American insularity... how do we compare?
Poll: American insularity... how do we compare?
Total Members Polled: 314
Discussion
Americans are quite often derided for being insular, with the fact that only 30% of US citizens have a passport being used to support the claim, compared to over 75% of UK citizens.
In defence of the Yanks, however, their own country is vast enough on its own, and they can also visit Canada and Mexico without passports, giving them access to half a billion people spread across a huge landmass.
This being the case, a fairer comparison might, it strikes me, be Europeans who've never left Europe. I thought I'd start a poll to find out...
In defence of the Yanks, however, their own country is vast enough on its own, and they can also visit Canada and Mexico without passports, giving them access to half a billion people spread across a huge landmass.
This being the case, a fairer comparison might, it strikes me, be Europeans who've never left Europe. I thought I'd start a poll to find out...
Similar to the above, on my last visit to Savannah I met people who had never heard an English accent, they also didn't own a passport and were very reluctant to buy anything that wasn't made in America, mainly because they saw that as a quality purchase and also protected American jobs. I was involved with buying an American company and many of the senior staff had changed their Linkedin profile to object to an English company buying an American operation, despite the fact that the owner had approached us and we offered to guarantee the US jobs for 24 months, which he didn't care about.
There are probably quite a few countries like the USA where, if you really didn't want to, you don't need to travel outside your own country. France, for example - great cities, amazing coastline, and some of the best skiing available in the world. You wouldn't *need* to travel elsewhere.
Most Americans will never need a Passport in their lifetimes, and I'm sure it's not the only country where what you have around you covers everything you'd need.
What's the old adage? Travel broadens the mind, or something?
I've travelled a lot of the world in the last 20 years or so, and I've been very fortunate to have been able to turn left when entering the aircraft as most of it's been for business.
Most Americans will never need a Passport in their lifetimes, and I'm sure it's not the only country where what you have around you covers everything you'd need.
What's the old adage? Travel broadens the mind, or something?
I've travelled a lot of the world in the last 20 years or so, and I've been very fortunate to have been able to turn left when entering the aircraft as most of it's been for business.
RC1807 said:
I've travelled a lot of the world in the last 20 years or so, and I've been very fortunate to have been able to turn left when entering the aircraft as most of it's been for business.
Is that fortunate? You've been able to sit in a more comfortable seat for a few hours in your bus in the sky, but when getting to where-ever you're going you are there for work and then have to get a flight back again, probably seeing no more than the airport, a hotel, maybe a small part of whatever city you've landed in. That is not fortunate. Fortunate is sitting in economy knowing your rucksack is in the hold and once you arrive you have no plan at all for 3 weeks and are free to explore and go where you like and do what you like. Condi said:
RC1807 said:
I've travelled a lot of the world in the last 20 years or so, and I've been very fortunate to have been able to turn left when entering the aircraft as most of it's been for business.
Is that fortunate? You've been able to sit in a more comfortable seat for a few hours in your bus in the sky, but when getting to where-ever you're going you are there for work and then have to get a flight back again, probably seeing no more than the airport, a hotel, maybe a small part of whatever city you've landed in. That is not fortunate. Fortunate is sitting in economy knowing your rucksack is in the hold and once you arrive you have no plan at all for 3 weeks and are free to explore and go where you like and do what you like. Greshamst said:
Condi said:
RC1807 said:
I've travelled a lot of the world in the last 20 years or so, and I've been very fortunate to have been able to turn left when entering the aircraft as most of it's been for business.
Is that fortunate? You've been able to sit in a more comfortable seat for a few hours in your bus in the sky, but when getting to where-ever you're going you are there for work and then have to get a flight back again, probably seeing no more than the airport, a hotel, maybe a small part of whatever city you've landed in. That is not fortunate. Fortunate is sitting in economy knowing your rucksack is in the hold and once you arrive you have no plan at all for 3 weeks and are free to explore and go where you like and do what you like. 
Truckosaurus said:
I'm not sure it is just how far you travel, it is what you do when you get there.
Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
Agreed. Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
I get itchy feet - particularly in the evening. I’ve stayed in quite a few all inclusive hotels, with varying degrees of quality. However, I much prefer venturing out into the towns and finding good bars and restaurants to soak up the atmosphere. Granted, a lot of them have been in tourist areas, but you don’t need to venture far off the beaten track to find hidden gems. In terms of food I find a good rule of thumb is to look where the locals go - had some amazing meals for next to nothing, and met some amazing people.
What always strikes me for ‘American’s with no passport’ isn’t so much the general population, but business leaders/company owners.
Worked for several US owned companies where the ceo didn’t have a passport and thus was never seen / heard directly by those employed outside the US. Sometimes that even extended to the US offices outside of the ‘home state’.
Worked for several US owned companies where the ceo didn’t have a passport and thus was never seen / heard directly by those employed outside the US. Sometimes that even extended to the US offices outside of the ‘home state’.
Americans aren't insular (they're some of the friendliest people on the planet). What they are is parochial. And one of the reasons for that has already been stated; there's more-or-less anything you could need in America, all the way from theme parks to wilderness trails, great cities, restaurants and museums.
About the only reason for leaving is what I call the "Uluru Effect"; the only way to go and see Uluru is to go and see it. (Insert world-famous tourist attraction of your choice).
About the only reason for leaving is what I call the "Uluru Effect"; the only way to go and see Uluru is to go and see it. (Insert world-famous tourist attraction of your choice).
Around 30 years ago I was in a shopping mall in Calfornia and was looking for something in a jacket pocket. I pulled out my passport and the shop assistant asked if it was a passport as she'd never seen one before.
At about the same time I also worked in an office of 25-30 people in Somerset and several of them had never been to Bristol, about 25 miles away. I also knew someone in his 50s who had never been outside the town he'd been born in.
Extreme examples perhaps but quite revealing.
At about the same time I also worked in an office of 25-30 people in Somerset and several of them had never been to Bristol, about 25 miles away. I also knew someone in his 50s who had never been outside the town he'd been born in.
Extreme examples perhaps but quite revealing.
Truckosaurus said:
I'm not sure it is just how far you travel, it is what you do when you get there.
Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
Or even, do the same resort every year, year after year.Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
The low % of passport holders is an oft-used stick to beat the septics, but as mentioned several times America is a fascinating country with a ridiculous breath of experiences to have, I bet a fair number of us "the more enlightened" if in their shoes wouldn't get around to travelling outside its limits either.
Teddy Lop said:
Or even, do the same resort every year, year after year.
The low % of passport holders is an oft-used stick to beat the septics, but as mentioned several times America is a fascinating country with a ridiculous breath of experiences to have, I bet a fair number of us "the more enlightened" if in their shoes wouldn't get around to travelling outside its limits either.
Also (apart from Mexico and Canada) it's a bloody long way to anywhere else - Brits can pop to mainland Europe for the weekend but Americans have to commit to a long trip.The low % of passport holders is an oft-used stick to beat the septics, but as mentioned several times America is a fascinating country with a ridiculous breath of experiences to have, I bet a fair number of us "the more enlightened" if in their shoes wouldn't get around to travelling outside its limits either.
Truckosaurus said:
I'm not sure it is just how far you travel, it is what you do when you get there.
Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
This place is bizarre - it seems to be designed to ensure that Americans can spend their whole holiday feeling as if they haven't left America.Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
https://www.atlantisbahamas.com/
john2443 said:
Teddy Lop said:
Or even, do the same resort every year, year after year.
The low % of passport holders is an oft-used stick to beat the septics, but as mentioned several times America is a fascinating country with a ridiculous breath of experiences to have, I bet a fair number of us "the more enlightened" if in their shoes wouldn't get around to travelling outside its limits either.
Also (apart from Mexico and Canada) it's a bloody long way to anywhere else - Brits can pop to mainland Europe for the weekend but Americans have to commit to a long trip.The low % of passport holders is an oft-used stick to beat the septics, but as mentioned several times America is a fascinating country with a ridiculous breath of experiences to have, I bet a fair number of us "the more enlightened" if in their shoes wouldn't get around to travelling outside its limits either.
My 2p
Americans are a diverse bunch, after-all, there are more than 300m of them. The 'problem' ,if they have one, is they're often taught, from birth, that America is the greatest Country in the world. In fact, they have such an unwavering belief that it is, to claim it's not to an American, even with facts and data to back up your argument, can often be incredibly insulting to them and it doesn't seem to matter if they're from NYC / LA or some dirt road backwater in the dodgy middle bit.
That's not to say Brits are completely free of national arrogance, far from, as someone said above, there are still plenty of Brits who will only go to resorts on Holidays when English is the only language spoken or written and even then, get very upset if the PG tips tastes different or the sausages are a funny colour.
When I've mixed with Americans outside of the US, they can be a bit of a nightmare at first, not all of course, but a vocal minority (has anyone ever been in a room with a Yank and not noticed, why are they so loud??) be that decades ago as a backpacker, a tourist or when my American in-laws come to visit. They often arrive with air of superiority. Like Missionaries sent to civilise the natives, but once they work out that Europe isn't like Hogwarts or Downton and that we have houses, cars and the others trappings of modern life, it's too much of a shock to the system for them. Either that we're trying to trick them, or that they've been fooled all these years, oh and when they finally run out of denial and they discover there are things outside of the US they actually think are better, they usually need a bit of a sit-down.
The Irish have it worse I think, the in-laws often visit the other in-laws in Ireland after us, when they arrive and they discover they're not all poor starving potato farmers riding a horse and cart they can't quite believe it. They're 8th generation Yanks, but they still think they're Irish and the 'Home Country' is still exactly like their forefathers left it 300 years ago.
Americans are a diverse bunch, after-all, there are more than 300m of them. The 'problem' ,if they have one, is they're often taught, from birth, that America is the greatest Country in the world. In fact, they have such an unwavering belief that it is, to claim it's not to an American, even with facts and data to back up your argument, can often be incredibly insulting to them and it doesn't seem to matter if they're from NYC / LA or some dirt road backwater in the dodgy middle bit.
That's not to say Brits are completely free of national arrogance, far from, as someone said above, there are still plenty of Brits who will only go to resorts on Holidays when English is the only language spoken or written and even then, get very upset if the PG tips tastes different or the sausages are a funny colour.
When I've mixed with Americans outside of the US, they can be a bit of a nightmare at first, not all of course, but a vocal minority (has anyone ever been in a room with a Yank and not noticed, why are they so loud??) be that decades ago as a backpacker, a tourist or when my American in-laws come to visit. They often arrive with air of superiority. Like Missionaries sent to civilise the natives, but once they work out that Europe isn't like Hogwarts or Downton and that we have houses, cars and the others trappings of modern life, it's too much of a shock to the system for them. Either that we're trying to trick them, or that they've been fooled all these years, oh and when they finally run out of denial and they discover there are things outside of the US they actually think are better, they usually need a bit of a sit-down.
The Irish have it worse I think, the in-laws often visit the other in-laws in Ireland after us, when they arrive and they discover they're not all poor starving potato farmers riding a horse and cart they can't quite believe it. They're 8th generation Yanks, but they still think they're Irish and the 'Home Country' is still exactly like their forefathers left it 300 years ago.
Teddy Lop said:
Truckosaurus said:
I'm not sure it is just how far you travel, it is what you do when you get there.
Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
Or even, do the same resort every year, year after year.Plenty of Europeans travel to the Caribbean and never leave their all-inclusive compound, or travel to a resort town on the Med full of their own nationality and barely interact with the locals.
The low % of passport holders is an oft-used stick to beat the septics, but as mentioned several times America is a fascinating country with a ridiculous breath of experiences to have, I bet a fair number of us "the more enlightened" if in their shoes wouldn't get around to travelling outside its limits either.
I remember watching a documentary about Foula, or Fair Isle, and there was a 70something who'd only left the island once. That's commitment.
One thing that has always struck me about American travel is how much more the flights are. An internal flight for 500-1000 miles, similar for us going to most places in Europe, was often 3-5 times more than what we'd pay.
And I'd be much less inclined to go abroad if it required the commitment in time that it does for Americans. Setting off from Nowheresville in Kansas to an international hub could be as long a haul as several foreign trips for people from piddlier places.
I can see why it rarely occurs to them.
One thing that has always struck me about American travel is how much more the flights are. An internal flight for 500-1000 miles, similar for us going to most places in Europe, was often 3-5 times more than what we'd pay.
And I'd be much less inclined to go abroad if it required the commitment in time that it does for Americans. Setting off from Nowheresville in Kansas to an international hub could be as long a haul as several foreign trips for people from piddlier places.
I can see why it rarely occurs to them.
P-Jay said:
My 2p
Americans are a diverse bunch, after-all, there are more than 300m of them. The 'problem' ,if they have one, is they're often taught, from birth, that America is the greatest Country in the world. In fact, they have such an unwavering belief that it is, to claim it's not to an American, even with facts and data to back up your argument, can often be incredibly insulting to them and it doesn't seem to matter if they're from NYC / LA or some dirt road backwater in the dodgy middle bit.
That's not to say Brits are completely free of national arrogance, far from, as someone said above, there are still plenty of Brits who will only go to resorts on Holidays when English is the only language spoken or written and even then, get very upset if the PG tips tastes different or the sausages are a funny colour.
When I've mixed with Americans outside of the US, they can be a bit of a nightmare at first, not all of course, but a vocal minority (has anyone ever been in a room with a Yank and not noticed, why are they so loud??) be that decades ago as a backpacker, a tourist or when my American in-laws come to visit. They often arrive with air of superiority. Like Missionaries sent to civilise the natives, but once they work out that Europe isn't like Hogwarts or Downton and that we have houses, cars and the others trappings of modern life, it's too much of a shock to the system for them. Either that we're trying to trick them, or that they've been fooled all these years, oh and when they finally run out of denial and they discover there are things outside of the US they actually think are better, they usually need a bit of a sit-down.
Completely agree. My parents live in the US and this is a frequent topic of conversation between us. Lots of Americans watch Downton Abbey and still think it's like that. I've been asked if we have cars, what the smogs are like and how long it takes to drive from England to Pennsylvania. They also get very confused by 240V electrics (and British plugs/sockets) and British 'phone numbers.Americans are a diverse bunch, after-all, there are more than 300m of them. The 'problem' ,if they have one, is they're often taught, from birth, that America is the greatest Country in the world. In fact, they have such an unwavering belief that it is, to claim it's not to an American, even with facts and data to back up your argument, can often be incredibly insulting to them and it doesn't seem to matter if they're from NYC / LA or some dirt road backwater in the dodgy middle bit.
That's not to say Brits are completely free of national arrogance, far from, as someone said above, there are still plenty of Brits who will only go to resorts on Holidays when English is the only language spoken or written and even then, get very upset if the PG tips tastes different or the sausages are a funny colour.
When I've mixed with Americans outside of the US, they can be a bit of a nightmare at first, not all of course, but a vocal minority (has anyone ever been in a room with a Yank and not noticed, why are they so loud??) be that decades ago as a backpacker, a tourist or when my American in-laws come to visit. They often arrive with air of superiority. Like Missionaries sent to civilise the natives, but once they work out that Europe isn't like Hogwarts or Downton and that we have houses, cars and the others trappings of modern life, it's too much of a shock to the system for them. Either that we're trying to trick them, or that they've been fooled all these years, oh and when they finally run out of denial and they discover there are things outside of the US they actually think are better, they usually need a bit of a sit-down.
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