Taking a car dealer to court.
Discussion
Never done it before and would happily avoid it if I could.
Bit of back story. Bought a Jag XJ off ebay recently from a car dealer.
Went to pick it up, short test drive, all seemed well, paid my money and left.
As soon as I got on the motorway it became obvious something was wrong. A rumble from the rear end.
To cut a long story short 'dealer' wants nothing to do with it and is claiming private sale and the fact I picked it up from his music studio business.
That's despite him showing me round his other cars for sale, a dealer website which matches his ebay user ID name and the previous logbook having his business name on it.
TBH I'd settle for him fixing it or even money towards fix but he's not interested. Didn't get above 35 on the test drive so it didn't become apparent. Car is double price of some other examples as it was intimated it was a very cherished example.
Good chance of a successful outcome at small claims?
It's possible to work out the car and dealer from my garage so please don't name and shame on the thread thanks.
Bit of back story. Bought a Jag XJ off ebay recently from a car dealer.
Went to pick it up, short test drive, all seemed well, paid my money and left.
As soon as I got on the motorway it became obvious something was wrong. A rumble from the rear end.
To cut a long story short 'dealer' wants nothing to do with it and is claiming private sale and the fact I picked it up from his music studio business.
That's despite him showing me round his other cars for sale, a dealer website which matches his ebay user ID name and the previous logbook having his business name on it.
TBH I'd settle for him fixing it or even money towards fix but he's not interested. Didn't get above 35 on the test drive so it didn't become apparent. Car is double price of some other examples as it was intimated it was a very cherished example.
Good chance of a successful outcome at small claims?
It's possible to work out the car and dealer from my garage so please don't name and shame on the thread thanks.
ChocolateFrog said:
Never done it before and would happily avoid it if I could.
Bit of back story. Bought a Jag XJ off ebay recently from a car dealer.
Went to pick it up, short test drive, all seemed well, paid my money and left.
As soon as I got on the motorway it became obvious something was wrong. A rumble from the rear end.
To cut a long story short 'dealer' wants nothing to do with it and is claiming private sale and the fact I picked it up from his music studio business.
That's despite him showing me round his other cars for sale, a dealer website which matches his ebay user ID name and the previous logbook having his business name on it.
TBH I'd settle for him fixing it or even money towards fix but he's not interested. Didn't get above 35 on the test drive so it didn't become apparent. Car is double price of some other examples as it was intimated it was a very cherished example.
Good chance of a successful outcome at small claims?
It's possible to work out the car and dealer from my garage so please don't name and shame on the thread thanks.
My son had a similar issue, make sure you document (screen print) everything before the dealer decides to clean up their internet history. Print it all off and then you have to decide if you are going to sell the car (and claim the loss) or fix the issue and claim for the repairs. Bit of back story. Bought a Jag XJ off ebay recently from a car dealer.
Went to pick it up, short test drive, all seemed well, paid my money and left.
As soon as I got on the motorway it became obvious something was wrong. A rumble from the rear end.
To cut a long story short 'dealer' wants nothing to do with it and is claiming private sale and the fact I picked it up from his music studio business.
That's despite him showing me round his other cars for sale, a dealer website which matches his ebay user ID name and the previous logbook having his business name on it.
TBH I'd settle for him fixing it or even money towards fix but he's not interested. Didn't get above 35 on the test drive so it didn't become apparent. Car is double price of some other examples as it was intimated it was a very cherished example.
Good chance of a successful outcome at small claims?
It's possible to work out the car and dealer from my garage so please don't name and shame on the thread thanks.
Trading standards are useless, the small claims court is very good but expect it to take about a year to resolve through the small claims court.
First step is a recorded letter setting out your claim and giving him 14 days to fix the issue.
Thanks.
I've done the letter and really think we hit the point where further communication is just going to break down into insults.
The idea was the car was only ever going to be a short term proposition while I wait for my new car to arrive, which is probably only a few weeks away.
I though it might be the old tyres so I've fitted new tyres and 4 wheel alignment.
It's either wheel bearing(s), diff or propshaft related.
Ideally I'd like him to take it back and get a refund.
I don't know if I could sell it and claim for the difference? Probably not.
I should probably just suck it up but I hate the thought of him getting away with it. He cancelled the ebay transaction immediately after I left. I contacted ebay to let them know i bought it but they couldn't be less interested.
I've done the letter and really think we hit the point where further communication is just going to break down into insults.
The idea was the car was only ever going to be a short term proposition while I wait for my new car to arrive, which is probably only a few weeks away.
I though it might be the old tyres so I've fitted new tyres and 4 wheel alignment.
It's either wheel bearing(s), diff or propshaft related.
Ideally I'd like him to take it back and get a refund.
I don't know if I could sell it and claim for the difference? Probably not.
I should probably just suck it up but I hate the thought of him getting away with it. He cancelled the ebay transaction immediately after I left. I contacted ebay to let them know i bought it but they couldn't be less interested.
After several denials it was a trade sale, I sent him a picture of the previous logbook, which had been left in the history file, which clearly shows his business name as the owner, I'd assume that was a slam dunk.
I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
ChocolateFrog said:
After several denials it was a trade sale, I sent him a picture of the previous logbook, which had been left in the history file, which clearly shows his business name as the owner, I'd assume that was a slam dunk.
I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
The V5 being in his business name might work in his favour and not yours, I'm afraid.I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
If he was a trader, the car would not be registered to him but kept in trade, so as to not add an additional RK.
The fact that it was registered to his music studio business, might show that he genuinely used the car for himself, and then sold it on as a private seller, particularly since his legitimate business seems to be in music and not car dealing.
Does the V5 show how long he was the RK of the car?
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I bought a 330d touring on New years eve from a trader. All very nice and pleasant and with warranty provided. Being 200 miles away from home (with knocked down price agreed before I bought train ticket!) and being NYE and wanting to get home I only took it for a short test drive and like you not particularly fast, say up to 50mph. All good.Drive home involving lots of motorway with higher road speeds I noticed a warble from the OSR.
Let the dealer know when I got home and that I'll take it to local garage but suspect it's a bearing. He agreed but said unless the bearing had failed the warranty wouldn't cover it. It was the bearing that had worn, not failed! Quote came in at £430 fitted by specialist. As car is otherwise brilliant (road noise aside - separate thread on that!) and considering I'd knocked them down by more than the cost of repair I just got it sorted and moved on!
If the car you have is otherwise great and it's still ballpark right price with cost of repair I'd be tempted to just get it done and move on. But if you already paid over market and/or you feel other issues might surface then push for the repair/return.
Mandat said:
ChocolateFrog said:
After several denials it was a trade sale, I sent him a picture of the previous logbook, which had been left in the history file, which clearly shows his business name as the owner, I'd assume that was a slam dunk.
I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
The V5 being in his business name might work in his favour and not yours, I'm afraid.I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
If he was a trader, the car would not be registered to him but kept in trade, so as to not add an additional RK.
The fact that it was registered to his music studio business, might show that he genuinely used the car for himself, and then sold it on as a private seller, particularly since his legitimate business seems to be in music and not car dealing.
Does the V5 show how long he was the RK of the car?
QuattroDave said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I bought a 330d touring on New years eve from a trader. All very nice and pleasant and with warranty provided. Being 200 miles away from home (with knocked down price agreed before I bought train ticket!) and being NYE and wanting to get home I only took it for a short test drive and like you not particularly fast, say up to 50mph. All good.Drive home involving lots of motorway with higher road speeds I noticed a warble from the OSR.
Let the dealer know when I got home and that I'll take it to local garage but suspect it's a bearing. He agreed but said unless the bearing had failed the warranty wouldn't cover it. It was the bearing that had worn, not failed! Quote came in at £430 fitted by specialist. As car is otherwise brilliant (road noise aside - separate thread on that!) and considering I'd knocked them down by more than the cost of repair I just got it sorted and moved on!
If the car you have is otherwise great and it's still ballpark right price with cost of repair I'd be tempted to just get it done and move on. But if you already paid over market and/or you feel other issues might surface then push for the repair/return.
Mandat said:
ChocolateFrog said:
After several denials it was a trade sale, I sent him a picture of the previous logbook, which had been left in the history file, which clearly shows his business name as the owner, I'd assume that was a slam dunk.
I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
The V5 being in his business name might work in his favour and not yours, I'm afraid.I'd not paid it much attention but he had been saying it was his dad's, when I pressed him on that he was vague but was implying something along the lines of he gets cars in and let's his dad drive them for a while, I assume to try and legitimise the private seller aspect.
If he was a trader, the car would not be registered to him but kept in trade, so as to not add an additional RK.
The fact that it was registered to his music studio business, might show that he genuinely used the car for himself, and then sold it on as a private seller, particularly since his legitimate business seems to be in music and not car dealing.
Does the V5 show how long he was the RK of the car?
Gweeds said:
Tell him he has 1 week to refund or you'll issue proceedings. No further communication.
Then do it.
That's what I want to do but it's an extra £200 atleast so want to try and make as rational a decision as possible, while simultaneously wanting to strangle the bloke. Then do it.
If someone says I'm unlikely to win then I might just have to swallow it.
How old is the car and what mileage has it done?
Without sounding too unsympathetic it sounds like you made virtually no checks on the vehicle before parting with your money.
Surely the corrosion and parking sensors would have been noticeable at the time.
Personally unless it's a complete scrapper I'd get it sorted and move on.
It doesn't sound like the seller is going to play ball so after 12 months in the legal system even if you're successful there's no guarantee of payment.
As a trader he can sell vehicles outside his business privately.
In this case as he's registered it it sounds like it's outside the business.
Most traders don't register for vehicles they're moving on.
Without sounding too unsympathetic it sounds like you made virtually no checks on the vehicle before parting with your money.
Surely the corrosion and parking sensors would have been noticeable at the time.
Personally unless it's a complete scrapper I'd get it sorted and move on.
It doesn't sound like the seller is going to play ball so after 12 months in the legal system even if you're successful there's no guarantee of payment.
As a trader he can sell vehicles outside his business privately.
In this case as he's registered it it sounds like it's outside the business.
Most traders don't register for vehicles they're moving on.
ChocolateFrog said:
wanting to strangle the bloke.
Thats a bit harsh. It's only a rumble noise, its not life threatening, is it. Its not like the gearbox fell out. I doubt the guy even knew about the noise, I very much doubt he drives every car on the motorway to ensure every pernickety customer is 100% happy with their second hand vehicle purchase, when they don't inspect it properly themselves.
I'll bet you have a rumble from your rear end sometimes, but you don't expect to get sued for it , do you?
Edited by fred bloggs on Wednesday 2nd March 14:57
ChocolateFrog said:
Never done it before and would happily avoid it if I could.
Bit of back story. Bought a Jag XJ off ebay recently from a car dealer.
Went to pick it up, short test drive, all seemed well, paid my money and left.
As soon as I got on the motorway it became obvious something was wrong. A rumble from the rear end.
To cut a long story short 'dealer' wants nothing to do with it.
Is this the same car ?Bit of back story. Bought a Jag XJ off ebay recently from a car dealer.
Went to pick it up, short test drive, all seemed well, paid my money and left.
As soon as I got on the motorway it became obvious something was wrong. A rumble from the rear end.
To cut a long story short 'dealer' wants nothing to do with it.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
at least ask what the repair costs
assume you paid for insurance that wont refund in full? road tax , tank of fuel etc ...all the grey hair and worry claiming money off him that you might never get
if its a couple of hundred to make right take it as lesson for next time to look a bit harder
assume you paid for insurance that wont refund in full? road tax , tank of fuel etc ...all the grey hair and worry claiming money off him that you might never get
if its a couple of hundred to make right take it as lesson for next time to look a bit harder
Yikes the perils of ebay...
OP as others have said,
When did this happen?
Age of the car?
Cost of the car?
Also, was there an invoice of any sort, or other sales paperwork?
Was the ebay ID a private one or a registered business seller?
As also mentioned, I think you are likely to need an indy report to substantiate any claims that the car is faulty. Court won't take your word for it...
OP as others have said,
When did this happen?
Age of the car?
Cost of the car?
Also, was there an invoice of any sort, or other sales paperwork?
Was the ebay ID a private one or a registered business seller?
As also mentioned, I think you are likely to need an indy report to substantiate any claims that the car is faulty. Court won't take your word for it...
Volvo1956 said:
How old is the car and what mileage has it done?
Without sounding too unsympathetic it sounds like you made virtually no checks on the vehicle before parting with your money.
Surely the corrosion and parking sensors would have been noticeable at the time.
Personally unless it's a complete scrapper I'd get it sorted and move on.
It doesn't sound like the seller is going to play ball so after 12 months in the legal system even if you're successful there's no guarantee of payment.
As a trader he can sell vehicles outside his business privately.
In this case as he's registered it it sounds like it's outside the business.
Most traders don't register for vehicles they're moving on.
Yes I accept some of the faults and didn't expect a perfect car, but the ad literally said, drives better than most examples. Without sounding too unsympathetic it sounds like you made virtually no checks on the vehicle before parting with your money.
Surely the corrosion and parking sensors would have been noticeable at the time.
Personally unless it's a complete scrapper I'd get it sorted and move on.
It doesn't sound like the seller is going to play ball so after 12 months in the legal system even if you're successful there's no guarantee of payment.
As a trader he can sell vehicles outside his business privately.
In this case as he's registered it it sounds like it's outside the business.
Most traders don't register for vehicles they're moving on.
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