Max Braked Towing Weight - Is there a 'rule of thumb'?
Discussion
I realise this isn't strictly "Law", but it felt like there might be a safety/legal angle that I'm missing here.
I'm planning to buy a bigger car and relegate my Mini to highdays and trackdays (staying road-legal, of course). One of the things it would be ideal for this car to do would be to occasionally tow the Mini to trackdays further afield (e.g. the Ring).
By my logic, the Mini (1050kg) and a downplated braked trailer (5-600kg) should be well under the limit of a car with a 2000kg max braked towing weight. However, I've read that there is a 'safety rule of thumb' about towing that says your total towed weight shouldn't exceed 85% of the car's max. The above combo is getting close to that, and might exceed if I added a spare set of wheels and tyres, for example.
Thinking back to the early 90s when my Dad dragged a full caravan, two adults, two kids, four bikes and a full boot around France with a VW Passat, we must have been well in excess of this 'rule'. I don't have memories of it feeling like the car was struggling or unsafe, but I was young at the time...
I would really rather not put a 3500kg max tow as an extra criteria for this car, for the sake of towing the Mini once or twice a year. Apologies if this question sounds naive, but in 20yrs of driving my towing experience is limited to a small trailer full of logs (and yes, I'd need to do my B+E test having only passed in 1999).
Any help is appreciated.
I'm planning to buy a bigger car and relegate my Mini to highdays and trackdays (staying road-legal, of course). One of the things it would be ideal for this car to do would be to occasionally tow the Mini to trackdays further afield (e.g. the Ring).
By my logic, the Mini (1050kg) and a downplated braked trailer (5-600kg) should be well under the limit of a car with a 2000kg max braked towing weight. However, I've read that there is a 'safety rule of thumb' about towing that says your total towed weight shouldn't exceed 85% of the car's max. The above combo is getting close to that, and might exceed if I added a spare set of wheels and tyres, for example.
Thinking back to the early 90s when my Dad dragged a full caravan, two adults, two kids, four bikes and a full boot around France with a VW Passat, we must have been well in excess of this 'rule'. I don't have memories of it feeling like the car was struggling or unsafe, but I was young at the time...
I would really rather not put a 3500kg max tow as an extra criteria for this car, for the sake of towing the Mini once or twice a year. Apologies if this question sounds naive, but in 20yrs of driving my towing experience is limited to a small trailer full of logs (and yes, I'd need to do my B+E test having only passed in 1999).
Any help is appreciated.
C70R said:
HustleRussell said:
Ensure your tow car is approved for the maximum possible weight of your trailer.
Presumably this would mean a 2000kg max tow equating to a 2000kg max weight for the trailer?
C70R said:
Appreciate the advice.
Just checking my logic here. If all of the below are true, I should be safe and legal?
- I've passed my B+E
- The trailer max weight isn't above the max weight that the car can tow
- The total weight of the trailer and Mini are less than the trailer max weight
I believe the answer is 'Yes'Just checking my logic here. If all of the below are true, I should be safe and legal?
- I've passed my B+E
- The trailer max weight isn't above the max weight that the car can tow
- The total weight of the trailer and Mini are less than the trailer max weight
MustangGT said:
C70R said:
Appreciate the advice.
Just checking my logic here. If all of the below are true, I should be safe and legal?
- I've passed my B+E
- The trailer max weight isn't above the max weight that the car can tow
- The total weight of the trailer and Mini are less than the trailer max weight
I believe the answer is 'Yes'Just checking my logic here. If all of the below are true, I should be safe and legal?
- I've passed my B+E
- The trailer max weight isn't above the max weight that the car can tow
- The total weight of the trailer and Mini are less than the trailer max weight
C Lee Farquar said:
HustleRussell said:
Ensure your tow car is approved for the maximum possible weight of your trailer.
Wasn't the Law, or interpretation of the Law on this changed?HustleRussell said:
MustangGT said:
C70R said:
Appreciate the advice.
Just checking my logic here. If all of the below are true, I should be safe and legal?
- I've passed my B+E
- The trailer max weight isn't above the max weight that the car can tow
- The total weight of the trailer and Mini are less than the trailer max weight
I believe the answer is 'Yes'Just checking my logic here. If all of the below are true, I should be safe and legal?
- I've passed my B+E
- The trailer max weight isn't above the max weight that the car can tow
- The total weight of the trailer and Mini are less than the trailer max weight
I tow both a caravan and a track car + trailer.
You're correct in that the various caravan clubs do present a rule of thumb advising caravan not to exceed 85% of tow car weight.
However they used to further suggest that for experienced towers, up to 100% could be acceptable.
Like another poster has advised, towing a car on a trailer is easier than towing a caravan so long as the weight is well balanced.
The reason is that the caravan is less aerodynamic, both head on presenting a blunt face to the wind, and also the effects of side draft from cross winds, or from airflow disruption passing lorries.
You should load your track car onto your trailer engine first. You need to get the weight of the engine slightly in front of the trailer axle.
I tow a Noble, so reverse the car onto the trailer being mid-engined. Your mini should face forwards.
You should also check the nose weight of the trailer once loaded. Ideal is to meet the max specification of the tow car, but not exceed it. This could be in the range 75kg - 135kg. Getting all of this right will avoid the trailer snaking or inducing a pendulum effect (the cause of most towing mishaps).
You're correct in that the various caravan clubs do present a rule of thumb advising caravan not to exceed 85% of tow car weight.
However they used to further suggest that for experienced towers, up to 100% could be acceptable.
Like another poster has advised, towing a car on a trailer is easier than towing a caravan so long as the weight is well balanced.
The reason is that the caravan is less aerodynamic, both head on presenting a blunt face to the wind, and also the effects of side draft from cross winds, or from airflow disruption passing lorries.
You should load your track car onto your trailer engine first. You need to get the weight of the engine slightly in front of the trailer axle.
I tow a Noble, so reverse the car onto the trailer being mid-engined. Your mini should face forwards.
You should also check the nose weight of the trailer once loaded. Ideal is to meet the max specification of the tow car, but not exceed it. This could be in the range 75kg - 135kg. Getting all of this right will avoid the trailer snaking or inducing a pendulum effect (the cause of most towing mishaps).
Jarcy said:
I tow both a caravan and a track car + trailer.
You're correct in that the various caravan clubs do present a rule of thumb advising caravan not to exceed 85% of tow car weight.
However they used to further suggest that for experienced towers, up to 100% could be acceptable.
Like another poster has advised, towing a car on a trailer is easier than towing a caravan so long as the weight is well balanced.
The reason is that the caravan is less aerodynamic, both head on presenting a blunt face to the wind, and also the effects of side draft from cross winds, or from airflow disruption passing lorries.
You should load your track car onto your trailer engine first. You need to get the weight of the engine slightly in front of the trailer axle.
I tow a Noble, so reverse the car onto the trailer being mid-engined. Your mini should face forwards.
You should also check the nose weight of the trailer once loaded. Ideal is to meet the max specification of the tow car, but not exceed it. This could be in the range 75kg - 135kg. Getting all of this right will avoid the trailer snaking or inducing a pendulum effect (the cause of most towing mishaps).
Thanks for that. A quick chat with my Dad got around to nose weight very quickly, so perhaps he wasn't as cavalier as I first though? You're correct in that the various caravan clubs do present a rule of thumb advising caravan not to exceed 85% of tow car weight.
However they used to further suggest that for experienced towers, up to 100% could be acceptable.
Like another poster has advised, towing a car on a trailer is easier than towing a caravan so long as the weight is well balanced.
The reason is that the caravan is less aerodynamic, both head on presenting a blunt face to the wind, and also the effects of side draft from cross winds, or from airflow disruption passing lorries.
You should load your track car onto your trailer engine first. You need to get the weight of the engine slightly in front of the trailer axle.
I tow a Noble, so reverse the car onto the trailer being mid-engined. Your mini should face forwards.
You should also check the nose weight of the trailer once loaded. Ideal is to meet the max specification of the tow car, but not exceed it. This could be in the range 75kg - 135kg. Getting all of this right will avoid the trailer snaking or inducing a pendulum effect (the cause of most towing mishaps).
Random thought on this.
I could conceivably see a scenario where the total weight of tow car, trailer and Mini are less than 3500kg. Even though I'm going to do my B+E regardless (given how cheap and easy it is), would there be a scenario where I was legal without it in this case?
Or should I be thinking about GVW of the tow car, which would put it over 3500kg?
I could conceivably see a scenario where the total weight of tow car, trailer and Mini are less than 3500kg. Even though I'm going to do my B+E regardless (given how cheap and easy it is), would there be a scenario where I was legal without it in this case?
Or should I be thinking about GVW of the tow car, which would put it over 3500kg?
HustleRussell said:
I don’t know what the legal standpoint is on this to be honest. I believe it is a matter of what the towing vehicle and its towing attachment is type approved for. I suspect it could get quite interesting from an insurance perspective if you were unfortunate enough to be involved in an accident and found to be towing a trailer above the weight that your car is approved to tow.
I would agree that it would be less than ideal to be carrying a greater load than permitted. I just can't see how towing a trailer that isn't overloaded for the train weight of the tow vehicle can be an issue because the trailer could carry more. It would be like halving the drink drive limit because you had drunk halfs in a pint glass.
C70R said:
Random thought on this.
I could conceivably see a scenario where the total weight of tow car, trailer and Mini are less than 3500kg. Even though I'm going to do my B+E regardless (given how cheap and easy it is), would there be a scenario where I was legal without it in this case?
Or should I be thinking about GVW of the tow car, which would put it over 3500kg?
The vehicle and trailer weights in consideration for licence rules are the MAM or ‘maximum authorised mass’ (same as GVW I believe). I think this is what is annoying C Lee Farquar. I could conceivably see a scenario where the total weight of tow car, trailer and Mini are less than 3500kg. Even though I'm going to do my B+E regardless (given how cheap and easy it is), would there be a scenario where I was legal without it in this case?
Or should I be thinking about GVW of the tow car, which would put it over 3500kg?
I towed a Caterham legally without a B+e. The MAM of the trailer was 1,350kg and the MAM of the tow car was about 2,100kg. It is probably possible for you to do similar but you’d be very limited in your choice of cars and trailers to make it work. You’d probably have to buy a smaller tow car than you’d like, down-plate the trailer and live with putting your spare wheels etc in the car rather than on the trailer.
85% advice is for caravans only
With B licence
Plated GVW of towing vehicle plus plated MAM of trailer must not add up to more than 3500kg
With B+E licence
Actual weight of trailer and its load must not exceed max tow limit of vehicle
In all cases
Do not exceed max tow weight of vehicle
Do not exceed plated MAM of trailer
Does that help?
With B licence
Plated GVW of towing vehicle plus plated MAM of trailer must not add up to more than 3500kg
With B+E licence
Actual weight of trailer and its load must not exceed max tow limit of vehicle
In all cases
Do not exceed max tow weight of vehicle
Do not exceed plated MAM of trailer
Does that help?
HustleRussell said:
The vehicle and trailer weights in consideration for licence rules are the MAM or ‘maximum authorised mass’ (same as GVW I believe). I think this is what is annoying C Lee Farquar.
I'm old enough for these things not to be a concern. 
My point was that if you have a car that is plated to tow up to 2t, you can tow a trailer plated at 3.5t as long as trailer and cargo weight does not exceed 2t when in use.
I don't believe you need to down plate a trailer to suit the tow vehicle.
C Lee Farquar said:
I'm old enough for these things not to be a concern.
My point was that if you have a car that is plated to tow up to 2t, you can tow a trailer plated at 3.5t as long as trailer and cargo weight does not exceed 2t when in use.
I don't believe you need to down plate a trailer to suit the tow vehicle.
You are 100% legally correctMy point was that if you have a car that is plated to tow up to 2t, you can tow a trailer plated at 3.5t as long as trailer and cargo weight does not exceed 2t when in use.
I don't believe you need to down plate a trailer to suit the tow vehicle.
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