Discussion
I was in the left lane on a 40mph dual carriageway the other day, and caught up to a car in the right lane doing 30mph. I wasn’t sure what the correct course of action would be
1) Overtake in the left lane, since they were doing 10mph below the speed limit
2) Move over to the right lane, then start flashing my headlights to get them to move over to the left lane, so I could overtake them in the right lane
I wasn’t sure if option 1 is counted as undertaking, or if it is acceptable since the car in the right lane is going well below the speed limit?
Additionally, if option 1 is counted as undertaking, does this rule still apply if the two lanes are marked as different destinations? Eg left lane is empty and is for City 1 only, whereas right lane is busy and is for City 2 only.
1) Overtake in the left lane, since they were doing 10mph below the speed limit
2) Move over to the right lane, then start flashing my headlights to get them to move over to the left lane, so I could overtake them in the right lane
I wasn’t sure if option 1 is counted as undertaking, or if it is acceptable since the car in the right lane is going well below the speed limit?
Additionally, if option 1 is counted as undertaking, does this rule still apply if the two lanes are marked as different destinations? Eg left lane is empty and is for City 1 only, whereas right lane is busy and is for City 2 only.
Jaguar steve said:
I'd like a definitive answer too as the proliferation of entitled 'tards cruising under the speed limit in the middle and right hand lanes has reached a whole new level here in the Essex Badlands recently. 
Yesterday evening A3 Surrey, in lane 3 there was a big line of traffic cruising at qpprox 65, lane 2 was marginally slower, lane 1 was completely empty, drives me mad. If you are going to be prosecuted for passing on the left it will be for s3 Road Traffic Act 1968.
The advice in the Highway Code is not to pass on the left, save for some limited examples mentioned in it.
Those examples require a level of personal interpretation as to when those circumstances apply & are present. The problem occurs when our interpretation differs to that of the Police/CPS/Courts & that's when a s3 FPN/conviction may happen.
The advice in the Highway Code is not to pass on the left, save for some limited examples mentioned in it.
Those examples require a level of personal interpretation as to when those circumstances apply & are present. The problem occurs when our interpretation differs to that of the Police/CPS/Courts & that's when a s3 FPN/conviction may happen.
It drives me mental as well.
What I'd do always depends on the situation, but if traffic was light, and nothing immediately ahead of said slower car, I'd just continue in the left lane.
Semi busy motorways is where it get ls trickier, because you can guarantee the dozy idiot who is giving zero f
ks about their position will suddenly take huge offence at being passed on the left, and make it their life's mission to block you from getting back in.
I've seen then become a race to out stupid each other very quickly, with cars weaving around traffic in l1 and L2 ...far more dangerous of course.
On the motorbike things are far simpler of course..
The only decision is what gesture to use as I go past them.
Sorry if none of this gives any legal advice...for that I would say to follow rule number 1: don't get caught.
What I'd do always depends on the situation, but if traffic was light, and nothing immediately ahead of said slower car, I'd just continue in the left lane.
Semi busy motorways is where it get ls trickier, because you can guarantee the dozy idiot who is giving zero f
ks about their position will suddenly take huge offence at being passed on the left, and make it their life's mission to block you from getting back in.I've seen then become a race to out stupid each other very quickly, with cars weaving around traffic in l1 and L2 ...far more dangerous of course.
On the motorbike things are far simpler of course..
The only decision is what gesture to use as I go past them.
Sorry if none of this gives any legal advice...for that I would say to follow rule number 1: don't get caught.
Where the m40 approaches Beaconsfield and becomes 4 lanes is a hotshot for morons sitting in the outer 2 lanes oblivious to whats inside them. I often find my self in the driving lane passing multiple cars sitting at 65.
Imo if you are caught and stopped you can be done for dangerous driving.
Imo if you are caught and stopped you can be done for dangerous driving.
TheDrownedApe said:
Where the m40 approaches Beaconsfield and becomes 4 lanes is a hotshot for morons sitting in the outer 2 lanes oblivious to whats inside them. I often find my self in the driving lane passing multiple cars sitting at 65.
Imo if you are caught and stopped you can be done for dangerous driving.
Very unlikely dangerous driving (unless you are doing some really stupid stuff) the bar for prosecutions is very high, unlike s3 RTA which has a very low bar.Imo if you are caught and stopped you can be done for dangerous driving.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
As I said thoughvonhosen said:
Those examples require a level of personal interpretation as to when those circumstances apply & are present. The problem occurs when our interpretation differs to that of the Police/CPS/Courts & that's when a s3 FPN/conviction may happen.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
My old commute route M6 J4 - J8 was almost entirely a "smart" section -except around Spaghetti junction. It was usually possible to travel all the allowed HS running lane at the posted speed limits without the need to overtake on the right (if you know what I mean 
) On the SAC I attended the presenter (who claimed to be ex-TrafPol) said that if you were cruising along in an inside lane and came across someone going more slower in an outer lane then it was perfectly legal to continue past them and get ahead. No mention of the Section 268 stuff. He said it would become an offence if you deliberately changed lanes to pass on the inside then moved back out again, thereby gaining an advantage. I asked what the offence was, he looked at me witheringly and said in his most patronising voice “changing lanes to gain an advantage”. Sounded like BS at the time but I decided the day would go better if I let it go.
PhilboSE said:
On the SAC I attended the presenter (who claimed to be ex-TrafPol) said that if you were cruising along in an inside lane and came across someone going more slower in an outer lane then it was perfectly legal to continue past them and get ahead. No mention of the Section 268 stuff. He said it would become an offence if you deliberately changed lanes to pass on the inside then moved back out again, thereby gaining an advantage. I asked what the offence was, he looked at me witheringly and said in his most patronising voice “changing lanes to gain an advantage”. Sounded like BS at the time but I decided the day would go better if I let it go.
That would be s3 RTA he is talking about (same as queue jumping for an advantage by using an inappropriate lane).The HC clearly doesn't differentiate between changing lanes or not though (ie a lane change is not a requirement for it to fall outside the advice)
CPS advice
(Look at driving without due care, or reasonable consideration)
https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/road-traffic...
As it was a 40mph DC, without photos or googlemaps it seems likely it was either in an urban/industrial area or had a lot of side-turnings.
So, check for left-turns and right-turns ahead to assess if this is likely to be someone who is either going to try and take a very wide left-turn or do the "swing left, then turn right" HGV manoeuvre in their Nissan Micra, then pass them on the left whilst flicking the vees before brake-testing them. Throw a can of redbull (or the caffeinated beverage of your choice) and then carry on with my day.
I frequently drive down a 40mph DC with industrial estates down it with turnings that really aren't fit for the artic lorries that the developers and council should have been expecting, they need to use both lanes to turn in and out but it's surprising how often you see someone nip down the nearside of a left-indicating artic that has slowed to 10mph at the entrance to a very obvious light-industry park.
So, check for left-turns and right-turns ahead to assess if this is likely to be someone who is either going to try and take a very wide left-turn or do the "swing left, then turn right" HGV manoeuvre in their Nissan Micra, then pass them on the left whilst flicking the vees before brake-testing them. Throw a can of redbull (or the caffeinated beverage of your choice) and then carry on with my day.
I frequently drive down a 40mph DC with industrial estates down it with turnings that really aren't fit for the artic lorries that the developers and council should have been expecting, they need to use both lanes to turn in and out but it's surprising how often you see someone nip down the nearside of a left-indicating artic that has slowed to 10mph at the entrance to a very obvious light-industry park.
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