Z4 3.0SI 265bhp To Fiesta ST Mk7

[SiberianHills]

As per title i currently own a Z4 E85, the car is starting to cost me a lot with regards to repairs now that it is 14 years old and on 120k. Due to circumstances changing I am looking to sell and get somthing new. My budget is 9-10k, ideally on the lower side of this.

My requirements for the new car are as follows;

Cheaper to run than the Z4 (fuel, insurance and tax)
Cheaper general maintenance costs than the Z4
Cheaper repair costs than the Z4
Something with similar power to the Z4
Exciting and fun to drive
No older than 10 years
60,000 miles or less.
Great daily driver


I've been looking at everything from TTS, RS250/265, 125D's A5 3.0TDI etc but everything falls outside of my budget or doesn't tick all the boxes.

For some reason though, I keep coming back to the Fiesta ST Mk7. It literally ticks all the boxes, cheaper, exciting and fun to drive, requirements fall within my budget, great daily driver and as much as I like the Z4, i quite fancy a hot hatch again. I never really gelled with the Z4 as much as I thought I would.

Now the only thing the Fiesta falls down on is power. 180bhp vs 265bhp. 0-60 in 6.9 seconds compared to the Z4 at 5.7 (I know I know, willy waving numbers).

My question is, will the lack of power compared to the Z4 be a big difference and will i be disappointed? Am I making a big downgrade? I know the Fiesta is a rocket on B roads but how do they fair on straight roads / overtaking etc? Has anyone driven both?

[Jim the Sunderer]

The bloody thing bounces like fk on the best straight roads.
Though I think they revised the suspension on later models.

[Sslink]

Get an ST and a remap. Sorted.

[Xcore]

St with a map will probably feel pretty pokey due to the turbos torque dump

[RoVoFob]

SiberianHills said:

As per title i currently own a Z4 E85, the car is starting to cost me a lot with regards to repairs now that it is 14 years old and on 120k. Due to circumstances changing I am looking to sell and get somthing new. My budget is 9-10k, ideally on the lower side of this.

My requirements for the new car are as follows;

Cheaper to run than the Z4 (fuel, insurance and tax)
Cheaper general maintenance costs than the Z4
Cheaper repair costs than the Z4
Something with similar power to the Z4
Exciting and fun to drive
No older than 10 years
60,000 miles or less.
Great daily driver


I've been looking at everything from TTS, RS250/265, 125D's A5 3.0TDI etc but everything falls outside of my budget or doesn't tick all the boxes.

For some reason though, I keep coming back to the Fiesta ST Mk7. It literally ticks all the boxes, cheaper, exciting and fun to drive, requirements fall within my budget, great daily driver and as much as I like the Z4, i quite fancy a hot hatch again. I never really gelled with the Z4 as much as I thought I would.

Now the only thing the Fiesta falls down on is power. 180bhp vs 265bhp. 0-60 in 6.9 seconds compared to the Z4 at 5.7 (I know I know, willy waving numbers).

My question is, will the lack of power compared to the Z4 be a big difference and will i be disappointed? Am I making a big downgrade? I know the Fiesta is a rocket on B roads but how do they fair on straight roads / overtaking etc? Has anyone driven both?

Going from a naturally aspirated, six-pot, rear-wheel-drive sports car to a Fiesta might feel like a big step down. It’s a great hot hatch, but it’s still a Fiesta - which is good and bad.

If finances/repair costs are a big part of the move, why not go for a 130i? It’s the same engine you’re used to and the car is only 55kg heavier, but it’s also much cheaper to buy.

Really decent ones should be available from £6k or so upwards for relatively low mileage cars, so you don’t need to worry so much about age/reliability, as you can hold a bit of cash back for maintenance. The car is still pretty reliable for something of this age and performance anyway and there’s no guarantee that something different would have fewer issues.

Might be worth thinking about, if nothing else appeals - for me it’s an excellent blend of fun and decent daily driver traits.

[colin79666]

Not so sure the mark 7 Fiesta ST is a great daily, depends on your commute and personal peferences I suppose. Very firm ride makes for some great B road weekend fun but you won't be laughing if you spend a long time on poor urban surfaces or have a long motorway run to get to work every day. I'd caveat that I have never driven a mark 7 but I did run a mark 8 for a while which by all accounts has a better ride but I still wouldn't want to have used that daily for commuting. Do a good test drive before committing if you do pursue the Fiesta idea.

[ZX10R NIN]

SiberianHills said:

As per title i currently own a Z4 E85, the car is starting to cost me a lot with regards to repairs now that it is 14 years old and on 120k. Due to circumstances changing I am looking to sell and get somthing new. My budget is 9-10k, ideally on the lower side of this.

My requirements for the new car are as follows;

Cheaper to run than the Z4 (fuel, insurance and tax)
Cheaper general maintenance costs than the Z4
Cheaper repair costs than the Z4
Something with similar power to the Z4
Exciting and fun to drive
No older than 10 years
60,000 miles or less.
Great daily driver


I've been looking at everything from TTS, RS250/265, 125D's A5 3.0TDI etc but everything falls outside of my budget or doesn't tick all the boxes.

For some reason though, I keep coming back to the Fiesta ST Mk7. It literally ticks all the boxes, cheaper, exciting and fun to drive, requirements fall within my budget, great daily driver and as much as I like the Z4, i quite fancy a hot hatch again. I never really gelled with the Z4 as much as I thought I would.

Now the only thing the Fiesta falls down on is power. 180bhp vs 265bhp. 0-60 in 6.9 seconds compared to the Z4 at 5.7 (I know I know, willy waving numbers).

My question is, will the lack of power compared to the Z4 be a big difference and will i be disappointed? Am I making a big downgrade? I know the Fiesta is a rocket on B roads but how do they fair on straight roads / overtaking etc? Has anyone driven both?

You won't be making a big downgrade they're cracking steers power wise as others have said a remap will see you right.

For me there are two other cars that are both very good steers:

Peugeot Sport 208 GTI

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202105152...

The other option is the Astra GTC VXR lot of power with a chassis that's a smidge behind the Megane RS but you'll get a nice example with sensible/low miles on the clock for you budget:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202110018...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202109097...

[ChrisH72]

I went from an e92 325i to a mk7 ST with no regrets.

Not quite the same as a z4 but the BMW was still rwd, straight 6 and manual box so I did worry a bit about down grading.

The fiesta is so much fun to drive and has more than enough poke for me. A remap would increase power but I can't be bothered. In standard tune it's not lightning fast but you can have a lot of fun without risking your license. Build quality is nowhere near the BMW but you wouldn't expect it to be. The ride is pretty hard but it is a hot hatch and I find it okay as a daily.

So far with just over a year in the fiesta I've only had routine servicing and new front brakes last week. Parts seem reasonable with front discs and pads costing £190 at a local garage. It's certainly been a lot cheaper to run than the 325i which is good.

They're good cars, go and try one.

[RoVoFob]

ChrisH72 said:

I went from an e92 325i to a mk7 ST with no regrets.

Not quite the same as a z4 but the BMW was still rwd, straight 6 and manual box so I did worry a bit about down grading.

The fiesta is so much fun to drive and has more than enough poke for me. A remap would increase power but I can't be bothered. In standard tune it's not lightning fast but you can have a lot of fun without risking your license. Build quality is nowhere near the BMW but you wouldn't expect it to be. The ride is pretty hard but it is a hot hatch and I find it okay as a daily.

So far with just over a year in the fiesta I've only had routine servicing and new front brakes last week. Parts seem reasonable with front discs and pads costing £190 at a local garage. It's certainly been a lot cheaper to run than the 325i which is good.

They're good cars, go and try one.

I rate the Fiesta ST, but having gone from a Fiesta ST - albeit a mk6 - to an E46 325ti and then three 130is, I found the sound, low driving position and overall rear-wheel-drive feel of the BMWs much more enjoyable than the extra agility of the Ford. I have driven a number of mk7 and mk8 Fiesta STs and that still stands.

The mk7 ST is a great affordable hot hatch, but I’d say it has a much narrower appeal; great for agility, direct steering, whizzing around country roads and low running costs but less enjoyable for longer journeys or anything other than bombing around.

Which elements of the BMW do you value most @SiberianHills? Does the Fiesta offer those…?

[ChrisH72]

Obviously I don't know the OP's circumstances but if they drive a z4 I'd say it's unlikely that they do a lot of long distance driving. I would agree that a fiesta ST is not the best choice for someone who spends most of their time on the motorway. My annual mileage is very low, probably around 4k at most. That said the previous owner managed 67k in 3 years which is some going!

Reading the original post the emphasis seems to be on reducing running costs while keeping a bit of fun. Also changing from a 2 seat sports car to a hot hatchback otherwise surely an mx5 would be best. I had a rude awakening with running costs for the BMW. A year into ownership threw up a bill for over £2k for injectors and NOX sensor. Until then the biggest car bill I'd had in 30 odd years had been about £300. I did like the BMW but I knew it was coming up to having to fork out a lot for maintenance which is really why I went back to Ford.

For what the OP is after I would be sticking with a hot supermini like the ST or a 208.

[PH User]

The Z4 is more of an occasion to sit in, but a Megane RS is way more fun to drive, so that's what I would go with.

[Z4MCSL]

I've got a z43.0si coupe I am getting rid of so cam probably give some relevant opinions

I like the z4 but equally I haven't quite gelled with it, it's the top end that it lacks compared to the M which for me makes the engine less enjoyable.

My other half has a TTS and I'm not a fan at all. It doesn't feel engaging, feels heavy and I'm not a fan of the interior and visibility etc.


I have a 182 which is stripped for track work but even before I stripped it i LOVED it. And I preferred driving it ro the Z4. Yes less power etc but it's so much more fun to apply it. Now it's much lighter it feels alot quicker.

I also have a megane rs275 trophy which I love and i enjoy driving way more than the z4. You could probably pick up a decent 250 cup for 10k maybe less and they are basically the same car. They are also very mappable.

I can't comment on the Fiesta but I would say that because the way the 3.0si delivers the power is quite....relaxed...rather than frenetic! then I think you will still enjoy/prefer many cars that on paper are slower.

[acme]

I’ve had a 2017 (so late & supposedly softer suspension) ST for 2.5 years.

It’s a great car & is everything you’d have read; seemingly pivots around you, is great fun on a B road, good noise from the 4 pot (relatively), & in ST3 form well specced. The build quality etc doesn’t bother me either & the cabin works well.

But, it’s focus on fun means it’s a compromised daily IMO; seating position is terrible, & the seats are far too narrow & uncomfortable & I’m slim.

A great car overall but make sure it’s going to do the daily well enough for you.

I also have an E92 M3 for comparison, albeit a totally different car!

[davey68]

Also own a late mk7 ST-3 and the suspension is certainly more forgiving than earlier cars. I think it received the ST200 suspension/ARB set up when that car was released to simplify production in Cologne. I had the Mountune MP215 upgrade from new and although not a massive difference over standard it does pull a little better higher in the rev range and certainly has more mid range (236lbft). I daily mine and still really love driving it. I like the Mk8 but it's a large outlay to buy one for what is probably only a marginally better car.

[Terry Tibbs]

St owner here too, mines had the mountune mp215 remap.
Awesome car, devours B roads, my commute is 10 miles across country and I always look forward to going to work (not always getting there though..)

Yes the suspension is firm but the pay off is terrific handling.
Running costs are good - cheap tax, mines sitting at 39mpg and decent tyres are less than £100 a corner.

It’s not a perfect car by any means but if your priority is fun then you owe it to yourself to at least get a test drive.

[survivalist]

acme said:

I’ve had a 2017 (so late & supposedly softer suspension) ST for 2.5 years.

It’s a great car & is everything you’d have read; seemingly pivots around you, is great fun on a B road, good noise from the 4 pot (relatively), & in ST3 form well specced. The build quality etc doesn’t bother me either & the cabin works well.

But, it’s focus on fun means it’s a compromised daily IMO; seating position is terrible, & the seats are far too narrow & uncomfortable & I’m slim.

A great car overall but make sure it’s going to do the daily well enough for you.

I also have an E92 M3 for comparison, albeit a totally different car!

Would be interested to see hear how the M3 and Fiesta compare.

I’ve currently got an E92 M3 and, coming from a tuned 130i and Z4M, sometimes the M3 didn’t feel as raw and exciting as those did. Part of the problem might also be that I find myself mostly on smaller roads where it’s a challenge to find space to stretch the engines legs.

[acme]

survivalist said:

Would be interested to see hear how the M3 and Fiesta compare.

I’ve currently got an E92 M3 and, coming from a tuned 130i and Z4M, sometimes the M3 didn’t feel as raw and exciting as those did. Part of the problem might also be that I find myself mostly on smaller roads where it’s a challenge to find space to stretch the engines legs.

I understand your comment, at low speeds it can feel fairly ordinary, that is until you lower the window and listen to that engine! Likewise I’m surrounded by great B roads and this limits your ability to stretch the engine, plus the engine taking so long to get to temperature, assuming you have mechanical sympathy.

I was thinking of replacing both with one car, so tested a M140, I’m sure it’s a great car in its own right, but getting back in the M3 made me realise the M lites are very light on the M criteria we take for granted, and that engine is quite incredible, even when at low speeds it dominates in a way few others do (obvious I appreciate but it’s easy to forget this)

Chalk & cheese really, obvious I appreciate. The ST pound for pound is superb value for money & knocks socks off the E92 in that respect. Of course you can use more of the performance more often, safely, and as all the reports suggest it seemingly pivots around the drivers seat, but the seating position is very poor, far to high, and the seats are uncomfortable, and then there's the ride quality, it makes the M3 seem like a limo!

[survivalist]

acme said:

survivalist said:

Would be interested to see hear how the M3 and Fiesta compare.

I’ve currently got an E92 M3 and, coming from a tuned 130i and Z4M, sometimes the M3 didn’t feel as raw and exciting as those did. Part of the problem might also be that I find myself mostly on smaller roads where it’s a challenge to find space to stretch the engines legs.

I understand your comment, at low speeds it can feel fairly ordinary, that is until you lower the window and listen to that engine! Likewise I’m surrounded by great B roads and this limits your ability to stretch the engine, plus the engine taking so long to get to temperature, assuming you have mechanical sympathy.

I was thinking of replacing both with one car, so tested a M140, I’m sure it’s a great car in its own right, but getting back in the M3 made me realise the M lites are very light on the M criteria we take for granted, and that engine is quite incredible, even when at low speeds it dominates in a way few others do (obvious I appreciate but it’s easy to forget this)

Chalk & cheese really, obvious I appreciate. The ST pound for pound is superb value for money & knocks socks off the E92 in that respect. Of course you can use more of the performance more often, safely, and as all the reports suggest it seemingly pivots around the drivers seat, but the seating position is very poor, far to high, and the seats are uncomfortable, and then there's the ride quality, it makes the M3 seem like a limo!

Think I need to test drive a few other cars. Either they’ll remind me why I should keep he M3 or reveal themselves as a brilliant replacement .

My original plan was to replace the Z4M with an M3 due to having children. 2 years in I’ve still not sold the Z4 as the package is so unique I think I’d regret it.

On the other hand, the similarities between the Z4 and M3 (relative rarity, screaming NA engine) are making me think I should get something a bit different. It’s just a case of deciding whether to sell the 2 or 4 seater.

I too have considered the M-Lites, but the issue is that once you modify them to feel special your are back into M money and you don’t get they outlay back when you sell.

[acme]

survivalist said:

Think I need to test drive a few other cars. Either they’ll remind me why I should keep he M3 or reveal themselves as a brilliant replacement .

My original plan was to replace the Z4M with an M3 due to having children. 2 years in I’ve still not sold the Z4 as the package is so unique I think I’d regret it.

On the other hand, the similarities between the Z4 and M3 (relative rarity, screaming NA engine) are making me think I should get something a bit different. It’s just a case of deciding whether to sell the 2 or 4 seater.

I too have considered the M-Lites, but the issue is that once you modify them to feel special your are back into M money and you don’t get they outlay back when you sell.

It sounds like we’re in a similar (ish) situation. I’d definitely recommend getting a drive in something you’re considering to then assess if you’d be ‘better’ off. I also test drove a FK8 Civic. On the way back in the M3 I had one of my best drives & it made me really appreciate that engine. Albeit it’s unfair to compare a turbo four pot & the S65. (Still want a FK8 though!)

I can also fully understand your comment about having something different. I try to stick to Harry Metcalfe’s philosophy in his garage of having different cars. I also have a 993 & was concerned when I got the E92 that it’d be too similar. I was very wrong.

When I asked the question about going E92 to M140 the responses alluded to the costs to sort the obvious issues etc & that I’d be disappointed. I tried one & in the wet I had little chance to fairly test it, but it felt ordinary. Granted having an M3 as my first BM I’ve been spoilt.

Apologies to the OP for going off topic.