Electronic safety net
Discussion
The Tuono is the first bike I’ve had with a full electronic safety net and up and down shifter.
I used to think that such things weren’t worthwhile in that I had ridden for years without either but after about 5000 miles I’ve changed my mind to the extent I’m not sure I would buy a bike without them.
Perhaps it is creating a false sense of security but I have found it useful that when overtaking or accelerating out of corners or over slightly lumpy tarmac I don’t have to worry about inadvertently wheeling - so can focus fully on other aspects. Similarly, having some level of traction control is useful - particularly with so much torque. Last week I had the bike lent over and hit some bumpy tarmac and even with only a light throttle I lost traction briefly. TC kicked in slightly. Did I need it? Probably not but I’d rather not find out. Similar with the cornering ABS - I haven’t triggered it and try to ride so I won’t need it but glad to have it in the background in case I do.
I used to think that such things weren’t worthwhile in that I had ridden for years without either but after about 5000 miles I’ve changed my mind to the extent I’m not sure I would buy a bike without them.
Perhaps it is creating a false sense of security but I have found it useful that when overtaking or accelerating out of corners or over slightly lumpy tarmac I don’t have to worry about inadvertently wheeling - so can focus fully on other aspects. Similarly, having some level of traction control is useful - particularly with so much torque. Last week I had the bike lent over and hit some bumpy tarmac and even with only a light throttle I lost traction briefly. TC kicked in slightly. Did I need it? Probably not but I’d rather not find out. Similar with the cornering ABS - I haven’t triggered it and try to ride so I won’t need it but glad to have it in the background in case I do.
ABS yes, quick shifter, auto blipper yes, traction control? Nah, I’ll take my chances. However, I’d rather have the options of all the electronic aids and able/disable at rider command. When electric bikes really are the norm, traction control will be the new normal. I drive a plethora of electric cars and the power delivery is insane. Put that power band through the contact patch of a fag packet and I’ll have all the aids available please.
We are truly blessed with today’s offerings of two wheeled machinery. If you can afford it, get it. If you can’t afford it, finance it.
We are truly blessed with today’s offerings of two wheeled machinery. If you can afford it, get it. If you can’t afford it, finance it.
underwhelmist said:
I've only really ridden old stuff with no electronics, but I'm interested in the idea of risk compensation. Do you find yourself riding more, er, enthusiastically when you know you've got abs, traction control, anti-wheelie etc?
In a word yes, you do, I like the modern IMU controlled stuff, the TCS on my Z1000 was great and meant I could go faster and keep the throttle pinned over crests where I'd be rolling off normally, also I liked the C-ABS even though I never had to lean on it, my current z900rs doesn't have the same safety net with a more basic TC and ABS setup, but it still works well for the most part, I wouldn't buy a (secondhand) bike without abs for road riding now but the lack of the other aids wouldn't worry me as I have been riding large capacity bikes with no riding aids for almost 30 years, but there is no doubt that some of the modern bikes would be almost unrideable without a sophisticated electronics package.Edited by Jazoli on Sunday 13th December 00:00
Jazoli said:
In a word yes, you do, I like the modern IMU controlled stuff, the TCS on my Z1000 was great and meant I could go faster and keep the throttle pinned over crests where I'd be rolling off normally, also I liked the C-ABS even though I never had to lean on it, my current z900rs doesn't have the same safety net with a more basic TC and ABS setup, but it still works well for the most part, I wouldn't buy a (secondhand) bike without abs for road riding now but the lack of the other aids wouldn't worry me as I have been riding large capacity bikes with no riding aids for almost 30 years, but there is no doubt that some of the modern bikes would be almost unrideable without a sophisticated electronics package.
Interesting, thanks. Modern bikes make so much power that I can imagine they'd be a handful without the electronics, to say the least. I must try one some day!Edited by Jazoli on Sunday 13th December 00:00
underwhelmist said:
I've only really ridden old stuff with no electronics, but I'm interested in the idea of risk compensation. Do you find yourself riding more, er, enthusiastically when you know you've got abs, traction control, anti-wheelie etc?
Yes. Not significantly but still a bit. Recently overtook an artic with one coming the other way. Not that it was a dodgy overtake but with the anti wheelie on the first setting I knew I could give it full throttle and the front wheel would just hover - if I had had to worry about stopping a full on wheelie I might not have gone for the overtake.typically I rode my RSV's with AW off and TC at 1 or 2 in track setting. Seemed to give a longer throttle which was nice for modulating power delivery in the early part of the rev range.
ABS would be on but that's about it. On dry roads I don't find it really matters.
On my KTM 1190 in East Africa however, I was always changing the modes, especially on dirt where the looooong throttle as great, would allow you to really spin the back at 100kph but the de linked ABS was vital as sliding the rear wa necessary. Also when climbing sandy or loose hills the TC being on would stop your progress as spinning for traction was the only way you'd get up the hills. Then on the road having the full 150 bhp was great....
ABS would be on but that's about it. On dry roads I don't find it really matters.
On my KTM 1190 in East Africa however, I was always changing the modes, especially on dirt where the looooong throttle as great, would allow you to really spin the back at 100kph but the de linked ABS was vital as sliding the rear wa necessary. Also when climbing sandy or loose hills the TC being on would stop your progress as spinning for traction was the only way you'd get up the hills. Then on the road having the full 150 bhp was great....
sociopath said:
Electronic aids are good things to stop you dying.
Who accidentally wheelies though? That sounds like a lack of finesse in your control. Nothing wrong with wheelies in the right place, but you shouldn't be doing them accidentally
I guess you've never ridden an MT10 have you? Who accidentally wheelies though? That sounds like a lack of finesse in your control. Nothing wrong with wheelies in the right place, but you shouldn't be doing them accidentally
;)I'm all in favour of electronic safety aids of all types. Ideally they should be set to allow you to just get to the edge, but not go over. There are too many experienced riders who have been expensively and painfully caught out by what should be very straight forward events for me to think I'm good enough to not unexpectedly need some assistance.
I have, in the last 30 plus years of using bikes with ABS, on at least a couple of occasions, fired off my ABS in anger. I'm here to tell the stories which is something I'm not sure I would be able to say had I not had ABS on the bike.
I have, in the last 30 plus years of using bikes with ABS, on at least a couple of occasions, fired off my ABS in anger. I'm here to tell the stories which is something I'm not sure I would be able to say had I not had ABS on the bike.
Jazoli said:
there is no doubt that some of the modern bikes would be almost unrideable without a sophisticated electronics package.
This. I've a latest shape R1 and to be honest I'm a bit of a wuss and keep it in mode "C". I once had a bit of a moment when I'd accidentally got it in mode "A" with the anti-wheelie off, and ended up pulling a massive wheelie. While filtering 
If I'm looking at 2 otherwise identical bikes and one has ABS, I'm more likely to choose that one. Why wouldn't you?
As it happens none of my bikes are younger than 25 years old, so not really an issue, but I did have it on a modern once and did need to deploy it when someone pulled out on me in a car park, so I'm pleased I had it.
As it happens none of my bikes are younger than 25 years old, so not really an issue, but I did have it on a modern once and did need to deploy it when someone pulled out on me in a car park, so I'm pleased I had it.
I think we all agree that ABS, in the many forms it takes for Superbikes, ADV bikes etc is an absolute no brainer. The development of advanced ABS such as cornering or whatever linked to the IMU is again, clearly of benefit in the real world.
But whilst they're nice to have and easy to implement nowadays with RBW and powerful processors, Anti Wheelie, Launch Control and Traction Control (IMHO), in reality, I think they offier negligable benefit.
I've yet to ride a bike that was so uncontrollable and needed the hand of God to intervene and save me from myself, itself and any bump in the road. If you can't roll a superbike on without hoisting the front to the degree that you're no longer in control, maybe it's the wrong bike for your skills.....
Sorry but....
But whilst they're nice to have and easy to implement nowadays with RBW and powerful processors, Anti Wheelie, Launch Control and Traction Control (IMHO), in reality, I think they offier negligable benefit.
I've yet to ride a bike that was so uncontrollable and needed the hand of God to intervene and save me from myself, itself and any bump in the road. If you can't roll a superbike on without hoisting the front to the degree that you're no longer in control, maybe it's the wrong bike for your skills.....
Sorry but....
Steve Bass said:
I think we all agree that ABS, in the many forms it takes for Superbikes, ADV bikes etc is an absolute no brainer. The development of advanced ABS such as cornering or whatever linked to the IMU is again, clearly of benefit in the real world.
But whilst they're nice to have and easy to implement nowadays with RBW and powerful processors, Anti Wheelie, Launch Control and Traction Control (IMHO), in reality, I think they offier negligable benefit.
I've yet to ride a bike that was so uncontrollable and needed the hand of God to intervene and save me from myself, itself and any bump in the road. If you can't roll a superbike on without hoisting the front to the degree that you're no longer in control, maybe it's the wrong bike for your skills.....
Sorry but....
There are at least two "stars" of PHBB who have ended up on their arse where Traction Control would very likely have saved them. Regardless how good you are, there are occasions when the unexpected catches you out and I'd rather be saying "Oh, that was close" than "Oh, that was painful and expensive".But whilst they're nice to have and easy to implement nowadays with RBW and powerful processors, Anti Wheelie, Launch Control and Traction Control (IMHO), in reality, I think they offier negligable benefit.
I've yet to ride a bike that was so uncontrollable and needed the hand of God to intervene and save me from myself, itself and any bump in the road. If you can't roll a superbike on without hoisting the front to the degree that you're no longer in control, maybe it's the wrong bike for your skills.....
Sorry but....
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