Permanent remote job but contract states office location

[Matt..]

I have a permanent remote job where very occasional trips to the office might be required (but expenses paid), however, my contract gives an office location and doesn't mention remote. Should my contract state the role is fully remote with occasional office trips?

Thanks

[Puggit]

One downside I can think of is claiming tax relief for working from home. In the unlikely even HMRC ask to see evidence, your contract will state you should be in the office.

I've worked from home for 6 years, and they've never asked!

[randlemarcus]

Big downside is two or three years down the line, when someone decides that they wont pay expenses from Oop North to that Lunnon. Flag it with HR, get it changed.

[Countdown]

Matt.. said:

I have a permanent remote job where very occasional trips to the office might be required (but expenses paid), however, my contract gives an office location and doesn't mention remote. Should my contract state the role is fully remote with occasional office trips?

Thanks

It should, otherwise Home to Office expenses become taxable.

[R56Cooper]

Sounds like a simple error in the contract that just needs correcting as you suggest.

[devnull]

Yes it should state that your “normal
Place of work is your home office” or something to that effect.

[craigjm]

devnull said:

Yes it should state that your “normal
Place of work is your home office” or something to that effect.

This. If it doesnt say this and lists an office location then the contract is for an office based job at that location.

[crofty1984]

craigjm said:

devnull said:

Yes it should state that your “normal
Place of work is your home office” or something to that effect.

This. If it doesnt say this and lists an office location then the contract is for an office based job at that location.

Yup, just a simple change to something like "The role is home-based. Travel to your local office based in - may occasionally be required."

[craigjm]

crofty1984 said:

craigjm said:

devnull said:

Yes it should state that your “normal
Place of work is your home office” or something to that effect.

This. If it doesnt say this and lists an office location then the contract is for an office based job at that location.

Yup, just a simple change to something like "The role is home-based. Travel to your local office based in - may occasionally be required."

The key point is that if they dont make that change it doesnt matter where you have relocated yourself to through covid if they say back in the office tomorrow you will be back in the office and facing a stiff commute

[frisbee]

I know several people who started new jobs during Covid who were informally told they had remote jobs but proper remote contracts were too difficult, so ended up with office based contracts.

As could be predicted they are now being encouraged to spend some time in the office. A lovely 3 hour commute each way for the token one day a week in the office!

[jurbie]

The inland revenue won't care what your contract states. They are only interested in the reality so you need to look up the difference between a permanent place of work (your home office) and a temporary place of work (employers office).

Start here: https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employmen...

[Spitfire2]

Some places clearly trying to avoid full work from home contracts due to the burden it brings in terms of health and safety etc.

[GT03ROB]

Spitfire2 said:

Some places clearly trying to avoid full work from home contracts due to the burden it brings in terms of health and safety etc.

Probably more a case of keeping their options open...

[Spitfire2]

GT03ROB said:

Probably more a case of keeping their options open...

Not in the examples I'm aware of. But obviously won't be naming them.

[dontlookdown]

Unlikely to be a mistake, and employer equally unlikely to be v keen to change it just now. Most firms want their 'remote' workers in the office more than they have been.

I wonder how many people with WFH jobs actually have WFH contracts? Not that many would be my guess.

[Countdown]

GT03ROB said:

Spitfire2 said:

Some places clearly trying to avoid full work from home contracts due to the burden it brings in terms of health and safety etc.

Probably more a case of keeping their options open...

For us the main reason is not wanting to pay 600 people mileage every time they come into the office, especially if they decided to relocate to Cornwall or Inverness

[GT03ROB]

Countdown said:

GT03ROB said:

Spitfire2 said:

Some places clearly trying to avoid full work from home contracts due to the burden it brings in terms of health and safety etc.

Probably more a case of keeping their options open...

For us the main reason is not wanting to pay 600 people mileage every time they come into the office, especially if they decided to relocate to Cornwall or Inverness

Our UK offices said live where you like .... but you must be capable of being in office the next day at normal start time subject to receiving a request to be in being made within the working hours that day. Otherwise it's an unauthorised absence. And travel costs are to your own account!!

[jurbie]

Countdown said:

For us the main reason is not wanting to pay 600 people mileage every time they come into the office, especially if they decided to relocate to Cornwall or Inverness

You wouldn't need to if they are going into the office on what could be deemed a regular basis, even once a fortnight. HMRC will see that as a permanent workplace and so it will fall under ordinary commuting which can't be expensed.

[Countdown]

jurbie said:

Countdown said:

For us the main reason is not wanting to pay 600 people mileage every time they come into the office, especially if they decided to relocate to Cornwall or Inverness

You wouldn't need to if they are going into the office on what could be deemed a regular basis, even once a fortnight. HMRC will see that as a permanent workplace and so it will fall under ordinary commuting which can't be expensed.

The staff won't see it that way. Their argument will be "Our contract says we're home based, therefore we expect to claim mileage" . It's only when (or if) HMRC do a Payroll audit that this will come up, at which point it will be the Employer who is going to have to fork out for the unpaid taxes and penalties. Far better to avoid the battle by not designating them as Homeworkers in the first place.

[clived]

jurbie said:

You wouldn't need to if they are going into the office on what could be deemed a regular basis, even once a fortnight. HMRC will see that as a permanent workplace and so it will fall under ordinary commuting which can't be expensed.

One day a fortnight, assuming a 5 day working week, is 10% of the time. HMRC define that anywhere you spend (or expect to spend) 40% or more of your time is a permanent workplace, so travel expenses cannot be claimed. Once a fortnight is a temporary workplace: https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/employmen...