RIP Dennis Hutchings. The cowards got you in the end.
Discussion
Rest easy old fella. Your time and passing has not been easy and it's an utter disgrace.
Thought there would a thread on this but it seems not so now have a bit of time going to start one.
Dennis was an 80 year old Army veteran on trial in Belfast over a shooting during the Troubles in 1974. His health was poor, made worse by being forced to attend a revenge trial where the prosecution had already said they had no evidence to suggest he fired the fatal shot.
The trial was temporarily halted on Friday for 3 weeks because of a marked deterioration in his health, he had failing kidneys, could only attend on 3 days a week because needing dialysis, in addition to suffering heart failure. He was living alone in a Belfast hotel and had caught Covid just to make it worse, hence the trial being stopped in the hope he would recover.
There's plenty been written about the background of the case and whether an amnesty could be offered. Dennis had been previously investigated years earlier, cleared of any wrongdoing in connection with the shooting. Investigation reopened in 2011 and murder charged followed in 2015, yet as mentioned prosecution admit they have no new evidence.
On Monday he was taken to hospital and died that evening.
While he was lying on his deathbed the N Ireland Prosecution service were trying to get the court to agree to inclusion of a court case from Dennis' teenage years when he was fined £2 for assault as evidence of bad character.
Every sympathy to your grieving family and comrades. Strong to the end Dennis. Good man.
Attempt to use 1957 court case
Rest easy Dennis, you make us proud. The rest are nothing but cowards
Thought there would a thread on this but it seems not so now have a bit of time going to start one.
Dennis was an 80 year old Army veteran on trial in Belfast over a shooting during the Troubles in 1974. His health was poor, made worse by being forced to attend a revenge trial where the prosecution had already said they had no evidence to suggest he fired the fatal shot.
The trial was temporarily halted on Friday for 3 weeks because of a marked deterioration in his health, he had failing kidneys, could only attend on 3 days a week because needing dialysis, in addition to suffering heart failure. He was living alone in a Belfast hotel and had caught Covid just to make it worse, hence the trial being stopped in the hope he would recover.
There's plenty been written about the background of the case and whether an amnesty could be offered. Dennis had been previously investigated years earlier, cleared of any wrongdoing in connection with the shooting. Investigation reopened in 2011 and murder charged followed in 2015, yet as mentioned prosecution admit they have no new evidence.
On Monday he was taken to hospital and died that evening.
While he was lying on his deathbed the N Ireland Prosecution service were trying to get the court to agree to inclusion of a court case from Dennis' teenage years when he was fined £2 for assault as evidence of bad character.
Dennis' lawyer said:
“It is spiteful and vexatious that at the time he was dying in his hotel room they decided to do this. They are not interested in justice; they are only interested in revenge."
There are individuals in both N Ireland and Downing Street who should hang their heads in shame over this abuse of process.Every sympathy to your grieving family and comrades. Strong to the end Dennis. Good man.
Attempt to use 1957 court case
Rest easy Dennis, you make us proud. The rest are nothing but cowards
I can only say that I disagree.
Mr Hutchings was involved in the death of John Cunningham, and shots from his weapon were certainly fired at him. We will never know whether these were the killing shots. Mr Hutchings contended that he didn't fire any shots; I don't believe this.
I would not have liked to serve in those times and circumstances, and I accept that there is confusion in what were essentially wartime conditions; a lot of leeway is given. Mr Hutchings and his unit went well over the accepted limits.
No sort of hero in my book.
Mr Hutchings was involved in the death of John Cunningham, and shots from his weapon were certainly fired at him. We will never know whether these were the killing shots. Mr Hutchings contended that he didn't fire any shots; I don't believe this.
I would not have liked to serve in those times and circumstances, and I accept that there is confusion in what were essentially wartime conditions; a lot of leeway is given. Mr Hutchings and his unit went well over the accepted limits.
No sort of hero in my book.
Investigations into civilian deaths at the hands of the security forces back in those days were seriously flawed and heavily biased. These historical investigations are the upshot of that.
In this case it’s a shame that the evidence which was previously unavailable and which convinced the judges to bring the case to trail did not get disclosed. Likewise, It’s a shame the defence sides’ evidence that another soldier had confessed to firing the fatal shots also did not get a chance to be heard.
Given his age, ill health and COVID he should have been able to conduct matters without having to attend court in Belfast.
In this case it’s a shame that the evidence which was previously unavailable and which convinced the judges to bring the case to trail did not get disclosed. Likewise, It’s a shame the defence sides’ evidence that another soldier had confessed to firing the fatal shots also did not get a chance to be heard.
Given his age, ill health and COVID he should have been able to conduct matters without having to attend court in Belfast.
FiF said:
There are individuals in both N Ireland and Downing Street who should hang their heads in shame over this abuse of process.
Every sympathy to your grieving family and comrades. Strong to the end Dennis. Good man.
Attempt to use 1957 court case
Rest easy Dennis, you make us proud. The rest are nothing but cowards
May as well declare - I agree with this, wholeheartedly.Every sympathy to your grieving family and comrades. Strong to the end Dennis. Good man.
Attempt to use 1957 court case
Rest easy Dennis, you make us proud. The rest are nothing but cowards
As for the post after this initial one, well, as none of us (seemingly) were there, so we cannot tell who shot at whom - categorically.
Here we have one person, an old man, who was very ill but yet was forced to stand trial for a situation decades ago that was never going to be truthfully recalled or examined as some form of show case.
Very poor form
JuniorD said:
Investigations into civilian deaths at the hands of the security forces back in those days were seriously flawed and heavily biased. These historical investigations are the upshot of that.
In this case it’s a shame that the evidence which was previously unavailable and which convinced the judges to bring the case to trail did not get disclosed. Likewise, It’s a shame the defence sides’ evidence that another soldier had confessed to firing the fatal shots also did not get a chance to be heard.
Given his age, ill health and COVID he should have been able to conduct matters without having to attend court in Belfast. live out the last few months of his life in peace
FTFYIn this case it’s a shame that the evidence which was previously unavailable and which convinced the judges to bring the case to trail did not get disclosed. Likewise, It’s a shame the defence sides’ evidence that another soldier had confessed to firing the fatal shots also did not get a chance to be heard.
Given his age, ill health and COVID he should have been able to
Eric Mc said:
And that is why now, 50 odd years later, a veil needs to be drawn over the whole sorry period - for both sides.
I'll agree with that. I'm big on justice. But any form of judgement, conclusion or anything else gained at this stage will be so far removed from the original goings on as to be pointless and almost entirely meaningless.
Let it lie and be glad that it's over.
dukeboy749r said:
As for the post after this initial one, well, as none of us (seemingly) were there, so we cannot tell who shot at whom - categorically.
We have the testimony of Mr Cummings, do we not? Who admitted that he fired an 'air' shot and several warning shots. We would have had the testimony of another soldier who claimed that he fired the fatal shots. We can be categoric that it was one of these two shooters that killed him.Mr Cummings was being charged with attempted murder. You have two people shooting, a dead person and no particular way to show which of these two shooters killed him. The prosecution alleged that it was Mr Cummings intention to kill John Cunningham; they weren't attempting to prove that it was necessarily his bullet that was the fatal one. Mr Cummings was present at the time, he admitted firing shots, he was the patrol leader. Leaving aside the time taken to bring this matter to court, why do you think this matter shouldn't have been examined by the courts?
For all the sympathy being displayed for Mr Cummings here, remember that John Cunningham was killed unlawfully in 1974. Mr Cummings was part of that.
longblackcoat said:
I can only say that I disagree.
Mr Hutchings was involved in the death of John Cunningham, and shots from his weapon were certainly fired at him. We will never know whether these were the killing shots. Mr Hutchings contended that he didn't fire any shots; I don't believe this.
I would not have liked to serve in those times and circumstances, and I accept that there is confusion in what were essentially wartime conditions; a lot of leeway is given. Mr Hutchings and his unit went well over the accepted limits.
No sort of hero in my book.
Fortunately its people like Dennis Hutchings that allows idiots like you to sit behind your keyboard and write drivel like that in relative comfort and safety.......Mr Hutchings was involved in the death of John Cunningham, and shots from his weapon were certainly fired at him. We will never know whether these were the killing shots. Mr Hutchings contended that he didn't fire any shots; I don't believe this.
I would not have liked to serve in those times and circumstances, and I accept that there is confusion in what were essentially wartime conditions; a lot of leeway is given. Mr Hutchings and his unit went well over the accepted limits.
No sort of hero in my book.
aeropilot said:
Fortunately its people like Dennis Hutchings that allows idiots like you to sit behind your keyboard and write drivel like that in relative comfort and safety...
Absolutely not, in the case of Northern Ireland. No military involvement over there kept anyone on the mainland safe. No need for personal insults, either.BOR said:
It's a disgrace that these back-shooting cowards weren't put on trial years ago.
Cover up after cover up, whitewash after whitewash, naturally the guilty have got old before they have been put before the court.
I have a vague suspicion that you won't be getting a Christmas card from FiF this year.Cover up after cover up, whitewash after whitewash, naturally the guilty have got old before they have been put before the court.
BOR said:
It's a disgrace that these back-shooting cowards weren't put on trial years ago.
Cover up after cover up, whitewash after whitewash, naturally the guilty have got old before they have been put before the court.
I cannot really tell (I can, but let's roll with it), if you are talking about the IRA/INLA etc - for whom most were exonerated for 'crimes' that were murder, pure and simple.Cover up after cover up, whitewash after whitewash, naturally the guilty have got old before they have been put before the court.
Yet easier to go after those still left who can face justice without rioters taking to the streets. As Eric said, it's over, hopefully for good. It should be left in the past.
There were no end of incidents (on both sides of the political spectrum) that merited being followed up on and for expediency's sake, were not.
Biggy Stardust said:
There was basically an amnesty for one side for any acts allegedly committed. It's only fair that the other side has the same arrangement.
RIP
There wasn’t an amnesty for one side. Under the Good Friday Agreement, Republican and Loyalist prisoners got released under licence. Anyone that was not tried or convicted before that are still liable to be prosecuted.RIP
On the other hand, around 300 people were killed by the Army during the “Troubles”, over half were civilians. To date 6 soldiers have stood trial, 4 have been convicted, and some of those had their sentences reduced and/or were able to return to Army duty.
Biggy Stardust said:
There was basically an amnesty for one side for any acts allegedly committed. It's only fair that the other side has the same arrangement.
Not exactly. There was no amnesty for terrorists.The British and Irish Government's gave an undertaking in the Good Friday Agreement that those serving sentences in connection to the activities of paramilitary groups would be eligible for early release if those groups remained committed to the ceasefire.
The accused were still investigated, arrested, charged, held on remand, prosecuted, convicted and sentenced so that there would be closure for the victims or their relatives.
The flaw in the GFA is that it did not extend that undertaking to members of the Police or Armed Forces.
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