Advice needed - ex-partner vanished but his debts haven't
Discussion
This probably mixes financial advice with legal advice, but figured there's some clued up folks on here so worth asking. Bit of a read but please bear with me..
My sister was with a chap for a few years, without getting into the personal info, he was s
t with finances, racked up loads of debt with various companies, kept most of it hidden or downplayed..
For a year or so, he moved into our parents house with my sister, while they saved for a house deposit. Long story short they split up late last year. He's since vanished and is completely uncontactable, leaving behind all of his debt and financial mess.
His last known address was my parents house, so all of his debt letters continue to be delivered there. He owes thousands. Capital One credit card, PayPal credit, overdrafts, and unpaid car finance, Sky bills and council tax (from his previous flat) and store cards that have all gone to various debt collectors.
My parents have contacted most of these companies to advise them that he no longer lives with them, he has no association with this family or address, and his whereabouts or contact info are unknown. They continue to send everything there, despite some (PayPal for example who seemed very friendly and understanding on the phone) saying thanks for letting them know, and they'd stop sending letters there...
Today, a letter from Nationwide arrived addressed to my sister and him, as they had a joint account when they were together. The account is overdrawn again and racking up charges, so he's still using it when he clearly has no money (never able to hold down a job for long).
She's tried before to have herself removed from the account when the broke up - she opened a new, single account with Nationwide, who at the time stated perfectly clearly that they would remove her from the joint account at the same time as opening her new one, effectively an account switch from a joint to a single. This never happened, she remained on the joint account.
Visited the branch, they were unable to assist and said it needs to be dealt with further up the chain over the phone.
Over an hour on the phone today and still no resolution. They literally can't remove my sister from the joint account without his signature of approval. We stated that he has gone and is completely uncontactable (we literally have no idea where he is, and even if we did, he's such a he'd flat out refuse to sign anything or help at all).
She asked the chap on the phone how they deal with similar situations where one of the account holders could be in prison, or has passed away, or where there was abuse or domestic violence preventing the two parties from contacting each other - his response was literally "we have never come across a situation like those".....
Spoke to the Financial Ombudsman who advised that if the bank can't do it, then she will need to seek a solicitor, but they (the FO) first need in writing from Nationwide that they are unable to complete the request of removing her, and the reason they can't (no signature for example). They can't do this either. "That's not something we can do unfortunately" the guy said. We asked if they could send an email simply stating 'we are unable to complete this request without X, Y, Z being done' - to which he replied "we can't send outbound emails unfortunately".
She asked if she could then raise a complaint about it, just so there's something to send to the FO as proof. "What is the complaint about?", "the fact that you can't remove me from the account or provide a written reason as to why you can't.", "Okay I'll put the complaint in, it will take 15 days and you should hear something back. Anything else? Okay thanks for calling stay safe goodbye."
And that's where we are. Sorry for the essay, that's the very short version that only covers the most recent joint account situation
Any advice or help appreciated though, this is causing a load of stress to my sister and all of us really - this scumbag has pissed off and left a trail of st for us to clean up and we're not getting anywhere at the moment.
My sister was with a chap for a few years, without getting into the personal info, he was s
t with finances, racked up loads of debt with various companies, kept most of it hidden or downplayed..For a year or so, he moved into our parents house with my sister, while they saved for a house deposit. Long story short they split up late last year. He's since vanished and is completely uncontactable, leaving behind all of his debt and financial mess.
His last known address was my parents house, so all of his debt letters continue to be delivered there. He owes thousands. Capital One credit card, PayPal credit, overdrafts, and unpaid car finance, Sky bills and council tax (from his previous flat) and store cards that have all gone to various debt collectors.
My parents have contacted most of these companies to advise them that he no longer lives with them, he has no association with this family or address, and his whereabouts or contact info are unknown. They continue to send everything there, despite some (PayPal for example who seemed very friendly and understanding on the phone) saying thanks for letting them know, and they'd stop sending letters there...
Today, a letter from Nationwide arrived addressed to my sister and him, as they had a joint account when they were together. The account is overdrawn again and racking up charges, so he's still using it when he clearly has no money (never able to hold down a job for long).
She's tried before to have herself removed from the account when the broke up - she opened a new, single account with Nationwide, who at the time stated perfectly clearly that they would remove her from the joint account at the same time as opening her new one, effectively an account switch from a joint to a single. This never happened, she remained on the joint account.
Visited the branch, they were unable to assist and said it needs to be dealt with further up the chain over the phone.
Over an hour on the phone today and still no resolution. They literally can't remove my sister from the joint account without his signature of approval. We stated that he has gone and is completely uncontactable (we literally have no idea where he is, and even if we did, he's such a
he'd flat out refuse to sign anything or help at all).She asked the chap on the phone how they deal with similar situations where one of the account holders could be in prison, or has passed away, or where there was abuse or domestic violence preventing the two parties from contacting each other - his response was literally "we have never come across a situation like those".....
Spoke to the Financial Ombudsman who advised that if the bank can't do it, then she will need to seek a solicitor, but they (the FO) first need in writing from Nationwide that they are unable to complete the request of removing her, and the reason they can't (no signature for example). They can't do this either. "That's not something we can do unfortunately" the guy said. We asked if they could send an email simply stating 'we are unable to complete this request without X, Y, Z being done' - to which he replied "we can't send outbound emails unfortunately".
She asked if she could then raise a complaint about it, just so there's something to send to the FO as proof. "What is the complaint about?", "the fact that you can't remove me from the account or provide a written reason as to why you can't.", "Okay I'll put the complaint in, it will take 15 days and you should hear something back. Anything else? Okay thanks for calling stay safe goodbye."
And that's where we are. Sorry for the essay, that's the very short version that only covers the most recent joint account situation
Any advice or help appreciated though, this is causing a load of stress to my sister and all of us really - this scumbag has pissed off and left a trail of s
t for us to clean up and we're not getting anywhere at the moment.Edited by smithyithy on Tuesday 9th February 15:59
Whilst that's a horrible situation to be in she needs to distant herself from him financially before it takes too long to unpick especially, if she is looking to get a mortgage.
With regards to Nationwide, call them back, there is no way in hell they haven't come across this situation before, in fact I'd go as far as saying it's very common for them, try speaking to someone else or pop down to your local branch.
Some useful advice here:
https://www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/...
With regards to Nationwide, call them back, there is no way in hell they haven't come across this situation before, in fact I'd go as far as saying it's very common for them, try speaking to someone else or pop down to your local branch.
Some useful advice here:
https://www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/...
Edited by DaveH23 on Tuesday 9th February 16:15
If it’s a joint bank account it should be frozen when there is a dispute . Basically the mandate is cancelled, cards cancelled, direct debits and standing orders returned. It’s basic banking practice although it was 30 years ago when I did my banking ACIB exams. The theory is that of one party is reckless the other won’t be liable for anymore debt until the matter is sorted out. Therefore the most a single party will be liable for is the £ on freezing of the account. She should be able to cancel all direct debits and standing orders and if it’s a joint account with one to sign I can’t see why she can’t cancel the other account holders card either. From memory the only time a joint account can revert to a sole account is when one person dies. Obviously in order to proceed it’s in everyone’s interest including Nationwide to open sole accounts from that point onwards.
Cheers guys. First point of call is to freeze it then.
She hasn't used this account since they were together and I'm sure his main bank was Barclays, but somehow he's still using this one in unarranged overdraft so the charges are shared by my sister..
Will aim to get the account and cards etc frozen asap.
She hasn't used this account since they were together and I'm sure his main bank was Barclays, but somehow he's still using this one in unarranged overdraft so the charges are shared by my sister..
Will aim to get the account and cards etc frozen asap.
I had this exact situation 21 years ago, funnily enough with Nationwide!
Had a joint account with my mate as we had a house together, went our separate ways, which he wasn`t overly happy about and left me to tidy up the finances etc. Tried to close the joint account which they would not do without both of us visiting the branch in person at the same time. No dice!
The account is still there, all be it not active. They refused point blank to close it, but after a year of grief, they finally agreed to not issue any new cards or allow any activity, but still would not close it! Luckily neither of us spent on it, so not as bad.
Good luck!
Had a joint account with my mate as we had a house together, went our separate ways, which he wasn`t overly happy about and left me to tidy up the finances etc. Tried to close the joint account which they would not do without both of us visiting the branch in person at the same time. No dice!
The account is still there, all be it not active. They refused point blank to close it, but after a year of grief, they finally agreed to not issue any new cards or allow any activity, but still would not close it! Luckily neither of us spent on it, so not as bad.
Good luck!
13 DJP said:
I had this exact situation 21 years ago, funnily enough with Nationwide!
Had a joint account with my mate as we had a house together, went our separate ways, which he wasn`t overly happy about and left me to tidy up the finances etc. Tried to close the joint account which they would not do without both of us visiting the branch in person at the same time. No dice!
The account is still there, all be it not active. They refused point blank to close it, but after a year of grief, they finally agreed to not issue any new cards or allow any activity, but still would not close it! Luckily neither of us spent on it, so not as bad.
Good luck!
Its tricky.. if it could just be left dormant with no other implications then it wouldn't be the worst thing, although the overdraft needs paying off (which we know he'll never pay)..Had a joint account with my mate as we had a house together, went our separate ways, which he wasn`t overly happy about and left me to tidy up the finances etc. Tried to close the joint account which they would not do without both of us visiting the branch in person at the same time. No dice!
The account is still there, all be it not active. They refused point blank to close it, but after a year of grief, they finally agreed to not issue any new cards or allow any activity, but still would not close it! Luckily neither of us spent on it, so not as bad.
Good luck!
But are you still financially 'tied' to that person, because you're both named on an account? That's the concern really as his credit rating would drag hers down..
really dont know what Nationwide are playing at , i think its the same old story though people in customer facing roles that know fuc all
their own website mentions what i was suggesting:
https://www.nationwide.co.uk/support/support-artic...
their own website mentions what i was suggesting:
https://www.nationwide.co.uk/support/support-artic...
Ziplobb said:
If it’s a joint bank account it should be frozen when there is a dispute . Basically the mandate is cancelled, cards cancelled, direct debits and standing orders returned. It’s basic banking practice although it was 30 years ago when I did my banking ACIB exams. The theory is that of one party is reckless the other won’t be liable for anymore debt until the matter is sorted out. Therefore the most a single party will be liable for is the £ on freezing of the account. She should be able to cancel all direct debits and standing orders and if it’s a joint account with one to sign I can’t see why she can’t cancel the other account holders card either. From memory the only time a joint account can revert to a sole account is when one person dies. Obviously in order to proceed it’s in everyone’s interest including Nationwide to open sole accounts from that point onwards.
I had a joint account with HSBC which I wanted to hand over to the ex with minimal fuss. I called the bank to ask for advice and they put the account in dispute immediately despite me asking them not to. I had to call the ex to let her know that her cards no longer worked and she had no access to her money. It sounds like I got lucky when compared to the OP. I was told at the time there was no choice and all banks would do the same.
You could try & get Katie Morely at the Telegraph involved: it's the sort of story jounos love:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/katie-investigat...
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/katie-investigat...
Nationwide can freeze the account if they receive notification, in writing, of a dispute between the parties. They can't delete his name without his authority (but a deceased joint account holder will get deleted on production of a death certificate).
If you still get nowhere, ask Nationwide to confirm, in writing, that they have exhausted their complaints procedures - this then allows you to pass it on to the Financial Ombudsman (Nationwide will hate that, it costs them a lot of money!).
If you still get nowhere, ask Nationwide to confirm, in writing, that they have exhausted their complaints procedures - this then allows you to pass it on to the Financial Ombudsman (Nationwide will hate that, it costs them a lot of money!).
From bitter experience, account holders will be jointly liable for any overdraft accrued until the account is frozen, and you won't be able to close or remove yourself from it until it's cleared.
Once you get the joint account sorted, and assuming the other debts are not actually jointly held, you can contact credit reference agencies for a notice of disassociation.
Once you get the joint account sorted, and assuming the other debts are not actually jointly held, you can contact credit reference agencies for a notice of disassociation.
Vasco said:
If you still get nowhere, ask Nationwide to confirm, in writing, that they have exhausted their complaints procedures - this then allows you to pass it on to the Financial Ombudsman (Nationwide will hate that, it costs them a lot of money!).
I think this it was the FO were saying on the phone, and maybe the guy at Nationwide wasn't sure what we were asking them to give us in writing.. Hopefully the 'complaint' we asked to put in will actually follow through..Make a record and keep any written response from Nationwide.
From the point you request to have a separate account and when it was acknowledged by Nationwide then they are being negligent to let this go on. Keep a chronological order of your dealings with them.
You don't want to end up liable for the debts which have built up since the acknowledgement of separating your bank account. And waiting another 15 days will allow plenty of time for these debts to escalate.
You need to talk to someone else from Nationwide. I can't believe this sheer level of incompetence from a bank.
From the point you request to have a separate account and when it was acknowledged by Nationwide then they are being negligent to let this go on. Keep a chronological order of your dealings with them.
You don't want to end up liable for the debts which have built up since the acknowledgement of separating your bank account. And waiting another 15 days will allow plenty of time for these debts to escalate.
You need to talk to someone else from Nationwide. I can't believe this sheer level of incompetence from a bank.
Googling similar issues (joint account split, Nationwide etc) came across some posts on MSE and an other forums where people had hit a brick wall with one person / department, then dealt with someone else who sorted it no problem..
So it likely is an issue of staff training and finding the right person to deal with it..
It's an even bigger slap in the face when that god-awful Nationwide TV advert comes on with the bloke reading a poem in that dreary voice
So it likely is an issue of staff training and finding the right person to deal with it..
It's an even bigger slap in the face when that god-awful Nationwide TV advert comes on with the bloke reading a poem in that dreary voice
leef44 said:
Make a record and keep any written response from Nationwide.
From the point you request to have a separate account and when it was acknowledged by Nationwide then they are being negligent to let this go on. Keep a chronological order of your dealings with them.
You don't want to end up liable for the debts which have built up since the acknowledgement of separating your bank account. And waiting another 15 days will allow plenty of time for these debts to escalate.
You need to talk to someone else from Nationwide. I can't believe this sheer level of incompetence from a bank.
It needs to go to a very senior official at their Head Office, not local branch staff/managers.From the point you request to have a separate account and when it was acknowledged by Nationwide then they are being negligent to let this go on. Keep a chronological order of your dealings with them.
You don't want to end up liable for the debts which have built up since the acknowledgement of separating your bank account. And waiting another 15 days will allow plenty of time for these debts to escalate.
You need to talk to someone else from Nationwide. I can't believe this sheer level of incompetence from a bank.
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