GMP Chief Constable "Tasered"
Discussion
How did they pick the officer to do it? Random, or as some sort of reward?
He described the experience as "unpleasant"
Being stuck on a hot crowded train is unpleasant, long pauses in conversation are unpleasant, getting 50,000 volts up the jacksy 
probably goes beyond unpleasant!
Good man for putting himself up for this
He described the experience as "unpleasant"
Being stuck on a hot crowded train is unpleasant, long pauses in conversation are unpleasant, getting 50,000 volts up the jacksy probably goes beyond unpleasant! Good man for putting himself up for this
I would have a problem with every officer carrying a Tazer, we have had a huge increase in the number of officers using CS gas lately, many cases when it was really not necessary and seemed to be used out of panic by weaker or especially female officers when there was plenty of available backup making it IMHO an "over the top response".
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Agnostic said:
I would have a problem with every officer carrying a Tazer, we have had a huge increase in the number of officers using CS gas lately, many cases when it was really not necessary and seemed to be used out of panic by weaker or especially female officers when there was plenty of available backup making it IMHO an "over the top response".
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I don't think I've ever heard such nonsense in my life. How can you possibly know whether CS gas usage was warranted or not in each circumstance?
Agnostic said:
I would have a problem with every officer carrying a Tazer, we have had a huge increase in the number of officers using CS gas lately, many cases when it was really not necessary and seemed to be used out of panic by weaker or especially female officers when there was plenty of available backup making it IMHO an "over the top response".
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Difficult one...I agree with your fears, in that a tazer, when used on someone with a weak heart (not always the old and infirm), can be very lethal (can you attribute levels to a concept such as lethality...sounds like bad english...like "fairly unique"!).
But...where increasing numbers of scum are carrying knives, the availability of a "ranged" weapon such as this will be of reassurance to police and a deterrent to scum...until they just start carrying guns instead, of course!
But full marks to the CC for volunteering...brave man.
According to Manchester Paper who gleefully covered the story mit pictures 
- Todd volunteered after praising them to officers in speech earlier in year.
Weapon fires metal barbs into skin und manuafacturer claims this ist safe - yet Amnesty International claim 74 people died after being fired on in this way.
Chap who tasered the CC was Sgt Keyworth - firearms officer und he allegedly gave same verbal warning telling CC to stand still of be tasered...
Paper said the CC called out in pain und then fell onto his stomach onto a crush mat (er - real victim would not have comfy mat to fall onto
und could hit head on floor un have serious injury as result...
Und he lay on ground mit the tiny wires trailing from his body to the gun - und gun continues to release the charge for further 5 seconds. Und then the officers remove the barbs from his skin und he recovered within seconds but was still shaken.
Todd reports that the pain was incredible und he ist not going to do it again He said if froze him completely und this would prevent him firing gun at a policeman und this ist why they are necessary.
Er - but - do not know how these work but it looks to me from these photos und description that you have to be close enough (Sgt was 10 feet behind the CC) to fire und hit right target und get close. Trigger happy thug may start shooting before officer even gets into range to us it.
Todd wants all officers to carry tasers... und Manchester Evening News leader column suggests proceeding mit caution.
- Todd volunteered after praising them to officers in speech earlier in year. Weapon fires metal barbs into skin und manuafacturer claims this ist safe - yet Amnesty International claim 74 people died after being fired on in this way.
Chap who tasered the CC was Sgt Keyworth - firearms officer und he allegedly gave same verbal warning telling CC to stand still of be tasered...
Paper said the CC called out in pain und then fell onto his stomach onto a crush mat (er - real victim would not have comfy mat to fall onto
und could hit head on floor un have serious injury as result... Und he lay on ground mit the tiny wires trailing from his body to the gun - und gun continues to release the charge for further 5 seconds. Und then the officers remove the barbs from his skin und he recovered within seconds but was still shaken.
Todd reports that the pain was incredible und he ist not going to do it again
He said if froze him completely und this would prevent him firing gun at a policeman und this ist why they are necessary. Er - but - do not know how these work but it looks to me from these photos und description that you have to be close enough (Sgt was 10 feet behind the CC) to fire und hit right target und get close. Trigger happy thug may start shooting before officer even gets into range to us it.
Todd wants all officers to carry tasers... und Manchester Evening News leader column suggests proceeding mit caution.
WildCat said:And this "real victim" might be holding a firearm or other potential weapon at a serving police officer having already been warned that it was about to be used.
...er - real victim would not have comfy mat to fall onto
Personally, if it was me with the taser, I'd laugh as he hit the ground.
GregE240 said:
...er - real victim would not have comfy mat to fall onto
And this "real victim" might be holding a firearm or other potential weapon at a serving police officer having already been warned that it was about to be used.
Personally, if it was me with the taser, I'd laugh as he hit the ground.
True - the bloke mit the chair leg may still be alive had he been tasered und not shot dead that day. He may have died from heart failure given his alleged poor health though.
But there ist a danger mit abuse if all officers are given this device. People could be on receiving end if they are perceived to have "wrong attitude" und there ist some report of peope suffering heart attack from the shock of it.
Its use could only justified if used by properly trained firearms officer und in specific circumstances such as perhaps the table leg case.
It ist certainly not a tool to be deployed by all bobbies on beat - und ist danger of inappropriate use in red mist pub crawl situations. Und for once I agree mith Ms Blears (und this ist not very often
) volvos70t5 said:
I would have a problem with every officer carrying a Tazer, we have had a huge increase in the number of officers using CS gas lately, many cases when it was really not necessary and seemed to be used out of panic by weaker or especially female officers when there was plenty of available backup making it IMHO an "over the top response".
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I don't think I've ever heard such nonsense in my life. How can you possibly know whether CS gas usage was warranted or not in each circumstance?
If the evidence given by the officers in court was to be taken as correct, the last two Assault on PC cases that I have heard resulted in the first case one bruised elbow (three officers present in the def's own home aged forty five no previous?) in the second case when a Def tried to sit up after being restrained by four PC's with another three on hand. In both these cases Gas was used by a WPC? OK so it may be coincidence?
I merely observe that it seems that it may be a first line of defence rather than a last resort, should require much greater training before use.
Are you completely sure that you have always seen an appropriate amount of force used in each arrest you have witnessed?
Don't get me wrong I am not in favour of reducing powers or a soft handed approach just a fair balance, in favour of those who are not the usual scumbags.
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Agnostic said:
If the evidence given by the officers in court was to be taken as correct, the last two Assault on PC cases that I have heard resulted in the first case one bruised elbow (three officers present in the def's own home aged forty five no previous?) in the second case when a Def tried to sit up after being restrained by four PC's with another three on hand. In both these cases Gas was used by a WPC? OK so it may be coincidence?
Perceptions is the word which is important in this!
Your perception could not possibly be the same as a person who is involved in a struggle to restrain a violent or potentially violent person through watching a CCTV tape and reading a plethora of papers which have been studied by legal experts for months.
Reading reports over a prolonged period may give the exact outline of what happened but unless you are in a situation where you have to make a split second decision about control and personal safety, you cannot make a proper judgement. Being there at the time is important to know the whole situation.
Unfortunately those that judge these situations months later through sharp intakes of breath can never understand the feelings of those that make decisions like spraying CS to quell a situation.
CS is nasty and unpleasant but does not usually leave a lasting injury. The effects are different on many people but ususally disappear abot an hour after contact. Much better to get a dose of jollop than a crack from a baton which could cause serious debilitating long term recovery issues.
As well as protecting officers form injury, it very often stops the subject from the risk of further injury if they respond to the incapacitating effects.
Agnostic said:
I merely observe that it seems that it may be a first line of defence rather than a last resort, should require much greater training before use.
If it has to be used as a defence, then it should be the first line as its effects are usually quick and mostly temporary for a short time.
The very best method for establishing control is the voice. This only usually comes with experience.
Agnostic said:
Are you completely sure that you have always seen an appropriate amount of force used in each arrest you have witnessed?
NO! But those that I have seen have been dealt with. This has included an officer sacked for his treatment of a prisoner and another who is currently on bail for a GBH.
Agnostic said:
Don't get me wrong I am not in favour of reducing powers or a soft handed approach just a fair balance, in favour of those who are not the usual scumbags.
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Why should a person who dons a uniform to try and make a difference to the ills of modern society have to accept the fact they will occasionally be used as a punch bag because of someone with an issue?
CS spray should be used more often. It should be a first line of defence with any striking defences with unarmed tactics or weapons as a second line of defence.
I have used it. 4 cans last year. None this year.
I have never had a complaint from anyone I have sprayed with CS. I have had a complaint for connecting with them with my baton.
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