Redundancies coming
Discussion
Guess this is a vent as much as anything. But if anyone's been through this in a large company I'd appreciate hearing about your experience.
After 4 years of Brexit uncertainty, things were starting to look good for the future. Now my company has announced they're getting rid of 20% of our department and I'm feeling totally deflated.
The voluntary package is expected to be decent, especially so for those nearing the end of their working life. At mid forties unfortunately I'm not there yet, although potentially I'll walk away with enough to pay my bills for maybe 3 years and with my savings I'll have plenty of time to find something else.
I don't think they'll get enough volunteers.
I don't want to leave, but if they don't get the numbers and it goes to compulsory the package will be significantly less. So now I'm trying to work out if I'm likely to be in the firing line and should jump before I'm pushed.
I've read the government guidelines for selection and my record is impeccable with no disciplinaries or absences in 20 years. I have useful and unique skills and knowledge for my department. But I can't help wondering how much of the selection will come down to who you know not what you know. Although I've been there 20 years I've only been in my department 5.
Has anyone been involved in selecting staff for redundancy and if so what were the most important attributes considered?
Has anyone been through this and either kept or lost their jobs? Did it feel fair?
After 4 years of Brexit uncertainty, things were starting to look good for the future. Now my company has announced they're getting rid of 20% of our department and I'm feeling totally deflated.
The voluntary package is expected to be decent, especially so for those nearing the end of their working life. At mid forties unfortunately I'm not there yet, although potentially I'll walk away with enough to pay my bills for maybe 3 years and with my savings I'll have plenty of time to find something else.
I don't think they'll get enough volunteers.
I don't want to leave, but if they don't get the numbers and it goes to compulsory the package will be significantly less. So now I'm trying to work out if I'm likely to be in the firing line and should jump before I'm pushed.
I've read the government guidelines for selection and my record is impeccable with no disciplinaries or absences in 20 years. I have useful and unique skills and knowledge for my department. But I can't help wondering how much of the selection will come down to who you know not what you know. Although I've been there 20 years I've only been in my department 5.
Has anyone been involved in selecting staff for redundancy and if so what were the most important attributes considered?
Has anyone been through this and either kept or lost their jobs? Did it feel fair?
Firstly, sorry to hear of your predicament. Fingers crossed it comes to naught.
If however things do progress and your post is involved, then ultimately it’s the organisation’s call. You can weigh up the pros and cons of volunteering before that obviously, or sit tight and see how it pans out.
You may have read threads previously on here and elsewhere where many say that redundancy, despite the anxieties at the time, was a blessing (opportunity to move from a toxic environment or try something new). Not all of course, but looking for the positives can only help keep you motivated and positive about securing your next role if it comes to that.
Good luck!
If however things do progress and your post is involved, then ultimately it’s the organisation’s call. You can weigh up the pros and cons of volunteering before that obviously, or sit tight and see how it pans out.
You may have read threads previously on here and elsewhere where many say that redundancy, despite the anxieties at the time, was a blessing (opportunity to move from a toxic environment or try something new). Not all of course, but looking for the positives can only help keep you motivated and positive about securing your next role if it comes to that.
Good luck!
This is a fantastic opportunity to make a decent lump sum whilst also expanding your horizons.
Life is too short to spend your whole life at one company. Take the chance, get some broader experience, and expose yourself to new ideas and ways of doing things. It might feel daunting but you’ve a huge cushion to find something bigger and better.
Plus, do it promptly and you can use the redundancy cash to buy that car you’ve been dreaming of, get an extension, go on holiday, or whatever you want.
This could be the best thing that ever happened to you. Go for it.
Life is too short to spend your whole life at one company. Take the chance, get some broader experience, and expose yourself to new ideas and ways of doing things. It might feel daunting but you’ve a huge cushion to find something bigger and better.
Plus, do it promptly and you can use the redundancy cash to buy that car you’ve been dreaming of, get an extension, go on holiday, or whatever you want.
This could be the best thing that ever happened to you. Go for it.
I was made redundant from my first job after 12 years and was terrified, but got another job and started 3 days after leaving the last with a £9k payrise and I've been in the new job for 11 years now. 95% of people in my old place (a Building Society) were hanging on for redundancy because they had been there for years, some were well into their 50's and had started there at 16 after leaving a school and the redundancy package was brilliant plus DB Pensions too. Anyway, if I hadn't been made redundant, I'd still be in the old place most likely earning less and wouldn't have broadened my horizons.
As above really - if they want you gone, then you're gone - don't expect anything fair, the process can be engineered any way they want.
20 years is also likely to be pushing up against any maximums they have - most companies put a cap on payouts. So one way to look at it is that it's the most you're ever likely to get......
Ultimately it depends on your realistic prospects of finding another role in the next few years - and then, ideally accruing as many years as you can before a pre-retirement redundancy payoff
20 years is also likely to be pushing up against any maximums they have - most companies put a cap on payouts. So one way to look at it is that it's the most you're ever likely to get......
Ultimately it depends on your realistic prospects of finding another role in the next few years - and then, ideally accruing as many years as you can before a pre-retirement redundancy payoff
I was made redundant in August last year after 10 years with the same company.
Longest stint I’ve ever had at one place. Funny thing is 2 years earlier I applied for voluntary redundancy and was declined as I was too valuable.
Crappy employer only gave me the minimum they could get away with and it took me just over two months to get another role. Less responsibility and considerably less money but at least I’ve also got less stress too.
Now selling everything up and buggering off to the SW as if we’ve learnt anything in the past 12 months it’s that life is too short.
Unless you love what you currently do I’d take the money and move on IMO. Sounds like you’re due a considerably better package than I got anyway if you do take voluntary redundancy.
Longest stint I’ve ever had at one place. Funny thing is 2 years earlier I applied for voluntary redundancy and was declined as I was too valuable.
Crappy employer only gave me the minimum they could get away with and it took me just over two months to get another role. Less responsibility and considerably less money but at least I’ve also got less stress too.
Now selling everything up and buggering off to the SW as if we’ve learnt anything in the past 12 months it’s that life is too short.
Unless you love what you currently do I’d take the money and move on IMO. Sounds like you’re due a considerably better package than I got anyway if you do take voluntary redundancy.
Has anyone been furloughed as I would expect them to be in the 20% chosen?
I'm surprised your company has not taken this option to test the 20% are the right choices while the option is still there.
My impression of the large companies I have worked for is that these sort of decisions are made by accountants and all about long term cost savings. The more expensive the resource is harder to justify retaining over the cheaper one if they are not irreplaceable.
I'm surprised your company has not taken this option to test the 20% are the right choices while the option is still there.
My impression of the large companies I have worked for is that these sort of decisions are made by accountants and all about long term cost savings. The more expensive the resource is harder to justify retaining over the cheaper one if they are not irreplaceable.
I've been made redundant twice in the last couple of years.
The first time after 34 years with the same SME company rising to the heady heights of middle management.
I got the bare minimum redundancy package and went because I was expensive compared to the managers of company that took over.
I then got a job with a multinational and after just under 2 years it was taken over and i was the most expensive to keep in my team so let go and got nearly as much redundancy as the first time - not a lot but kept the bills paid for a few months.
I've now got a job on a lot less money and hope I can get to retirement in 12 years time without having to go through that s
t again.
In the last job there were 20% UK redundancies as they moved roles to India and it did seem that as others said they decided who to keep and made the rules accordingly, some really good people were let go for no obvious reason.
Stay and get the redundancy unless you get a good offer from elswhere.
Good luck and keep us updated on here.
The first time after 34 years with the same SME company rising to the heady heights of middle management.
I got the bare minimum redundancy package and went because I was expensive compared to the managers of company that took over.
I then got a job with a multinational and after just under 2 years it was taken over and i was the most expensive to keep in my team so let go and got nearly as much redundancy as the first time - not a lot but kept the bills paid for a few months.
I've now got a job on a lot less money and hope I can get to retirement in 12 years time without having to go through that s
t again.In the last job there were 20% UK redundancies as they moved roles to India and it did seem that as others said they decided who to keep and made the rules accordingly, some really good people were let go for no obvious reason.
Stay and get the redundancy unless you get a good offer from elswhere.
Good luck and keep us updated on here.
I was working for a bank - a small department with a specalised function.
anyways I was on backshift, was asked to come in early the next day as there was an important conference call.
the call went on about 'synergies' and about streamlining different parts of the buisness and they had identified some duplicity and other ways of making cost savings. They obviously went on a bit about it and then said that they would take a break. and during that break they would notifiy those departments that were at risk...
We sat and sat looking at the phone.... Then it rang.
anyways we were notified that our department was at risk.
the meeting reconvined and all were told that if they were not notified then they were not at risk, however those that were had been told.
A rather cold and stilted one 2 one meeting with my boss and an envelope handed over. it contained the offer, and details of options for possible redeployment.
That was that. tried to get us to do training of other staff, but that was kicked into touch, stayed doing what i was meant to do and nothing more. left with a nice bung and started a new job within a month.
Couple of years into that there was a realignment, positions moved about, redundancy from one position, and a new role, but that wasnt what i wanted. too many things were not right and i took the redundancy although it wasnt much.
different job now. and you know a much better working environment.
anyways I was on backshift, was asked to come in early the next day as there was an important conference call.
the call went on about 'synergies' and about streamlining different parts of the buisness and they had identified some duplicity and other ways of making cost savings. They obviously went on a bit about it and then said that they would take a break. and during that break they would notifiy those departments that were at risk...
We sat and sat looking at the phone.... Then it rang.
anyways we were notified that our department was at risk.
the meeting reconvined and all were told that if they were not notified then they were not at risk, however those that were had been told.
A rather cold and stilted one 2 one meeting with my boss and an envelope handed over. it contained the offer, and details of options for possible redeployment.
That was that. tried to get us to do training of other staff, but that was kicked into touch, stayed doing what i was meant to do and nothing more. left with a nice bung and started a new job within a month.
Couple of years into that there was a realignment, positions moved about, redundancy from one position, and a new role, but that wasnt what i wanted. too many things were not right and i took the redundancy although it wasnt much.
different job now. and you know a much better working environment.
Big firm making a big strategic cut in its workforce would be bonkers not to do it strictly by the book and that means drawing up objective criteria for selecting those for the chop and then fairly assessing staff against those criteria. If they can't demonstrate that they followed such an approach, they leave themselves wide open to disputes.
RonaldMcDonaldAteMyCat said:
What's the job market like in your industry? How confident are you picking up another job?
If your current employer offers you 3 years' salary to leave, and you can get another job with good prospects, why wouldn't you take it?
This, if you can walk out with 3 years salary, you could have a year off and then look for something, or just take the money, find something even if its slightly less and then retire 3 years early.If your current employer offers you 3 years' salary to leave, and you can get another job with good prospects, why wouldn't you take it?
benny hilfiger said:
Has anyone been involved in selecting staff for redundancy and if so what were the most important attributes considered?
Has anyone been through this and either kept or lost their jobs? Did it feel fair?
I tend to advise clients on criteria. In theory they will select objective criteria.... Then score against those.Has anyone been through this and either kept or lost their jobs? Did it feel fair?
However I would be lying if I did not say that some staff will be pre-selected (i.e. poor workers, not liked etc) and the scores will place them in the bottom and thus will be made redundant. Their Appeal will also fail.....
Jasandjules said:
I tend to advise clients on criteria. In theory they will select objective criteria.... Then score against those.
However I would be lying if I did not say that some staff will be pre-selected (i.e. poor workers, not liked etc) and the scores will place them in the bottom and thus will be made redundant. Their Appeal will also fail.....
"What's your first criteria?"However I would be lying if I did not say that some staff will be pre-selected (i.e. poor workers, not liked etc) and the scores will place them in the bottom and thus will be made redundant. Their Appeal will also fail.....
"We think they're a t
t""No, you can't do that. Has to be objective"
"Oh. They are a t
t?""Perfect. Next criteria?"
Thanks for all your replies. To answer a few points, it world be very difficult for me to walk into something with comparable pay and benefits. Basically it's a job that would normally be open to graduates, which I'm not, but my previous experience within the company allowed me to progress. So I think I'd struggle to get a foot in the door at this level elsewhere. Plus in the current climate things are even tougher than normal.
So yes it's potentially a nice lump to walk away with, and a change could be great, but long term my total earnings would likely suffer significantly. I also like what I do because of how it relates to the industry its in. Take the same type of job but apply it to something less interesting and it's not very inspiring.
I like the idea of guaging my boss's reaction to my thoughts of taking voluntary but I imagine their hands will be tied and they'll not be able to give me a straight answer. Comparing myself to my colleagues I feel I'm in a strong position and have things to offer they haven't. I was furloughed the least and only had a couple of weeks off compared to several months for some of them due to the skills I have. But no-one is irreplaceable and there's a clique of grads and their sponsors who would probably be seen as the long term future of the company.
So yes it's potentially a nice lump to walk away with, and a change could be great, but long term my total earnings would likely suffer significantly. I also like what I do because of how it relates to the industry its in. Take the same type of job but apply it to something less interesting and it's not very inspiring.
I like the idea of guaging my boss's reaction to my thoughts of taking voluntary but I imagine their hands will be tied and they'll not be able to give me a straight answer. Comparing myself to my colleagues I feel I'm in a strong position and have things to offer they haven't. I was furloughed the least and only had a couple of weeks off compared to several months for some of them due to the skills I have. But no-one is irreplaceable and there's a clique of grads and their sponsors who would probably be seen as the long term future of the company.
benny hilfiger said:
Thanks for all your replies. To answer a few points, it world be very difficult for me to walk into something with comparable pay and benefits. Basically it's a job that would normally be open to graduates, which I'm not, but my previous experience within the company allowed me to progress. So I think I'd struggle to get a foot in the door at this level elsewhere. Plus in the current climate things are even tougher than normal.
So yes it's potentially a nice lump to walk away with, and a change could be great, but long term my total earnings would likely suffer significantly. I also like what I do because of how it relates to the industry its in. Take the same type of job but apply it to something less interesting and it's not very inspiring.
I like the idea of guaging my boss's reaction to my thoughts of taking voluntary but I imagine their hands will be tied and they'll not be able to give me a straight answer. Comparing myself to my colleagues I feel I'm in a strong position and have things to offer they haven't. I was furloughed the least and only had a couple of weeks off compared to several months for some of them due to the skills I have. But no-one is irreplaceable and there's a clique of grads and their sponsors who would probably be seen as the long term future of the company.
Those grads could be a lot cheaper to get rid of than you, so stop looking for negative outcomes. So yes it's potentially a nice lump to walk away with, and a change could be great, but long term my total earnings would likely suffer significantly. I also like what I do because of how it relates to the industry its in. Take the same type of job but apply it to something less interesting and it's not very inspiring.
I like the idea of guaging my boss's reaction to my thoughts of taking voluntary but I imagine their hands will be tied and they'll not be able to give me a straight answer. Comparing myself to my colleagues I feel I'm in a strong position and have things to offer they haven't. I was furloughed the least and only had a couple of weeks off compared to several months for some of them due to the skills I have. But no-one is irreplaceable and there's a clique of grads and their sponsors who would probably be seen as the long term future of the company.
Either way, you will be ok. Take a lump, and get a better job. Stay, and miss out on a better future..... but be comfy.
Walked away from two careers, both my choice, now 9years into my third, doing ok thanks.
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
In my experience, the employer decides who they want to keep & then create the criteria accordingly.
About right. Most managers don't need criteria & scoring systems to know who the keepers are & who the weaker members are. It would be rare that somebody would be selected at the end of a fair & objective process that wouldn't have been selected without such a process.Most processes are about optics & even assuaging the conscience of managers.
GT03ROB said:
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
In my experience, the employer decides who they want to keep & then create the criteria accordingly.
About right. Most managers don't need criteria & scoring systems to know who the keepers are & who the weaker members are. It would be rare that somebody would be selected at the end of a fair & objective process that wouldn't have been selected without such a process.Most processes are about optics & even assuaging the conscience of managers.
Best thing that ever happened to me though. I'm miles ahead of where I would have been had I made the cut.
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