Expats Vs immigrants
Discussion
I'm a Brit (and now also German) living in Germany and I happily refer to myself as an immigrant.
If you accept the definition of the word being a person who comes to live permanently in a foreign country I really cannot see it any other way. Expat makes me cringe and makes me think of some awful person living in a different country but refusing to integrate, the sort who gets angry when the locals don't speak their language.
If you accept the definition of the word being a person who comes to live permanently in a foreign country I really cannot see it any other way. Expat makes me cringe and makes me think of some awful person living in a different country but refusing to integrate, the sort who gets angry when the locals don't speak their language.
It's not just a British thing. I am an expat/immigrant and there are loads of expat groups and services with members from dozens of different countries who all consider themselves expats. I think people who move abroad consider themselves expats, and the people who's country they've moved in to consider them immigrants.
Expats are people who temporarily locate overseas for reasons of work or study and who have no intention of settling long term in the host country. Usually they will have a pre-determined, finite period of time in the host country.
Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
ClaphamGT3 said:
Expats are people who temporarily locate overseas for reasons of work or study and who have no intention of settling long term in the host country. Usually they will have a pre-determined, finite period of time in the host country.
Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
This is spot on.Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
If i moved abroad permanently, i'd consider myself a migrant because i've migrated to another country.
Sadly, that is not likely to happen for medical reasons but if my situation was different, then yeah i'd be a migrant not an expat.
ClaphamGT3 said:
Expats are people who temporarily locate overseas for reasons of work or study and who have no intention of settling long term in the host country. Usually they will have a pre-determined, finite period of time in the host country.
Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
Yep, the difference is all down to whether it's a temporary stay or intended to be permanent.Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
I have a Norwegian friend who is currently in the UK after previously being in on contracts in Oman, Saudi, Canada and Russia. He goes wherever the work is and his employer covers his various expenses.
Another friend is Belgian but has no intention of ever going home. He came here to study and has stayed since doing a variety of unrelated jobs.
The first is an expat, the second an immigrant.
Mr Spoon said:
So why is it when Brits move abroad they become expats. But anyone else moving here is an immigrant?
Smacks of arrogance and entitlement
Do we consider any other nationalities expats living in blighty?
I am not having a shot, but the tone of your posts are ironically coming off as rather arrogant.Smacks of arrogance and entitlement
Do we consider any other nationalities expats living in blighty?
If someone were to call me an Expat I would correct them.
I am an immigrant and I have worked bloody hard to be able to call myself so.
Mr Spoon said:
and these appear to be the literal terms.
I get the impression immigrant is less liked by british "expats" as it carries the perception of negative connotations, even a class thing.
I disagree, in my experience quite the opposite. I get the impression immigrant is less liked by british "expats" as it carries the perception of negative connotations, even a class thing.
montymoo said:
Mr Spoon said:
So why is it when Brits move abroad they become expats. But anyone else moving here is an immigrant?
Smacks of arrogance and entitlement
Do we consider any other nationalities expats living in blighty?
I am not having a shot, but the tone of your posts are ironically coming off as rather arrogant.Smacks of arrogance and entitlement
Do we consider any other nationalities expats living in blighty?
If someone were to call me an Expat I would correct them.
I am an immigrant and I have worked bloody hard to be able to call myself so.
Mr Spoon said:
and these appear to be the literal terms.
I get the impression immigrant is less liked by british "expats" as it carries the perception of negative connotations, even a class thing.
I disagree, in my experience quite the opposite. I get the impression immigrant is less liked by british "expats" as it carries the perception of negative connotations, even a class thing.
The temporary/permanent thing doesn't work for me personally - I've always seen it as a perspective difference.
I would be an expat in my mind if I left the UK. I'd be an immigrant in the minds of everyone at my new host country. From both perspectives, I am a migrant.
Mr Spoon said:
So why is it when Brits move abroad they become expats. But anyone else moving here is an immigrant?
Smacks of arrogance and entitlement.
Do we consider any other nationalities expats living in blighty?
Brits moving abroad to live are emigrants from a British point of view, immigrants from the other countries point of view. Migrants either way.Smacks of arrogance and entitlement.
Do we consider any other nationalities expats living in blighty?
People living temporarily outside their home country are expats either way. It's short for 'expatriate' which comes from 'ex' meaning outside and 'patrie' meaning home country.
There is no such word as inpat.
Is it just the way language works? A person walking out of the room is leaving and person walking into the room is arriving. That's two different words for someone passing through a door. An expat is an immigrant when you are in the country they now live in. But they aren't an immigrant to us in the UK are they? We cant call both groups immigrants.
Edited to add that Dr Jekyll has just said basically the same.
Edited to add that Dr Jekyll has just said basically the same.
Edited by Randy Winkman on Wednesday 9th February 15:09
ClaphamGT3 said:
Expats are people who temporarily locate overseas for reasons of work or study and who have no intention of settling long term in the host country. Usually they will have a pre-determined, finite period of time in the host country.
Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
This. ^^^Immigrants are people who move to a host country on an open-ended basis with the intention of making a new life there.
As such, Pam and Terry retiring to the Costa del Sol are immigrants whereas the doctor from Bangladesh, the diplomat from Nigeria or the architect from Poland who come to the UK in order to work, with a set plan to stay for - say - five years are expats
Growing up my [British] parents worked for the UK government and were stationed in Germany (I was even born there) supporting the British Military presence there. We were very much expats as it was never the intention to stay in Germany permanently, nor were we entitled to, even though we'd been in that setup for decades. Even though I was physically born there, I don't have any claim to German citizenship.
I've since "expatted" around a fair bit, Europe, ME, Africa, doing various dangerous jobs in unpleasant places, and whilst I was in those places, it was never the intention to stay there long term as I was always going to return to the UK after the contract was up.
However I lived in the USA as a permanent resident, so no longer classed myself as an expat, rather a British immigrant. However, I'm now a US citizen, so technically no longer an immigrant either.
Randy Winkman said:
Is it just the way language works? A person walking out of the room is leaving and person walking into the room is arriving. That's two different words for someone passing through a door. An expat is an immigrant when you are in the country they now live in. But they aren't an immigrant to us in the UK are they? We cant call both groups immigrants.
Edited to add that Dr Jekyll has just said basically the same.
Emigrants is surely the word for people who have moved or emigrated permanently to another country.Edited to add that Dr Jekyll has just said basically the same.
Edited by Randy Winkman on Wednesday 9th February 15:09
I work in an industry with a very mobile workforce and expat is definitely used to mean living somewhere for a certain period rather than the much more permanent emigration/immigration.
Dr Jekyll said:
.
There is no such word as inpat.
It's probably not in the dictionary but it's used a lot in the Corporate mobility industry, I have even seen it in international health cover contracts.There is no such word as inpat.
As an unconnected aside, expats can become immigrants and vice versa. I have done both transformations and in different directions. I ended up feeling stateless and probably tasteless
Mr Spoon said:
and these appear to be the literal terms.
I get the impression immigrant is less liked by british "expats" as it carries the perception of negative connotations, even a class thing.
I'm British by nationality but I'm an immigrant in France.I get the impression immigrant is less liked by british "expats" as it carries the perception of negative connotations, even a class thing.
The only Brits who don't like being referred to as immigrants in their new country of residence are those who are generally best avoided in my experience.
Rushjob said:
The only Brits who don't like being referred to as immigrants in their new country of residence are those who are generally best avoided in my experience.
This is not fact but I would guess some of the less desirable members of my family would contort the difference as follows:Immigrants are low income people from the third world coming to steal the great wealth of our nation. Bla bla bla something about gun boats.
Expats are Brits who have moved some where sunny with their big bag of cash, Johnny Foreigner should be bloody thrilled to have them invest in there squalid grief hole of a country.
Not correct at all but would be willing to wager a few people think like that.
ntiz said:
Rushjob said:
The only Brits who don't like being referred to as immigrants in their new country of residence are those who are generally best avoided in my experience.
This is not fact but I would guess some of the less desirable members of my family would contort the difference as follows:Immigrants are low income people from the third world coming to steal the great wealth of our nation. Bla bla bla something about gun boats.
Expats are Brits who have moved some where sunny with their big bag of cash, Johnny Foreigner should be bloody thrilled to have them invest in there squalid grief hole of a country.
Not correct at all but would be willing to wager a few people think like that.
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