and when pressing clicks really badly. I presumed that it needs a new clutch and a slave cylinder.
A Porsche dealer in London who carried out the pre purchase inspection just said it was very heavy.
I'm a bit confused now as to what needs replacing.
Any thoughts.
Cheers
Andy
I've just bought my 4S, it only has 32,000 miles on the clock.
I spoke to the Porsche specialist who had the car in for a service by the previous owner and he said it needs a new clutch.
The clutch is very heavy and when pressing clicks really badly. I presumed that it needs a new clutch and a slave cylinder.
A Porsche dealer in London who carried out the pre purchase inspection just said it was very heavy.
I'm a bit confused now as to what needs replacing.
Any thoughts.
Cheers
Andy
32k miles isn't much for the clutch to be worn out, but I suppose it depends how/where it's been driven. Mine needed the clutch doing after 55k miles, which seems to be fairly in line with other experiences that I've read.
Have always been of the opinion that the real sign that the clutch is on the way out is slippage when you give it some wellie in 3rd gear and above. If it is not slipping and the only symptom is heaviness, then I'd have thought that it could just be the hydraulic side of things needing some attention, but seem to recall others on this forum saying that heaviness can mean that the clutch needs doing. You might try searching for relevant threads.
Best of luck - ultimately a reputable specialist should see you right (as he lightens your wallet).
Have always been of the opinion that the real sign that the clutch is on the way out is slippage when you give it some wellie in 3rd gear and above. If it is not slipping and the only symptom is heaviness, then I'd have thought that it could just be the hydraulic side of things needing some attention, but seem to recall others on this forum saying that heaviness can mean that the clutch needs doing. You might try searching for relevant threads.
Best of luck - ultimately a reputable specialist should see you right (as he lightens your wallet).
I just had the clutch done on my GT3 for the same reasons - heavy and clicking noises. Was told this is called "two-staging" and is a sign of a knackered clutch. Usually you would buy the entire "clutch pack" rather than just the friction plates themselves. I was also told by a trusted mechanic that he does not recommend letting clutches get as far as slipping, as by this stage they can do more damage to the surrouding parts.
The feel of the car after the change is fantastic - totally transformed the car, and also made an ocasionally difficult gearchange disappear as the old clutch was obviously not disengaging properly.
The feel of the car after the change is fantastic - totally transformed the car, and also made an ocasionally difficult gearchange disappear as the old clutch was obviously not disengaging properly.
DaGinge said:
I was also told by a trusted mechanic that he does not recommend letting clutches get as far as slipping, as by this stage they can do more damage to the surrouding parts.
That would certainly be true if you wanted to stay with the same flywheel as, once the clutch starts slipping, you'll be quickly down to the scenario of rivets shagging the friction face. However, if both pressure plate and flywheel are going to be changed anyway then I don't really see any harm in getting as many miles out of the assembly as possible, i.e. use it until it starts slipping.
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