RE: BMW Z4 M Roadster (E85) | The Brave Pill
RE: BMW Z4 M Roadster (E85) | The Brave Pill
Saturday 26th November 2022

BMW Z4 M Roadster (E85) | The Brave Pill

Is this the last four-figure M car?


Last week’s leggy but cheap Porsche Cayman S received plenty of critical love in the comments, and even persuaded its first owner to register with PH to share some of the story behind its spectacular rate of mileage acquisition. All of which may (or may not) have worked towards getting it marked as sold by just 11am on Saturday morning. So let’s see if lightning can strike twice with another Pill that shares some significant similarities. 

Yes, there are some obvious differences. This week’s offering is wearing a spinning propeller rather than Stuttgart’s coat of arms, its engine is at the opposite end and it lacks a roof. But this is still a smart-looking noughties German sportscar producing more than 300hp and directing firepower to the rear axle. A £9,990 price tag makes it just ten quid cheaper than the Cayman S, and although its 132,000 mileage is enough to be considered leggy in this part of the market, it is still only two-thirds what the Porsche had managed to rack up. That all adds up to bargain, right?

Of course, those who have previously been expecting the Z4M to soar in value have had plenty of time to grow long, grey beards as prices have stayed as flat as the less topographically interesting parts of Norfolk. Against the criteria for the most desirable M cars, both the coupe and roadster versions of the Z4M have almost a full set of ticks: limited volumes, cool design and one of the division’s stand-out powerplants – in this case the 338hp S54 six-cylinder shared with the E46 M3. Yet it still sits in residual shadow cast by the dynamically inferior Z3M, with even rough-looking examples of the earlier roadster being offered for more than twice as much as our Pill, and the average asking for the Z3M Coupes in the classifieds north of £40,000. 

That could mean – as burned-finger crypto-bros are still assuring us – that this is the perfect time to buy, man! But it is also likely the market’s acknowledgement that the Z4M has always been a car that it’s easier to like than to live with, coming from an era when M Division regarded its principles as being sacrosanct. Squeezing the old M3’s engine into the lightweight Z4 created a pocket rocketship with the ability to both outgun the contemporary Cayman S and out-handle the porkier Mercedes SLK 55 AMG. M’s engineers even went to the considerable effort of plumbing in hydraulic power steering on the basis that the regular Z4’s electrically aided rack wasn’t reckoned to be communicative enough. Who needs more than that level of dedication?

Most potential buyers, it turned out. M Division’s passion couldn’t mask the Z4’s fundamental flaws for those seeking even a modicum of practicality. The original UK press launch for the Z4M was held in South Carolina, using right-hand-drive cars direct from the factory at Spartanburg that built them. Journos were given these for a couple of days to head and have photogenic adventures – I had the unoriginal idea of heading for the Tail of the Dragon in North Carolina. Sadly the roadster’s paltry luggage space meant that the photographer I was working with had to travel with his sizeable camera bag resting on his lap for 200 miles, with a tripod squeezed into the space between seats and roll-over hoops so the roof couldn’t shut. Still, I got off lightly – the crew from another magazine were caught breaking the speed limit by such a margin they got a night in the cells and have been ribbed with Duelling Banjo jokes ever since.

While limited practicality was shared with the regular Z4, the senior version also lacked much of the driver-flattering handling that early 21st century buyers expected the M badge to deliver. It gripped tenaciously and turned enthusiastically, but pushing too hard turned it snappy and bitey where the contemporary M3 was smooth and progressive, and the ride could be punishingly hard too. The margin between “I’ve got it” and “it’s got me” was barely broader than it had been in the similarly tetchy Z3M.

But the biggest problem was the price. As launched the M Roadster cost £42,750, which might look like outstanding value in these inflated times, but meant the BMW was four grand pricier than a Boxster S in 2003. Yes, the Z4 was quicker, but it couldn’t match the Porsche on dynamic finesse or practicality – and to no great surprise, the BMW’s depreciation curve resembled the trajectory of a depressed lemming. Well before the earliest examples reached their tenth birthdays, they often dropped to £10,000 or even less. Which is pretty much where this one is nearly another decade on.

Granted, the money being asked for shinier and lower mileage Z4Ms has risen in recent years, but although our Pill is the least expensive currently in the classifieds its four-figure price tag doesn’t make it an outlier against the wider market. The dealer’s valuation is probably underwritten by the fact this one has covered 132,000 miles, which is well beyond most of its coddled siblings. But with the advert’s promise of a full service history that doesn’t need to be a cause for undue concern. Nor, to be honest, is the fact it has had six owners in 16 years – this is the sort of automotive itch many will scratch quickly before moving on.

The MOT history is short on shocks. Like most M cars, this one has obviously been heavy on brakes, tyres and suspension components to judge from semi-frequent advisories and occasional fails. But there is nothing scary in the record and our Pill seems to have acquired mileage at a steady rate, the official record suggesting it has been on the road without interruptions. In short, it looks like a well-priced, usable M car of the sort that are getting thin on the ground for anything like this money these days. Will it rise in value? Possibly – but does it matter if it doesn’t? Start drawing Venn circles around ‘21st century M cars’, ‘affordable’ and ‘not a hulking SUV’ and the Z4M is the only car left in the shade. For that reason alone it has to be a winner.


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Author
Discussion

rassi

Original Poster:

2,517 posts

281 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
The Z4MC is still a very good bet for a future classic and having owned both the Z3 and Z4 version, the latter is a much better drive.

The Z4MR is a personal choice but the Pill looks good and a bargain!

Niffty951

2,400 posts

258 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
This is a braver pill than you might have bargained for. The E36 M3 front end and E46 rear with 'F1 inspired' M differential sound like a recipe for a BMW GT3 rival.

In some ways I felt my Z4MC was pretty close to that level, but it was also the most frightening car I've ever driven at speed. I bought mine nearly new, a 2007 car in 2008 from a main dealer but honestly if I hadn't I'd have assumed the car had something wrong with the chassis. When I sold if and bought a TVR Cerbera 4.2 I remember the wash of relief at how predictable and communicative the TVR was in a slide.

The numb electric steering, sharp throttle and lack of weight over the rear wheels, plus some unusual straight line bump response characteristics (I've never seen in any car before or since) meant this car had a habit of whipping 90 degrees to face the hedge, truck etc seemingly out of nowhere!

You can actually see it do it on film in the best motoring episode featuring the Z4M during the race. I think in this instance it was under braking but look at the speed the thing pivots round!

I feel lucky to have survived and sold mine.






































Billy_Whizzzz

2,640 posts

173 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
As has been discussed endlessly, they are an acquired taste, having left the factory very unresolved in the handling department. They really don’t inspire confidence, whatever you do to them, whether in a straight line on an A/B road that has a modest degree of camber or round corners. On billiard smooth roads with no camber it was fine but the UK isn’t made of roads like that. I had mine fettled by Redish Motorsport, Birds and BMW and none of them ever set up the handling so it felt safe, predictable and a pleasure to drive. I’d had loads of other BMWs before and after all of which drove much better, and a Boxster is a revelation by comparison, as is an M3 of similar vintage.

essayer

10,410 posts

224 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
We managed two people camping at Le Mans in our Z4MR, it’s practical enough biggrin

Known M3 underpinnings surely make this a reasonable bet?

Billy_Whizzzz

2,640 posts

173 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Niffty951 said:
This is a braver pill than you might have bargained for. The E36 M3 front end and E46 rear with 'F1 inspired' M differential sound like a recipe for a BMW GT3 rival.

In some ways I felt my Z4MC was pretty close to that level, but it was also the most frightening car I've ever driven at speed. I bought mine nearly new, a 2007 car in 2008 from a main dealer but honestly if I hadn't I'd have assumed the car had something wrong with the chassis. When I sold if and bought a TVR Cerbera 4.2 I remember the wash of relief at how predictable and communicative the TVR was in a slide.

The numb electric steering, sharp throttle and lack of weight over the rear wheels, plus some unusual straight line bump response characteristics (I've never seen in any car before or since) meant this car had a habit of whipping 90 degrees to face the hedge, truck etc seemingly out of nowhere!

You can actually see it do it on film in the best motoring episode featuring the Z4M during the race. I think in this instance it was under braking but look at the speed the thing pivots round!

I feel lucky to have survived and sold mine.
I concur absolutely which is why I sold mine. BTW it doesn’t have electric steering tho.

g3org3y

22,505 posts

221 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Niffty951 said:
Z4MC

The numb electric steering, sharp throttle and lack of weight over the rear wheels, plus some unusual straight line bump response characteristics (I've never seen in any car before or since) meant this car had a habit of whipping 90 degrees to face the hedge, truck etc seemingly out of nowhere!
Am pretty sure on the M models (Roadster and Coupe) the EPAS was changed to good old fashioned HPAS.

I certainly agree with the numbness to the steering on the EPAS versions (DOI: owns 3.0Si Roadster). And it's certainly 'skittish'. How much that is in part to the (terrible IMO) Bridgstone RE050A RFTs, not sure. But again, I think RFTs were eschewed in favour of normal rubber on the M models.

For me, even the 3.0Si feels like an 7-8/10 car. Push above that and it feels a bit wayward (genuinely skittish) and not especially confidence inspiring.

All the reports I've read suggest the M is a bit of a handful when pushing on.

Edited by g3org3y on Saturday 26th November 07:08

breezer42

146 posts

181 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Having had both a Z3MC and a Z4MC, I could just never get on with the latter.

The gearbox wasn’t brilliant, the suspension too stiff and too crashy - suffering from a frankly appalling ride quality compared to the 3 - and worst of all, it had bump steer.

The electronic throttle was an absolute disgrace. Trying to rev match coming off a motorway was nigh on impossible, as it would “intelligently adapt” and insist that you need to use WOT to move the revs at all.

Beyond that though, I can’t quite place why I never loved it because it had all the right ingredients? But then somehow came together cynically, like a corporate attempt at copying the earlier car by someone who, without knowing the first thing about cars, said “yes the Z3MC sold well, let’s make this one like that“.

It was beautiful in Interlagos blue, but it just left me cold, where the 3 was an absolute riot.

Edited by breezer42 on Saturday 26th November 07:20

Niffty951

2,400 posts

258 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Thanks for the correction! I didn't realise they'd made the effort to switch back to hydraulic, sadly I wouldn't say it was hugely more feelsome than the 3.0si. As said above, the Boxster of the day was in a different league for steering feel

plenty

5,036 posts

216 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
I'd been looking at these for about ten years but was always put off by reports of wayward handling (and I'm very picky about handling with the previous two cars I sold being a Lotus Evora and Megane R26.R).

I finally dived in earlier this year with a high-miles example that cost me four figures to buy, and I don't think I've ever had a car that exceeded my expectations so much.

The handling issues out of the box are due to mismatched spring rates that are too soft at the front and too stiff at the rear. A set of £900 BC coilovers will easily sort that out and give you handling to do justice to that incredible engine.

If the rod bearings have been done and the oil changed frequently, the S54 will go on forever. Most oily bits and suspension parts are easy and cheap to source (although ///M bumpers and undertrays are now getting very hard to find). The car is a delight to DIY as only 1990s/2000s BMWs can be. The Z4 forums and even the FB communities are active, informative and by and large sensible.

I was half expecting to hate it and to move it on after the summer. Instead, I can see myself keeping it for a while like the last ///M I owned, an E39 which lasted nine years.

broncoupe

165 posts

256 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
where do i find that video please

Spleen

5,453 posts

151 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Age hasn’t done anything for that styling.

pb8g09

3,262 posts

99 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
With that mileage, by the time you’ve had your fun in it, it will surely be hard to get someone else to give you much for it.

Niffty951

2,400 posts

258 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
broncoupe said:
where do i find that video please
The best motoring?
https://youtu.be/ZZ-v99zTHLo

Battle starts 26min in but there's more Z4M content too

Ops! Not that one, Z4m looks the hero there haha. They use it in another battle, from memory it's dry and the Z4 is red. It bites in the hairpin. Again all from an old memory.

I mean when it's good it's really good, but when it's bad it's horrid.









Edited by Niffty951 on Saturday 26th November 09:23

bencollins4

1,241 posts

236 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Bought one in early 2013 for £12,995 as a BMW approved used car which at the time was less than 6 years old and 45k miles so a relative bargain!

Engine was wonderful, and obviously went well enough and made a great noise, but the rest of the car was really very ordinary. Steering electric or not, it had next to no feel or idea of just how much grip there was. It was relatively capable, but you were kept guessing at what point it might let go!

Sold after 18 months for practicality reasons but I wasn’t particularly tempted to hang on to it.

apm142001

293 posts

119 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
plenty said:
If the rod bearings have been done and the oil changed frequently, the S54 will go on forever.
Does the S54 suffer from rod bearing failure too? Thought that was only the S65 and S85?

Interesting to hear a bit of detail from owners on the handling, sounds as if it’s bit of an M135i-esque handful in the real world (or at least, on crappy British road surfaces).


cerb4.5lee

44,962 posts

210 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
I really wanted to love mine, but like others I didn't get on with the gearbox/chassis/suspension/ride. It just wasn't a very resolved car when you pushed on in it, and it was especially poor if the road was bumpy.

I'm glad that I got to try one though.



T1berious

2,675 posts

185 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
I loved mine. Was it perfect? No far from it but starting it up and getting into that cabin always felt like an event.

Spirited driving was certainly an undertaking not taken lightly but hearing that engine sing was always worth the effort.

Flawed gem and really a well sorted E46 M3 was the better steer.


plenty

5,036 posts

216 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
apm142001 said:
Does the S54 suffer from rod bearing failure too? Thought that was only the S65 and S85?

Interesting to hear a bit of detail from owners on the handling, sounds as if it’s bit of an M135i-esque handful in the real world (or at least, on crappy British road surfaces).
It's not as chronic as with the other two engines, but rod bearings do go and any S54 should have had them changed by now. One reason why a higher-miles car with good history makes for a better buy than a garage queen.

On one hand it's a shame these cars were unresolved out of the factory and attracted poor reviews, as they are so close to greatness. It seems they rushed to bring the car to market knowing the E89 was to be launched in 2009, and signed off the suspension too soon.

But once you've done the simple mods you own a two-seat ///M roadster with one of history's finest engines, which is equally as accomplished on the twisties as on the autobahns.

I've already mentioned coilovers. The steering is not Lotus level but isn't terrible, and is improved by adding caster and camber. Remove the CDV and the gearchange is a delight. I can only assume that criticisms of the throttle response apply to Sport mode, as with the Sport button off the throttle is beautifully linear and perfectly matches the S54's entirely flat power/torque curve.

I've been lucky to own some pretty decent stuff and my lightly-modded Z4MR is up there with the best. I rather enjoy being in on a well-kept secret.

g3org3y

22,505 posts

221 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
Do the M models have the same manual (6 speed) box as the 3.0Si? Do they come with the ZHP knob as standard? I've found that to be a decent cheapo mod to improve the box feel.

plenty said:
On one hand it's a shame these cars were unresolved out of the factory and attracted poor reviews, as they are so close to greatness. It seems they rushed to bring the car to market knowing the E89 was to be launched in 2009, and signed off the suspension too soon.
Seems weird that BMW signed it off like this, especially when as you mention it doesn't take much to get it well sorted.

plenty

5,036 posts

216 months

Saturday 26th November 2022
quotequote all
g3org3y said:
Do the M models have the same manual (6 speed) box as the 3.0Si? Do they come with the ZHP knob as standard? I've found that to be a decent cheapo mod to improve the box feel.

plenty said:
On one hand it's a shame these cars were unresolved out of the factory and attracted poor reviews, as they are so close to greatness. It seems they rushed to bring the car to market knowing the E89 was to be launched in 2009, and signed off the suspension too soon.
Seems weird that BMW signed it off like this, especially when as you mention it doesn't take much to get it well sorted.
Same 'box as the Si. And non-ZHP knob. I use a StormWerks aluminium item.

As you say, it's unlike BMW to sign off such easily-addressed flaws. You'd associate that sort of thing more with the likes of Alfa. Reminds me of the 4C with AlfaWorks mods I drove, which handled beautifully despite the standard car getting panned by reviewers.