Challenge plain clothes police when arrested

[Ian Geary]

I'm sure a number of police are waking up to read the Met is now advising the public to "challenge" them when being arrested by plain clothes officers.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58757375

Any ideas how that will actually work? As to me it sounds meaningless.

In the case of Sarah Everard, he had a warrant card and police equipment, which would pass any inspection.


So what further "challenge" are suspects to be afforded?

- a phone call to the police station at the point of arrest? (Which is likely to compromise further investigation)

- plain clothes officers being banned from acting alone?

- plain clothes officers not being allowed to remove a suspect until marked units arrive?

- male plain clothes police officers not being able to arrest suspects on their own, where the suspects are attractive women? (A bit provocative this one, but it gets to the crux of the issue, doesn't it?)


And what if the plain clothes officer doesn't agree with or follow these rules?

- are detained/arrested suspects allowed to fight back?

- how much force is reasonable for them to use?

- what if they overpower the police officer? Are they exempt from assault /resisting arrest charges?

(Unlikely in the male officer/female suspect situation, but if a male suspect feels his detention by a lone female undercover officer should be "challenged", shouldn't it work both ways?


The events surrounding Sarah Everard's murder were awful, but I don't see how the police (particularly plain clothes) can function if the system is designed around every single officer being another murderer?

Ian

[Turkish91]

I saw all this on a girl I knows Instagram story last night. One of the lines of "advice" was if pulled by a solo officer to ignore and keep driving to a Police station. 10+mins of that would likely see a TPAC stop / Stinger make an appearance!

Some of the advice seemed like a fast way to get yourself fully gripped up and slammed on the floor in cuffs if read the wrong way! I think the post I saw wasn't any official Met guidance though.

And all this over one very strange bad apple, who don't get me wrong deserves to rot forever... but realistically what are the chances of this actually happening again?

[DiproJanuary]

And what about situations where officers intervene off duty with their warrant card, to joe public it’ll look like a solo plain clothes officer…

[bitchstewie]

It's a giant mess.

Plenty of people asking obvious questions like how do you call 999 if a "police officer" has just arrested you?

Are you now allowed to use your phone when you're under arrest?

[porterpainter]

Totally ridiculous and knee-jerk reaction to what was a terrible, but very rare, incident involving a single person acting alone.

[R56Cooper]

porterpainter said:

Totally ridiculous and knee-jerk reaction to what was a terrible, but very rare, incident involving a single person acting alone.

Totally this. Very surprised at the extent of the advice issued by the Met.

The incident is of course totally shocking but I think I am right in saying that this situation has never happened before in the UK in the history of policing.

[Starfighter]

Turkish91 said:

I saw all this on a girl I knows Instagram story last night. One of the lines of "advice" was if pulled by a solo officer to ignore and keep driving to a Police station. 10+mins of that would likely see a TPAC stop / Stinger make an appearance!

Some of the advice seemed like a fast way to get yourself fully gripped up and slammed on the floor in cuffs if read the wrong way! I think the post I saw wasn't any official Met guidance though.

And all this over one very strange bad apple, who don't get me wrong deserves to rot forever... but realistically what are the chances of this actually happening again?

Not sure if this is still the case but some high risk / value transports used to have cards to hold up requesting an escort to a police station in case of a stop.

[55palfers]

When is Commissioner Dick going to realise that sometimes, it's best to say nothing rather than some ill thought out, knee jerk platitudes.

Now they're dragging a random bus driver into a potentially incendiary situation where they too may be nicked for resisting arrest?

[DiproJanuary]

Saw this earlier.
Doesn’t even mention plain clothes. Pretty much all cops aside from perhaps night shift are solo crewed. So now people are being encourage to resist arrest if a solo uniform male cop tries to cuff them?

[Psycho Warren]

just put all men in prison and be done with it. Maybe then they will be happy?

[Gilhooligan]

DiproJanuary said:

Saw this earlier.
Doesn’t even mention plain clothes. Pretty much all cops aside from perhaps night shift are solo crewed. So now people are being encourage to resist arrest if a solo uniform male cop tries to cuff them?

Sounds like great advice, if you want to get arrested. Typical knee jerk, hysterical response to an isolated, albeit horrendous, incident.

[carreauchompeur]

DiproJanuary said:

Saw this earlier.
Doesn’t even mention plain clothes. Pretty much all cops aside from perhaps night shift are solo crewed. So now people are being encourage to resist arrest if a solo uniform male cop tries to cuff them?

This is incredibly bad, and incorrect advice which will lead to massive issues if followed. Resisting arrest, driving off, calling people will simply go wrong.

I’m angry at the moment. Angry at the subhuman scum for misusing his position in this way, but also angry at a kneejerk, politically motivated reaction which will make the lives of everyday cops out on the streets much harder.

And will be another thing used by female offenders to get away with things… I can see it now.

It’s good that women’s safety is highlighted in this way, but how many times in the history of UK Policing has this ever happened?

[Donbot]

I wonder if they would provide a female arresting officer if I'm worried about being arrested by a predatory homosexual.

[covboy]

I've asked this question before. Would anyone recognise a genuine Warrant Card when shown ?

[DiproJanuary]

covboy said:

I've asked this question before. Would anyone recognise a genuine Warrant Card when shown ?

Nope and they vary force by force so not even an officer would know what another forces is supposed to say or look like!

[bitchstewie]

covboy said:

I've asked this question before. Would anyone recognise a genuine Warrant Card when shown ?

Nope.

[Tommo87]

I guess, thIs is what happens when the politicians throw their considerable top heavy weight around.

‘Just do anything, so I can tell the voting public that I was effective’.

[Turkish91]

DiproJanuary said:

Saw this earlier.
Doesn’t even mention plain clothes. Pretty much all cops aside from perhaps night shift are solo crewed. So now people are being encourage to resist arrest if a solo uniform male cop tries to cuff them?

This was the one I saw on a friend's Instagram story. Poor advice I think

[Greendubber]

Turkish91 said:

DiproJanuary said:

Saw this earlier.
Doesn’t even mention plain clothes. Pretty much all cops aside from perhaps night shift are solo crewed. So now people are being encourage to resist arrest if a solo uniform male cop tries to cuff them?

This was the one I saw on a friend's Instagram story. Poor advice I think

Very poor indeed

[Evil.soup]

It really is an awful situation and the fella should rot for it and the police are seeing to it that this will be the case.

There have been bad people that do bad things in all walks of life since life began, it doesn't mean everyone from those individual trades, religions, backgrounds etc. should be singled out as potential attackers because of the actions of the few.

It is just like saying that anyone who is a Muslim is potentially a terrorist by association so should be treated as such in certain circumstances e.g. while on public transport or carrying a bag in public.

Or how about school care takers, should there be rules that state they cannot interact with, talk to or have any contact with school children within or outside of their place of work?

It really is that ridiculous and the police should be allowed to continue to uphold the law regardless of sex, race or religion. Dangerous deranged people exist everywhere, I think it's important not to empower these deviants with instilling fear towards anyone they may be associated with.