Buying dilemma: used hot hatch (S3/RS3) to be sold "soon"
Discussion
G'day everyone,
I am in the process of buying a used hatchback (S3 or RS3 to be sold again in 2-3 yrs max) and I wanted to hear opinions.
Why Hatchback: I'd love to go around the UK with bikes and very few luggages (me and my partner) to visit AONBs. Without bikes I'd have otherwise opted for a TTS or something similar.
Why to be sold in 2-3 yrs: I'm London based and I might be relocated soon abroad (potentially even within 6 months! Most likely in 12-18 though).
Why S3/RS3: from what I saw these hold decently the value, I don't plan to do more than 6k miles a year, so the idea here is that low usage together with car's ability to retain value might help. Yes I also would love to feel a bit of "push" when "opening" with AWD.
Ideally I'm looking at buying something in the range of £30k/£40k (for S3/RS3), use it without destroying it, and then resell hopefully without losing that much money. Apparently it's cheaper for me to buy and resell, rather than using a different solution.
Also, I can buy both straight away, no finance etc to be involved.
Thanks for your time reading and any suggestion!
I am in the process of buying a used hatchback (S3 or RS3 to be sold again in 2-3 yrs max) and I wanted to hear opinions.
Why Hatchback: I'd love to go around the UK with bikes and very few luggages (me and my partner) to visit AONBs. Without bikes I'd have otherwise opted for a TTS or something similar.
Why to be sold in 2-3 yrs: I'm London based and I might be relocated soon abroad (potentially even within 6 months! Most likely in 12-18 though).
Why S3/RS3: from what I saw these hold decently the value, I don't plan to do more than 6k miles a year, so the idea here is that low usage together with car's ability to retain value might help. Yes I also would love to feel a bit of "push" when "opening" with AWD.
Ideally I'm looking at buying something in the range of £30k/£40k (for S3/RS3), use it without destroying it, and then resell hopefully without losing that much money. Apparently it's cheaper for me to buy and resell, rather than using a different solution.
Also, I can buy both straight away, no finance etc to be involved.
Thanks for your time reading and any suggestion!
Serial R/S3 owner speaking.
We are seeing change and disruption across civil society so widely that it makes predictions difficult and hindsight more clear than ever. I think your priorities are to own a fit-for-purpose car for minimised cost over a certain time period, and it seems you have found a model you like as a package.
You are inviting opinions on pretty much all of the above, but will have to decide on the relevance of the views you hear and how much you value certainty.
I would personally consider going a little older if you want to tick these boxes. A 2-3 year old R/S3 will be of the well-regarded 8V model generation and they don't fall to bits (and usually retain a greater part of the purchase cost) as they pass 3+ years age and all the way back to launch cars.
An RS3 is quite a different proposition to an S3; neither is a true hot hatch, but the RS3 especially works best once you see it more like a baby RS6 rather than a hyped-up Golf R. Arguably the pre-facelift 2015-16 RS3 is closer to the former of those two examples (and has one of the very finest noise ranges of any machine), while the facelift 2017-20 model is more like the latter. The steering, dynamics and general weight of the RS3 means it's a brute to the S3's more sophisticated and toned-down style... they are really very different.
The S3 is therefore a slightly more sensible choice, but it of course doesn't quite come with the sense of occasion. It's probably a slightly "safer" bet in that RS3s cost a lot more to buy and run, and are arguably more vulnerable to short-term market shifts.
We are seeing change and disruption across civil society so widely that it makes predictions difficult and hindsight more clear than ever. I think your priorities are to own a fit-for-purpose car for minimised cost over a certain time period, and it seems you have found a model you like as a package.
You are inviting opinions on pretty much all of the above, but will have to decide on the relevance of the views you hear and how much you value certainty.
I would personally consider going a little older if you want to tick these boxes. A 2-3 year old R/S3 will be of the well-regarded 8V model generation and they don't fall to bits (and usually retain a greater part of the purchase cost) as they pass 3+ years age and all the way back to launch cars.
An RS3 is quite a different proposition to an S3; neither is a true hot hatch, but the RS3 especially works best once you see it more like a baby RS6 rather than a hyped-up Golf R. Arguably the pre-facelift 2015-16 RS3 is closer to the former of those two examples (and has one of the very finest noise ranges of any machine), while the facelift 2017-20 model is more like the latter. The steering, dynamics and general weight of the RS3 means it's a brute to the S3's more sophisticated and toned-down style... they are really very different.
The S3 is therefore a slightly more sensible choice, but it of course doesn't quite come with the sense of occasion. It's probably a slightly "safer" bet in that RS3s cost a lot more to buy and run, and are arguably more vulnerable to short-term market shifts.
Hey The Cardinal,
thanks for your insightful advice. Very well articulated.
Forgot to add: the used ones I plan to buy come from the 2016-20 years so yeah, 8V ultimately. The choice between S3 and RS3 will be mostly about "is what the RS3 giving me more than the S3 worth this extra money that'll cost me on a monthly base?"
With "monthly base" I consider:
- Running costs
- Insurance
- Difference between purchase and resell price / months used
Again, money not a problem, but I'm not someone who throws it in the wind pretending it's coming back.
thanks for your insightful advice. Very well articulated.
Forgot to add: the used ones I plan to buy come from the 2016-20 years so yeah, 8V ultimately. The choice between S3 and RS3 will be mostly about "is what the RS3 giving me more than the S3 worth this extra money that'll cost me on a monthly base?"
With "monthly base" I consider:
- Running costs
- Insurance
- Difference between purchase and resell price / months used
Again, money not a problem, but I'm not someone who throws it in the wind pretending it's coming back.
I walk past my local Audi dealer on the way to the train station. They have a 2019 RS3 up for £45k. I cannot see any value in that with what's ahead for the economy. If you're looking to buy now, and step away in under 18 months, expect to lose a substantial amount compared to the good old days of Audi (S/RS) residuals. I'd be looking at the earlier models/cheaper end of your budget to limit my losses.
OP with inflation forecast to be 22% you might get the same amount of £'s back when you sell, but they may not buy you as many tins of beans as before.
Glass half full view = zero depreciation.
Sounds like a good car to enjoy some wonderful trips around our beautiful island - go for it!
Glass half full view = zero depreciation.
Sounds like a good car to enjoy some wonderful trips around our beautiful island - go for it!
To help a little further...
I run a 2016 RS3 at the moment. I was idly looking at early facelift RS3s to replace my facelift S3, but the spec I found on my current (pre-facelift) car meant that I just had to have it. Don't over-read into the online reviews; try one for yourself... or just buy with confidence because they're all good.
I won't know until it's gone what the financial difference will have been. Mine's driven around 5,000 miles a year on a mix of roads, mainly longer trips to visit my parents or on UK-wide business with some occasional local "just because" drives. The RS3 is absolutely the best car for the latter of those.
Expect 25mpg driving an RS3 with some spirit and 35+ touring. At your annual mileage I wouldn't worry. More pertinent will be timing the other consumables, which are a step up on the RS3: brake discs and pads would be £1,500+ all round, £200 per tyre, £160 spark plugs, £3-400 for an oil change -/+ inspection.
I remember reading in the late 00s that cars like the Golf R32 and 130i were the last chance to experience a manual, naturally aspirated engine in a compact hatch. I feel it's the same now... cars like an RS3 that offer supercar noise and near-supercar performance in a practical shell won't be available in 10 years time at £25-45k for a 2-7 year old model. I've had too many experiences that tell me that life is too short and so that's what convinced me...
I run a 2016 RS3 at the moment. I was idly looking at early facelift RS3s to replace my facelift S3, but the spec I found on my current (pre-facelift) car meant that I just had to have it. Don't over-read into the online reviews; try one for yourself... or just buy with confidence because they're all good.
I won't know until it's gone what the financial difference will have been. Mine's driven around 5,000 miles a year on a mix of roads, mainly longer trips to visit my parents or on UK-wide business with some occasional local "just because" drives. The RS3 is absolutely the best car for the latter of those.
Expect 25mpg driving an RS3 with some spirit and 35+ touring. At your annual mileage I wouldn't worry. More pertinent will be timing the other consumables, which are a step up on the RS3: brake discs and pads would be £1,500+ all round, £200 per tyre, £160 spark plugs, £3-400 for an oil change -/+ inspection.
I remember reading in the late 00s that cars like the Golf R32 and 130i were the last chance to experience a manual, naturally aspirated engine in a compact hatch. I feel it's the same now... cars like an RS3 that offer supercar noise and near-supercar performance in a practical shell won't be available in 10 years time at £25-45k for a 2-7 year old model. I've had too many experiences that tell me that life is too short and so that's what convinced me...
I had an 8P (2012) RS3 for about a year. I absolutely loved it. Practical, quick and it sounded amazing. I can't remember why I sold it now.
As mentioned above, the running costs are noticeably higher (the RS tax is real
) than an S3 but definitely worth it, in my opinion.
All mine needed apart from a service (£380 including spark plugs) was a new high-pressure fuel pump (it started leaking and dripping petrol onto the turbo). That was about £500 including labour.
I'd have loved an 8V (the generation after mine) but, alas, it was not to be.
As mentioned above, the running costs are noticeably higher (the RS tax is real
) than an S3 but definitely worth it, in my opinion.All mine needed apart from a service (£380 including spark plugs) was a new high-pressure fuel pump (it started leaking and dripping petrol onto the turbo). That was about £500 including labour.
I'd have loved an 8V (the generation after mine) but, alas, it was not to be.
ZX10R NIN said:
The RS3 is the pick it's the better car & although it'll cost more to run it really is worth it, one other factor is depreciation which is lower on the RS3.
Ultimately it's the more desirable car & that 5 pot is a peach.
The RS3 is certainly the better car but I'm not sure I'd agree about less depreciation in this market.Ultimately it's the more desirable car & that 5 pot is a peach.
To a one they look very toppy right now. Add in running costs and I think you'd take a real bath on any of them if selling in the next two to three years.
If it makes you feel any better, we have an RS3 in at the moment, its destroyed its transfer box once, has the EML on coming on for various reasons ans has now started to leak water ...
We are a small town, there is one other RS3 floating about ... that destroyed its transfer box too.
If your going to buy one expect to throw a few grand at it over the course of ownership.
We are a small town, there is one other RS3 floating about ... that destroyed its transfer box too.
If your going to buy one expect to throw a few grand at it over the course of ownership.
Thanks again all for the contributions.
I think, at the end, that yeah the RS3 is more of an exciting car, but the price tag on many makes me think twice (£40k at least for a decently specced model without too many miles).
Like, this car, £45k for a 2019 with 18k miles that more or less ticked all the checkboxes (mileage and especially the color, my fav)
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202205246...
Doing some "reverse engineering" this should have costed around £53k-54k new, in 3 years loses only £7-8k value... Stretched valuation imho.
So, unless I find something in the £36k-38k area without too many miles I think I'll be opting for a S3 (with sunroof, virtual cockpit and hopefully 19" V-Spoke alloys), doable between £27k-30k as a "safer bet" like The Cardinal has said above, like this one:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202207308...
This said, if someone feels like giving additional suggestions and advices please do, even in PM.
Thanks again, you're a fantastic lot
I think, at the end, that yeah the RS3 is more of an exciting car, but the price tag on many makes me think twice (£40k at least for a decently specced model without too many miles).
Like, this car, £45k for a 2019 with 18k miles that more or less ticked all the checkboxes (mileage and especially the color, my fav)
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202205246...
Doing some "reverse engineering" this should have costed around £53k-54k new, in 3 years loses only £7-8k value... Stretched valuation imho.
So, unless I find something in the £36k-38k area without too many miles I think I'll be opting for a S3 (with sunroof, virtual cockpit and hopefully 19" V-Spoke alloys), doable between £27k-30k as a "safer bet" like The Cardinal has said above, like this one:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202207308...
This said, if someone feels like giving additional suggestions and advices please do, even in PM.
Thanks again, you're a fantastic lot
Those are superb examples. That S3 is very highly spec’d, and probably not something to move on quickly. If you are attracted by spec and are willing to go older, there will be some pre-facelift RS3s like mine with Audi Exclusive paint and other goodies for just a bit more outlay than your linked S3. I dare say they would keep slightly more of their value.
My quick guess on next summer’s trade values would be £25k for that S3 and £35k on the RS3. So, I’m afraid you would lose a chunk of cash even if you experienced little depreciation - mostly because of the dealer margin, not a collapse in values. You would hope to add another few £k for private sales.
My quick guess on next summer’s trade values would be £25k for that S3 and £35k on the RS3. So, I’m afraid you would lose a chunk of cash even if you experienced little depreciation - mostly because of the dealer margin, not a collapse in values. You would hope to add another few £k for private sales.
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