This Country. Are We Doomed?
Discussion
It seems that the pandemic has highlighted just how lazy, uninterested and selfish a lot of people are.
This morning I though some of my faith was restored. The recycling bin was full and I had a plastic bag with bits of card in it from a large box I cut up. Left it next to the wheelie bin with one of the wheels anchoring the bag down. I went out and on my return, saw the bins had been emptied (because they were next door, where the truck stopped). No bag of cardboard. All is forgiven today. No chance. Talking to my neighbour and he said they didn't take it. In fact, soon after they moved the wheelie bin the bag was blown down the road. I found it about 10 houses down.
Everything is just threadbare; the waste collection teams. Double/triple workload and s
tty pay. The business model for this usually transpires to, 'not my job' and the absolute bare minimum is done in between the multiple fag and tea breaks.
Is it really that difficult to include an extra bag in the collection? Then there's the 'dude, where's my bin?' issue every week.
The landscape is looking quite bleak. Dealerships have laid off staff and increased the duties/workload for the retained staff. They're all getting pissed off. Council offices have no funding. The NHS is stretched. My nextdoor neighbour puts in a planning application; nothing to notify me; the council didn't contact any of the neighbouring properties but we were all mean to be psychic and. 'should have looked online', but eight law firms managed to contact us offering their PWA expertise (that's how we got to know about the event, and by them it had been passed with no objections).
It's all a bit st isn't it? Everywhere you go. Or is my GOMS kicking in to Victor Meldrew mode?
This morning I though some of my faith was restored. The recycling bin was full and I had a plastic bag with bits of card in it from a large box I cut up. Left it next to the wheelie bin with one of the wheels anchoring the bag down. I went out and on my return, saw the bins had been emptied (because they were next door, where the truck stopped). No bag of cardboard. All is forgiven today. No chance. Talking to my neighbour and he said they didn't take it. In fact, soon after they moved the wheelie bin the bag was blown down the road. I found it about 10 houses down.
Everything is just threadbare; the waste collection teams. Double/triple workload and s
tty pay. The business model for this usually transpires to, 'not my job' and the absolute bare minimum is done in between the multiple fag and tea breaks. Is it really that difficult to include an extra bag in the collection? Then there's the 'dude, where's my bin?' issue every week.
The landscape is looking quite bleak. Dealerships have laid off staff and increased the duties/workload for the retained staff. They're all getting pissed off. Council offices have no funding. The NHS is stretched. My nextdoor neighbour puts in a planning application; nothing to notify me; the council didn't contact any of the neighbouring properties but we were all mean to be psychic and. 'should have looked online', but eight law firms managed to contact us offering their PWA expertise (that's how we got to know about the event, and by them it had been passed with no objections).
It's all a bit s
t isn't it? Everywhere you go. Or is my GOMS kicking in to Victor Meldrew mode? We are reaping the whirlwind of decades of relatively lax immigration laws combined with a relatively generous benefits system.
Low-paid work is now seen as optional by the indigenous population, supported by the state.
I've been saying for years that you can either let migrant labour in but have a very skeletal benefits system, OR have very tightly-controlled migration and a generous benefits system.
<insert random OP flame for putting the wrong thing out for recycling>
Low-paid work is now seen as optional by the indigenous population, supported by the state.
I've been saying for years that you can either let migrant labour in but have a very skeletal benefits system, OR have very tightly-controlled migration and a generous benefits system.
<insert random OP flame for putting the wrong thing out for recycling>
Ignore the media and live your own life imho. I'd say that pretty much fk all is different we just get all these bad news stories every day from multiple media outlets. Also don't worry about stuff you can't change - can you change it then change it, can't change it then forget it.
Until or unless they erode freedom of choice then we can all still do what we want.
TX.
k all is different we just get all these bad news stories every day from multiple media outlets. Also don't worry about stuff you can't change - can you change it then change it, can't change it then forget it.Until or unless they erode freedom of choice then we can all still do what we want.
TX.
Best thing the UK can do at the moment is practically scrap benefits. You don't work - you don't eat! Such is the mentality that has propped up the UK economy over the last decade or so with an Eastern European workforce.
Reminds me of a picture i saw some years back with 5 or 6 UK road workers standing around drinking tea whilst one guy was hard at work in the middle of them all. He was that Polish guy.
UK work ethic amongst our low skilled workers is pitiful compared to an Eastern European equivalent workforce.
We are down to bins every 3 weeks. The local authority justified the 5% increase in Council Tax shortly after for "adult education".
The refuse section was 250 people about 10 years ago. Then they cut it down to 150.
They moved to manpower and saved about 30% on staffing costs.
Since then they have reduced it even further and AFAIK they only have about 40 full time staff now. Everyone else is agency.
Back in the day a bin lorry driver would also drive the road sweepers and gritters. Now the council have split all the teams up and made each a LTD company. So roads are now managed by a company not the council. So now a bin lorry driver just drives the bin lorry. If the road needs sweeping they get the LTD company to raise a PO and then sub that work out to a local firm who charge £££ per day.
Really not a great use of money tbh but its the way most local councils have gone. All open to serious abuse too.
The refuse section was 250 people about 10 years ago. Then they cut it down to 150.
They moved to manpower and saved about 30% on staffing costs.
Since then they have reduced it even further and AFAIK they only have about 40 full time staff now. Everyone else is agency.
Back in the day a bin lorry driver would also drive the road sweepers and gritters. Now the council have split all the teams up and made each a LTD company. So roads are now managed by a company not the council. So now a bin lorry driver just drives the bin lorry. If the road needs sweeping they get the LTD company to raise a PO and then sub that work out to a local firm who charge £££ per day.
Really not a great use of money tbh but its the way most local councils have gone. All open to serious abuse too.
VAG parts. "Because of COVID", they're trying it on by first of all increasing the list/retail price and at the same time chopping off the trade discount we used to get.
Karen doesn't want to be helpful when I'm in the shop that employs her, yet expects people to be courteous to her on the road when she's rushing back to pick up the kids.
Yesterday there was a tailback of cars on a road where there never is any problem. It was a mum, not strapping her kid in with the door wide open, but feeding her little cherub treats. The door wide open as buses/cars/trucks stop, waited her to finish so they could pass.
Also: owner drivers delivering for Next et al. Parcels piles up to the ceiling in their privately insured cars. Passenger seat loaded and blocking the driver's view of the road to his left. I bet they've not declared this activity on their insurance or made provisions for PLI. But carry on driving until something bad happens, and let's talk about this then, eh?
On the subject of roads: beggars. They get dropped off in time for school runs. When will anything be done to deter them from walking between cars at busy junctions? The 'elf and safety brigade need to give them hi viz jackets too, or do they not count until one of them gets splatted?
Karen doesn't want to be helpful when I'm in the shop that employs her, yet expects people to be courteous to her on the road when she's rushing back to pick up the kids.
Yesterday there was a tailback of cars on a road where there never is any problem. It was a mum, not strapping her kid in with the door wide open, but feeding her little cherub treats. The door wide open as buses/cars/trucks stop, waited her to finish so they could pass.
Also: owner drivers delivering for Next et al. Parcels piles up to the ceiling in their privately insured cars. Passenger seat loaded and blocking the driver's view of the road to his left. I bet they've not declared this activity on their insurance or made provisions for PLI. But carry on driving until something bad happens, and let's talk about this then, eh?
On the subject of roads: beggars. They get dropped off in time for school runs. When will anything be done to deter them from walking between cars at busy junctions? The 'elf and safety brigade need to give them hi viz jackets too, or do they not count until one of them gets splatted?
gotoPzero said:
We are down to bins every 3 weeks. The local authority justified the 5% increase in Council Tax shortly after for "adult education".
People are at home more, or are staying in more than they did before the pandemic. More and more stuff is being delivered to homes. Order a pen from Amazon and look at the size of the box it comes in. Order three things on the same transaction and you could get three different deliveries on the same day. Even more boxes. Moar recycling. And then you get sh*t like this happening
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-3...
A £2Bn project... mad.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-3...
A £2Bn project... mad.
A sense of entitlement replacing responsibility has been steadily and stealthily growing since the mid 90s. There's now a generation that have left University with a Degree when before they would have left a College with a Certificate. Those people believe that they are entitled to a job and a life promised to them by those that made access to that degree attainable to them. If you've a BA Hons', why would you accept a job on the bins?
The problem is that by and large those degrees have enabled more kids to move further up and onwards than if they'd just done college. The void this created was previously filled by migrant workers - and filled very well. The average binman's monthly wage in the UK is around five times that of Romania so the desire and dedication from those who came was much higher than the indigenous population who saw that wage as derisory.
A new void has now been created which is being filled by a combination of the previously unemployable and those who'd prefer to just take benefits but have been forced into work. This is a group of people incapable of understanding the concept of 'service' or 'personal responsibility' and the best you can hope for is that they simply do what they are told to.
This is temporary of course - but the extent of temporary in this context will last, conservatively, at least 10 years. Until then, we're going to have to get used to the UK resembling 1980s Moscow at times.
And before anyone responds on the belief that this is another dig at Brexit, it isn't. It's a dig at the ineptitude of the processes that are at play. If you are going to suddenly remove hundreds of thousands of workers, there's the reasonable expectation that measures will have been put in place to replace them with equal suddenness and the fact that this seems not to be the case is as puzzling as it is stupid. Sure there's labour shortages in Europe too but the difference is that they're still getting their bins emptied, able to fill up their cars and shelves in supermarkets remained stocked so we have to look at what's different about the UK.
I don't believe we're doomed. We do have great strength. But that strength needs to be deployed with a whole heap more efficiency and skill than is currently evidenced.
The problem is that by and large those degrees have enabled more kids to move further up and onwards than if they'd just done college. The void this created was previously filled by migrant workers - and filled very well. The average binman's monthly wage in the UK is around five times that of Romania so the desire and dedication from those who came was much higher than the indigenous population who saw that wage as derisory.
A new void has now been created which is being filled by a combination of the previously unemployable and those who'd prefer to just take benefits but have been forced into work. This is a group of people incapable of understanding the concept of 'service' or 'personal responsibility' and the best you can hope for is that they simply do what they are told to.
This is temporary of course - but the extent of temporary in this context will last, conservatively, at least 10 years. Until then, we're going to have to get used to the UK resembling 1980s Moscow at times.
And before anyone responds on the belief that this is another dig at Brexit, it isn't. It's a dig at the ineptitude of the processes that are at play. If you are going to suddenly remove hundreds of thousands of workers, there's the reasonable expectation that measures will have been put in place to replace them with equal suddenness and the fact that this seems not to be the case is as puzzling as it is stupid. Sure there's labour shortages in Europe too but the difference is that they're still getting their bins emptied, able to fill up their cars and shelves in supermarkets remained stocked so we have to look at what's different about the UK.
I don't believe we're doomed. We do have great strength. But that strength needs to be deployed with a whole heap more efficiency and skill than is currently evidenced.
Benefits for healthy working aged people should be capped at the equivalent to full time earnings at minimum wage.
Minimum wage should be reviewed regularly and should actually be enough to reasonably live on, it could be different for different regions or not (discuss).
Then people may then chose to live on benefits or work and earn more, families shouldn't be penalised for working but should be rewarded, but equally, choosing not to work should only provide an amount adequate to live on.
Social housing of a good standard should be provided where necessary, but if no-one in the household works then the house doesn't need to be in the most expensive areas of the country. Also, there should be an absolute maximum of 5 bedrooms, if you choose to pop out sprog after sprog then sorry, but they are going to have to share a bedroom.
Minimum wage should be reviewed regularly and should actually be enough to reasonably live on, it could be different for different regions or not (discuss).
Then people may then chose to live on benefits or work and earn more, families shouldn't be penalised for working but should be rewarded, but equally, choosing not to work should only provide an amount adequate to live on.
Social housing of a good standard should be provided where necessary, but if no-one in the household works then the house doesn't need to be in the most expensive areas of the country. Also, there should be an absolute maximum of 5 bedrooms, if you choose to pop out sprog after sprog then sorry, but they are going to have to share a bedroom.
aholes here empty the bins and leave them strategically placed in the middle of the driveway entrance.
If the cars are on the drive or not. If we’re out we need to stop and block the road to move the bins to get the car onto the drive. Plenty of space to put them to the side.
No way I’m giving them a tip when they knock this Christmas.
holes here empty the bins and leave them strategically placed in the middle of the driveway entrance.If the cars are on the drive or not. If we’re out we need to stop and block the road to move the bins to get the car onto the drive. Plenty of space to put them to the side.
No way I’m giving them a tip when they knock this Christmas.
Edited by Vee on Wednesday 6th October 21:10
vikingaero said:
All people can say nowadays is: Der Gubbermint...
Nothing about doing it yourself, planning or an element of personal responsibility.
I agree. You can hear it everytime food banks are discussed. Nothing about doing it yourself, planning or an element of personal responsibility.
The Government aren't doing anything about the problem. Sorry, thats your responsibility as an adult.
I feel sorry for the bin men, they’re doing a job very few people would be willing to do and they get all kinds of crap left out for them and people giving them st. They don’t want to have to untie a bag and empty it into the back of a truck, the bins get hooked on and emptied into the cart automatically, then they do what with the empty bag, put it in their pocket? You’re just one person, imagine if everyone left an extra bag out for them.
If you think we’ve got problems then speak to a Greek person, the unbelievable ineptitude and corruption from local level all the way to the PM, who’s the worst of all. And there’s plenty of countries far, far worse than that.
t. They don’t want to have to untie a bag and empty it into the back of a truck, the bins get hooked on and emptied into the cart automatically, then they do what with the empty bag, put it in their pocket? You’re just one person, imagine if everyone left an extra bag out for them.If you think we’ve got problems then speak to a Greek person, the unbelievable ineptitude and corruption from local level all the way to the PM, who’s the worst of all. And there’s plenty of countries far, far worse than that.
I've seen a few times, a street lamp or road sign gets hit by a car. It's taped up until it can be replaced. When it eventually is, it's a metre or two away from the original which is still there. Why wouldn't the whole job cover removal of the stump!!
Also: the state of the roads, especially in busy cities. London roads are awful. It's not just the road surface/substrate, but the crap at the roadside. Most roads have never seen a sweeper/been swept for years.
Motorways: tyre/debris? Leave it up against the armco out of the way. We'll sort that out another time.
Also: the state of the roads, especially in busy cities. London roads are awful. It's not just the road surface/substrate, but the crap at the roadside. Most roads have never seen a sweeper/been swept for years.
Motorways: tyre/debris? Leave it up against the armco out of the way. We'll sort that out another time.
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