Self employed, claiming milage from leaving the house?

[Tampon]

I work as a self employed speacial needs teacher and have kids I see all over the county. Sometimes we go out and have sessions out and about so drive with the kids in the car or take them to do maths whilst playing golf, or geography in the woods etc. The kids aren't the same every week nor is where we do the sessions.

Regarding claiming milage, I do 10 plus hrs a week working from home, the office is there, and all equipment is stored there. I then travel each day to see 2 to 3 kids. Sometimes I can do 25 miles getting to the first student.

Can I claim the miles leaving my house to the first student and the ones from my final student going home, my thinking is I run the business from home so that is the place of work. There is work at the begining of the day and end of the day to be done at home regading those sessions.

Also I have read about an extra 5p being allowed for a passenger regrding the mileage as well.

Any help gratefully recieved

[Mr Pointy]

Do you work as a Sole Trader or through a Limited Company?

[Simpo Two]

Assuming you're a sole trader, you can charge what you feel appropriate for travel, put it on the bill, and account for it with everything else. 'Private car used for business'. You can claim a proportion of all other car-related costs too.

[Mr Pointy]

Indeed. Keep a very accurate track of business mileage & at the end of the year apportion all running costs (fuel, tyres, servicing, insurance, RAC/AA, etc etc) depending on the business/private mileage ratio. I think I was up to 60% at one time & that was with my accountant throttling it back a bit.

[Tampon]

Thanks guys. I charge per hour and all costs come out of that rate. Car is mainly used for work but I can easily track milage day by day.

Sole trader, going to use simplified accounting for mileage. Main thing is I can claim from the house back to the house. That can be 50 miles in a day some days

[mike9009]

I am prepared to be shot down here. But I thought you should charge 45ppm for business use? This includes all running costs, fuel, insurance and maintenance? Happy to be proven wrong on this though.....

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/rates-a...

[Simpo Two]

mike9009 said:

I am prepared to be shot down here. But I thought you should charge 45ppm for business use? This includes all running costs, fuel, insurance and maintenance? Happy to be proven wrong on this though.....

He can charge £100 a mile if they'll pay it.

But seriously, cars are not cheap to run, even less so now. My invoice would be:

Time: X hours at £Y/hour
Travel: X miles at £Y/mile

Of course if you think they might squeak at the travel element, add it to the hourly rate and offer it free. Or somewhere in-between.

[Mikebentley]

I do sub contract work for a client who pays me a day rate say £250 to carry out site visits. He also pays me mileage on top. Did 260 miles yesterday so that was £90 fuel on top.

[Eric Mc]

Useful article here -

https://www.driversnote.co.uk/hmrc-mileage-guide/s...

Be aware that not every journey undertaken by a self employed individual can be treated as a "business journey" - even if it is work related.

The question raised by the OP is about the tax treatment of travel costs as an ability to reduce his taxable profits. It's not about how much he intends to charge his customers/clients.

[Doofus]

OP, are you talking about charging the client for your mileage, or taking the money out of your company as personal expenses?

[Simpo Two]

Eric Mc said:

The question raised by the OP is about the tax treatment of travel costs as an ability to reduce his taxable profits. It's not about how much he intends to charge his customers/clients.

That's true, though they're connected in that the latter will increase his profit. Essentially he can either pay his own travel costs, or ask the customer to cover them/help with them.

[Eric Mc]

Simpo Two said:

That's true, though they're connected in that the latter will increase his profit. Essentially he can either pay his own travel costs, or ask the customer to cover them/help with them.

It's the same thing. Whether the travel costs or other expenses are listed separately on the sales invoice or incorporated in the overall billed amount is a matter of choice.

Some costs are just recharged at cost - with no profit built in. Others are recharged with some profit element. Many aren't listed separately at all.

[Simpo Two]

Eric Mc said:

Simpo Two said:

That's true, though they're connected in that the latter will increase his profit. Essentially he can either pay his own travel costs, or ask the customer to cover them/help with them.

It's the same thing. Whether the travel costs or other expenses are listed separately on the sales invoice or incorporated in the overall billed amount is a matter of choice.

Indeed. But when you said:

Eric Mc said:

The question raised by the OP is about the tax treatment of travel costs as an ability to reduce his taxable profits. It's not about how much he intends to charge his customers/clients.

- it seemed as if you were separating them.

[Eric Mc]

They are two separate issues -

i) - how do I recover the costs of motor and travelling (or any other business related expense for that matter) from my customer?

ii) - what type of claims can I make against by trading income in order to reduce my taxable profits when it comes to motoring costs?

[Tampon]

Eric Mc said:

The question raised by the OP is about the tax treatment of travel costs as an ability to reduce his taxable profits. It's not about how much he intends to charge his customers/clients.

This is exactly it.

I charge 35 an hour no matter where they are, that structure won't change.

As Eric says I. Asking if I can claim for the miles from my house to the first job if my house is the office.

If I can it makes a big difference to the amount claimed but I want to do it correctly

[Tampon]

Doofus said:

OP, are you talking about charging the client for your mileage, or taking the money out of your company as personal expenses?

I am asking if I can claim on my tax return for the 45p per mile for the miles from my house and back to it at the end of the day if I have my business there.

[Eric Mc]

The answer is "yes" and "no". It depends on the nature of the client you are going to visit and the work arrangement you have with them and how you manage your work from your "home". There was a very important tax case a few years ago where a self employed doctor was not allowed claim all of his travel; costs from his home to some of the places he went to perform his work.

It's called "The Dr Samadian Case".


https://www.accaglobal.com/us/en/technical-activit...

[Tampon]

Thanks Eric, really appricate the time and infomration you are providing. The case above is sort of helpful sort of leaves me in the same position. How can I tell what criteria makes my first and last journey count?

I travel from one borough to the next normally, This means that my first journey can be anywhere from 17 to 34 miles, same on the return journey. I then do another 10-50 miles whilst out and about. I know the out and about miles count but the first and last trip make a big difference to the milage claimed.

My work means that I take excluded students or students that are unable to assess mainstream or special needs provison out on sessions. So I either work in their house with them to try and get them to leave the house or I pick them up from home/school and take them on session. I can pick up kids from home, help them get in the right frame of mind then take them to school, I can pick them up from school and take them out and help them reflex on their day or I can pick up and drop off from home. Me and my car are the tools used to provide the service my business offers.

All the planning, scheduling, admin, communication with local authorities, parents and school and storage of equipment is done from the home address. The minute I leave the house is just for work.

I can't work out if that counts, I wouldn't be doing any miles if I didn't have any clients so I feel they should, the car/ van is a massive tool of the job, it can't be done without it.

I never have the same work week, nor the same locations to go to.

This is my dilemma

Edited by Tampon on Friday 8th April 18:46

[Tampon]

1) Travel expenses for journeys between home (even where the home is used as a place of business) and places of business are treated as non-deductible (other than in very exceptional circumstances, such as if Dr Samadian were at one of the private hospitals preparing to see a patient, realised that he had left their notes in his office at home and made a special trip home but immediately returned to the hospital).

2) Travel expenses are treated as deductible in relation to itinerant work (such as Dr Samadian's home visits to patients).

In regards to no.1 my place of business, that changes day to day, client to client. I don't see students at my house but I do all prep work fro there. Makes me think I can't.

In regards to No. 2 my trips are all home visits/ school visits, which makes me think it is.

Arggggggghhhhhhhhhh

[Tampon]

I have a caravan in storage about 2 miles from my house, I do store studd there liek paddle boards and equipment for sessions that I get, I could easily do some office work there every day if that changes the "place of business" from the home?

Such a ball ache, I just want to claim for the costs of running my business