Your brother has been found dead!
Discussion
On Tuesday this week I took a call from someone advising that they work at a Probate Reasearch Company.
They asked me the spelling of my first name, my mothers maiden name and then asked if I have a brother with the name 'John Doe'.
My answers confirmed her question to which she replied, "Then I'm sorry to inform you that 'John' has been found dead.
He is my eldest brother of four, me being the youngest.
To say I feel gutted this week is an understatement.
The conversation continued with more questions on both sides.
"Where was he found?"
"Did he have a son?"
It turned out that he had fallen down the stairs, cracked 3 ribs, gone to hospital for treatment and then returned home.
Three days later he had passed away in bed from bronchial pneumonia.
Now, to clarify, he had split from a long term partner 2 years ago and moved out of their home.
Later he had moved back in but he, his Ex and her son had separate rooms.
What I don't understand about the whole situation is that his Ex partner and son were unable to provide any contact details of my brothers family even though she knew us all well ? She even told them he didn't have a son ???
The local authority had to take charge, bring in the Probate Company and begin the funeral planning.
The house was 50/50 equally owned by my brother and his Ex.
Was the ignorance a pathetic attempt to prevent his son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house.
I don't know but I feel an anger that this may be the case and that she was willing to send him to his grave without his family knowing and depriving him of our saying good by.
They asked me the spelling of my first name, my mothers maiden name and then asked if I have a brother with the name 'John Doe'.
My answers confirmed her question to which she replied, "Then I'm sorry to inform you that 'John' has been found dead.
He is my eldest brother of four, me being the youngest.
To say I feel gutted this week is an understatement.
The conversation continued with more questions on both sides.
"Where was he found?"
"Did he have a son?"
It turned out that he had fallen down the stairs, cracked 3 ribs, gone to hospital for treatment and then returned home.
Three days later he had passed away in bed from bronchial pneumonia.
Now, to clarify, he had split from a long term partner 2 years ago and moved out of their home.
Later he had moved back in but he, his Ex and her son had separate rooms.
What I don't understand about the whole situation is that his Ex partner and son were unable to provide any contact details of my brothers family even though she knew us all well ? She even told them he didn't have a son ???
The local authority had to take charge, bring in the Probate Company and begin the funeral planning.
The house was 50/50 equally owned by my brother and his Ex.
Was the ignorance a pathetic attempt to prevent his son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house.
I don't know but I feel an anger that this may be the case and that she was willing to send him to his grave without his family knowing and depriving him of our saying good by.
Edited by so called on Friday 19th August 09:19
so called said:
On Tuesday this week I took a call from someone advising that they work at a Probate Reasearch Company.
They asked me the spelling of my first name, my mothers maiden name and then asked if I have a brother with the name 'John Doe'.
My answers confirmed her question to which she replied, "Then I'm sorry to inform you that 'John' has been found dead.
He is my eldest brother of four, me being the youngest.
To say I feel gutted this week is an understatement.
The conversation continued with more questions on both sides.
"Where was he found?"
"Did he have a son?"
It turned out that he had fallen down the stairs, cracked 3 ribs, gone to hospital for treatment and then returned home.
Three days later he had passed away in bed from bronchial pneumonia.
Now, to clarify, he had split from a long term partner 2 years ago and moved out of their home.
Later he had moved back in but he, his Ex and her son had separate rooms.
What I don't understand about the whole situation is that his Ex partner and son were unable to provide any contact details of my brothers family even though she knew us all well ? She even told them he didn't have a son ???
The local authority had to take charge, bring in the Probate Company and begin the funeral planning.
The house was 50/50 equally owned by my brother and his Ex.
Was the ignorance a pathetic attempt to prevent my son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house.
I don't know but I feel an anger that this may be the case and that she was willing to send him to his grave without his family knowing and depriving him of our saying good by.
I'm sorry for your loss. It must be a horrible way to find out about the death of a close relative.They asked me the spelling of my first name, my mothers maiden name and then asked if I have a brother with the name 'John Doe'.
My answers confirmed her question to which she replied, "Then I'm sorry to inform you that 'John' has been found dead.
He is my eldest brother of four, me being the youngest.
To say I feel gutted this week is an understatement.
The conversation continued with more questions on both sides.
"Where was he found?"
"Did he have a son?"
It turned out that he had fallen down the stairs, cracked 3 ribs, gone to hospital for treatment and then returned home.
Three days later he had passed away in bed from bronchial pneumonia.
Now, to clarify, he had split from a long term partner 2 years ago and moved out of their home.
Later he had moved back in but he, his Ex and her son had separate rooms.
What I don't understand about the whole situation is that his Ex partner and son were unable to provide any contact details of my brothers family even though she knew us all well ? She even told them he didn't have a son ???
The local authority had to take charge, bring in the Probate Company and begin the funeral planning.
The house was 50/50 equally owned by my brother and his Ex.
Was the ignorance a pathetic attempt to prevent my son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house.
I don't know but I feel an anger that this may be the case and that she was willing to send him to his grave without his family knowing and depriving him of our saying good by.
I'm a bit confused on one thing... Did your brother have a son, or was it his ex-partner's child? Only asking because you talk about an "attempt to prevent my son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house". If your brother has a son then his assets (in the absence of a will saying otherwise) will go to his children. If he has no children then they will go to the next of kin, which may be you and his other surviving siblings, but I can't see how [i]your[/] son would have any claim to a share of the house.
That said, the actions of his ex seem quite strange, but it may just be that she isn't coping well with the situation rather than a misguided attempt to mislead.
so called said:
Sorry, I meant my brothers son.
She has a son living there.
My brother also has a son.
no one else called you to tell you he had died? was there a funeral? when did you last speak with him?She has a son living there.
My brother also has a son.
How old was he? How old is the son? did the Son not tell you? Was he in a different country?
superlightr said:
no one else called you to tell you he had died? was there a funeral? when did you last speak with him?
How old was he? How old is the son? did the Son not tell you? Was he in a different country?
I was the first point of contact by the probate company to his family.How old was he? How old is the son? did the Son not tell you? Was he in a different country?
From there is was for me to inform his son and the rest of the family, brothers, cousins etc.
He actually died on 5th August.
They traced and called me on 16th.
The funeral is still not set.
He was 72, his son is 38.
boyse7en said:
I'm sorry for your loss. It must be a horrible way to find out about the death of a close relative.
I'm a bit confused on one thing... Did your brother have a son, or was it his ex-partner's child? Only asking because you talk about an "attempt to prevent my son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house". If your brother has a son then his assets (in the absence of a will saying otherwise) will go to his children. If he has no children then they will go to the next of kin, which may be you and his other surviving siblings, but I can't see how [i]your[/] son would have any claim to a share of the house.
That said, the actions of his ex seem quite strange, but it may just be that she isn't coping well with the situation rather than a misguided attempt to mislead.
Yes, I think the worst call I received so far in my life.I'm a bit confused on one thing... Did your brother have a son, or was it his ex-partner's child? Only asking because you talk about an "attempt to prevent my son having any kind of claim of the 50% of the house". If your brother has a son then his assets (in the absence of a will saying otherwise) will go to his children. If he has no children then they will go to the next of kin, which may be you and his other surviving siblings, but I can't see how [i]your[/] son would have any claim to a share of the house.
That said, the actions of his ex seem quite strange, but it may just be that she isn't coping well with the situation rather than a misguided attempt to mislead.
The last being when my father called to say my mother had passed.
Visiting my Nephews home on Tuesday evening was also very painful.
Your point about, "not coping well" has been my thought but as the days have gone by and the authority have provided updates, it is starting to look more the "misguided attempt".
For example, when the authority representative went to speak with the Ex and her son at a pre-arranged time, the Ex had left the house and gone shopping.
It will all come out in the wash.
I'm grateful to the local authority in the considerate way that they have taken control, dealt with us and are being very thorough.
TheLurker said:
What a horrible situation. A hard and sad time when you don't need / want to be getting involved with family feuds.
If it was an attempt by then to block my nephews inheritance, I don't expect we will ever know.The Probate Company went Land Registry for house ownership.
We've advised our nephew to get legal advice sooner rather than later.
Let the legals handle the house side.
No accusations, no feuding.
Jasandjules said:
Sorry to hear this.
Some people are not good when it comes to wills etc. Money seems to come before decency for those people.
Some people are just not good with grief, or imparting bad news (I had to tell my sister that she had arrived an hour too late to see our dad before he died, and I found it tremendously difficult) so I don't think you should make assumptions that the ex is necessarily just after the money. Some people are not good when it comes to wills etc. Money seems to come before decency for those people.
I think the OP is doing the right thing in letting the solicitors and probate sort out any inheritance issues without getting involved. They are professionals and will make sure that the rules are followed, and that everyone who needs to know is kept informed,
Thanks for the reply's.
Small update.
A second son of the Ex appeared on the day my brother died and they were all at their Solicitors the same day.
Able to do that but not remember any names or contact details for of his family.
My open mind has just about closed now.
Authority Rep has told me they will be getting copies of all docs so that we can get then legal aspects checked.
The Coroner has now stated their must be an autopsy and so the death certificate is delayed and so no access to his bank accounts.
And on the bank account details, his ex has said that she was giving him money monthly for her funeral and so any money in there will be hers.
Marvelous, I'm sure they've been able to cobble together a spreadsheet of monthly payments with a dodgy signature over the last 14 days.
My open mind has just slammed shut and I'll be helping my nephew as much as I can..
Small update.
A second son of the Ex appeared on the day my brother died and they were all at their Solicitors the same day.
Able to do that but not remember any names or contact details for of his family.
My open mind has just about closed now.
Authority Rep has told me they will be getting copies of all docs so that we can get then legal aspects checked.
The Coroner has now stated their must be an autopsy and so the death certificate is delayed and so no access to his bank accounts.
And on the bank account details, his ex has said that she was giving him money monthly for her funeral and so any money in there will be hers.
Marvelous, I'm sure they've been able to cobble together a spreadsheet of monthly payments with a dodgy signature over the last 14 days.
My open mind has just slammed shut and I'll be helping my nephew as much as I can..
so called said:
Thanks for the reply's.
Small update.
A second son of the Ex appeared on the day my brother died and they were all at their Solicitors the same day.
Able to do that but not remember any names or contact details for of his family.
My open mind has just about closed now.
Authority Rep has told me they will be getting copies of all docs so that we can get then legal aspects checked.
The Coroner has now stated their must be an autopsy and so the death certificate is delayed and so no access to his bank accounts.
And on the bank account details, his ex has said that she was giving him money monthly for her funeral and so any money in there will be hers.
Marvelous, I'm sure they've been able to cobble together a spreadsheet of monthly payments with a dodgy signature over the last 14 days.
My open mind has just slammed shut and I'll be helping my nephew as much as I can..
A sad and difficult time for you with the loss of your Brother. Keep remote from all the shenanigans that appear to be playing out. Keep your dignity and do the best for your Nephew. So sad to hear this when your thoughts and focus should be able to grieve for your loss as well. Small update.
A second son of the Ex appeared on the day my brother died and they were all at their Solicitors the same day.
Able to do that but not remember any names or contact details for of his family.
My open mind has just about closed now.
Authority Rep has told me they will be getting copies of all docs so that we can get then legal aspects checked.
The Coroner has now stated their must be an autopsy and so the death certificate is delayed and so no access to his bank accounts.
And on the bank account details, his ex has said that she was giving him money monthly for her funeral and so any money in there will be hers.
Marvelous, I'm sure they've been able to cobble together a spreadsheet of monthly payments with a dodgy signature over the last 14 days.
My open mind has just slammed shut and I'll be helping my nephew as much as I can..
Sorry for the tragic news.
You may already be aware of this but if not...the house being owned 50/50 - there are 2 ways this may have been done, joint tenants or tenants in common. If it's the former it will pass outright to the co-owner no matter if there was a Will or not and his next of kin has no claim against it, if it was tenants in common that is very different and his next of kin will have a claim.
Hope that helps.
You may already be aware of this but if not...the house being owned 50/50 - there are 2 ways this may have been done, joint tenants or tenants in common. If it's the former it will pass outright to the co-owner no matter if there was a Will or not and his next of kin has no claim against it, if it was tenants in common that is very different and his next of kin will have a claim.
Hope that helps.
Mr-B said:
Sorry for the tragic news.
You may already be aware of this but if not...the house being owned 50/50 - there are 2 ways this may have been done, joint tenants or tenants in common. If it's the former it will pass outright to the co-owner no matter if there was a Will or not and his next of kin has no claim against it, if it was tenants in common that is very different and his next of kin will have a claim.
Hope that helps.
Thanks very much for this information.You may already be aware of this but if not...the house being owned 50/50 - there are 2 ways this may have been done, joint tenants or tenants in common. If it's the former it will pass outright to the co-owner no matter if there was a Will or not and his next of kin has no claim against it, if it was tenants in common that is very different and his next of kin will have a claim.
Hope that helps.
From the feedback today, there is a tenant agreement. I've not seen the details but the authority person is stating that it looks like the ownership will go to the co-owner.
I was about to google and research this so, again, thanks for the info.
I've asked for a copy and will get it checked out but if its all above board, then I can advise my nephew all is correct.
so called said:
Thanks very much for this information.
From the feedback today, there is a tenant agreement. I've not seen the details but the authority person is stating that it looks like the ownership will go to the co-owner.
I was about to google and research this so, again, thanks for the info.
I've asked for a copy and will get it checked out but if its all above board, then I can advise my nephew all is correct.
You can check it yourself by doing a title search at Land Registry (£3) and see who is on the title and if there is a Form A restriction on the proprietorship section B. If there is then it is tenants in common and all good, if not then it's joint tenants and the property passes 100% to the surviving co-owner.From the feedback today, there is a tenant agreement. I've not seen the details but the authority person is stating that it looks like the ownership will go to the co-owner.
I was about to google and research this so, again, thanks for the info.
I've asked for a copy and will get it checked out but if its all above board, then I can advise my nephew all is correct.
ETA: There could also be a separate deed of trust of course which gives your brother a separate distinct legal share of the property even though it may only show as joint tenants on the title search. Bad practice to do it that way but it still might have been done that way.
Edited by Mr-B on Friday 19th August 17:11
BrettMRC said:
What seems really odd here is why you are getting a call from a Probate research company so soon after your brothers passing.
Something is off there, I doubt the ink is dry on the death certificates yet
edit - or is this the local authority being suspiciously efficient?
He died on 5th Aug.Something is off there, I doubt the ink is dry on the death certificates yet
edit - or is this the local authority being suspiciously efficient?
The probate company contacted me on 11th.
Informed yesterday there is to be an autopsy so no death certificate yet.
I’m grateful to the local authority for their actions.
As I’ve said, his Ex and sons have pleaded ignorance as far as knowing and providing family names/contact details ?
That’s dispute attending weddings etc.
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