Ownership of RN ships

[Seight_Returns]

Saw an RN OPV anchored in Poole Bay yesterday morning. The AIS app on my phone said she was HMS Severn.

Looking at the Owner and Manager data on AIS - was surprised to see that she's apparently owned by BAE Systems and managed by CSS Boats.

Does the RN not own and manage the OPVs ? Or is this just glitchy AIS data ?

[ClaphamGT3]

This is increasingly common - in the same way that the RAF's Voyager tankers are owned by a private company and leased to the RAF

[aeropilot]

ClaphamGT3 said:

This is increasingly common - in the same way that the RAF's Voyager tankers are owned by a private company and leased to the RAF

Along with most of the RAF flying training fleet as well......

[2xChevrons]

This is interesting, because the Batch 1 Rivers (like 'Severn') were originally procured under an 'all in one' deal with VT, whereby VT built and delivered the ships and then provided five years of maintenance and support for an agreed price and with a set level of availability. That contract was extended for another five years until the MoD purchased the ships outright, which made maintenance the overall responsibility of Defence Equipment & Support.

Last autumn the MoD confirmed that the Batch 1s would be in service for at least another seven years, for which BAE-SMS was awarded an extended contract. CSS is 'Commercially Supported Shipping' - the branch of DE&S that manages ships maintained under contract by commercial firms.

So I wonder if this deal included re-vesting ownership of the ships in the 'delivery partner' (or whatever jargon the MoD use at the moment), and whether this applies only to 'Severn', since she was decommissioned and then reactivated which may have changed the economics of her life extension.

[Simpo Two]

And there was me thinking that 'HMS' stood for 'Her Majesty's Ship'...

[2xChevrons]

Simpo Two said:

And there was me thinking that 'HMS' stood for 'Her Majesty's Ship'...

That only means that it is sailing in the name of Her Britannic Majesty, and has an officer holding the Queen's comission in command. In the world wars the Admiralty took up thousands of civilian ships for war service and gave them various 'HM-' prefixes, but they were still ultimately the property of their original owners.

[bitchstewie]

If it's owned by BAE who are a publicly traded company how do the legalities work of it being able to sail around shooting at things and blowing things up?

[junglie]

When I ‘had’ one they were leased from BAE and supported through the CSS contract which worked well.

No restrictions on their use as you might a lease car.

[2xChevrons]

bhstewie said:

If it's owned by BAE who are a publicly traded company how do the legalities work of it being able to sail around shooting at things and blowing things up?

The entity that ultimately owns the hull doesn't matter. The UK government are the operator, and so long as they fulfill the legal obligations with regard to who commands and crews the ship and what flag it flies and the ship/crew abide by the various laws and conventions regarding how warships behave then it doesn't matter a jot that the ship isn't government property.

[TTmonkey]

junglie said:

When I ‘had’ one they were leased from BAE and supported through the CSS contract which worked well.

No restrictions on their use as you might a lease car.

I bet you couldn’t take it on a track day though.

[sherman]

TTmonkey said:

junglie said:

When I ‘had’ one they were leased from BAE and supported through the CSS contract which worked well.

No restrictions on their use as you might a lease car.

I bet you couldn’t take it on a track day though.

It would be quite good fun to watch a frigate or destroyer giving it full steam ahead round the fastnet course or isle of wight race

[andy97]

sherman said:

TTmonkey said:

junglie said:

When I ‘had’ one they were leased from BAE and supported through the CSS contract which worked well.

No restrictions on their use as you might a lease car.

I bet you couldn’t take it on a track day though.

It would be quite good fun to watch a frigate or destroyer giving it full steam ahead round the fastnet course or isle of wight race

As an OOW I once had to “drive” a Type 23 through the Straits of Dover at max chat with 4 Ferries initially on a steady bearing - that was as exciting and demanding as driving a Caterham through Paddock Hill bend.