Only genuine, honest people have anything to worry about
Discussion
I’ve pondered this for a while and the recent gift-aid thread really got me wondering-
So only genuine, honest people have anything to worry about?
Do the (hundreds of) thousands of ‘companies’ who took out multiple £50k BBL’s, withdraw the cash, walked away from the company then bother to keep records of where they spent the money incase they get an investigation?
Not a chance.
I know of a guy who’s done exactly that and from what I can tell HMRC aren’t remotely interested.
I know a nice guy who charges vat etc yet he can’t read and write so how’s he gonna keep accurate records?
Another guy I know has built and sold multiple (10+) PPR’s…. Never paid a penny of tax especially as his original career was powder. I guess he just has a friendly solicitor, after all, there’s no log book for houses.
So essentially, are hard working, justice fearing individuals like me the only ones declaring? I don’t take cash, employ 30 people and pay their PAYE, Corp tax, vat, etc etc and if there’s anything left over pay more tax for fear of retribution.
I guess if you’ve never been ON ‘the system’ you’re a lot harder to trace!
So only genuine, honest people have anything to worry about?
Do the (hundreds of) thousands of ‘companies’ who took out multiple £50k BBL’s, withdraw the cash, walked away from the company then bother to keep records of where they spent the money incase they get an investigation?
Not a chance.
I know of a guy who’s done exactly that and from what I can tell HMRC aren’t remotely interested.
I know a nice guy who charges vat etc yet he can’t read and write so how’s he gonna keep accurate records?
Another guy I know has built and sold multiple (10+) PPR’s…. Never paid a penny of tax especially as his original career was powder. I guess he just has a friendly solicitor, after all, there’s no log book for houses.
So essentially, are hard working, justice fearing individuals like me the only ones declaring? I don’t take cash, employ 30 people and pay their PAYE, Corp tax, vat, etc etc and if there’s anything left over pay more tax for fear of retribution.
I guess if you’ve never been ON ‘the system’ you’re a lot harder to trace!
Ahhhhh man! Tax is really getting me annoyed at the moment, I'm PAYE and there is little I can do about it apart from the usual things. I have just landed in Rishi's wonderful 65% tax bracket, which I know is full on "oh cry me a river territory" but I feel like I'm taking a grade A buggering right now. f**krishi.xls is working overtime to keep the kicking to a minimum. The losing half the free childcare is another kick in the jacobs I could do without.
Meanwhile all this is going on, I have a friend in a WhatsApp group, who likes to mock the above, he has a business and is so brazen with how avoids paying any tax, its so brazen I always think he's going to get caught out, but it never seems to be the case.
Top that up with essentially high level fraud during COVID, Bounce Back Loans, Grants being handed out with zero diligence done and at the higher end this PPE fraud, yes I feel f
king aggrieved by it all, as I think I have the right to be.
Meanwhile all this is going on, I have a friend in a WhatsApp group, who likes to mock the above, he has a business and is so brazen with how avoids paying any tax, its so brazen I always think he's going to get caught out, but it never seems to be the case.
Top that up with essentially high level fraud during COVID, Bounce Back Loans, Grants being handed out with zero diligence done and at the higher end this PPE fraud, yes I feel f
king aggrieved by it all, as I think I have the right to be.I got a tax demand on Saturday for the 2018-19 tax year. This was the year I contacted HMRC to reclaim higher rate relief on my pension contributions for 3 tax years. I spent nearly 2 hours on the phone with them in 2019 going through the figures and agreeing the calculations for the refund.
Since then, this is the 3rd time they have "recalculated " the 2018-19 year and claimed I owe them tax - coincidentally the amount they say is due is the same amount as the refund for the tax years prior to 2018-19. The useless staff and systems can't even keep correct records or calculations. And don't get me started on the ridiculous system of having to separately apply to get higher rate relief on pension contributions!
Since then, this is the 3rd time they have "recalculated " the 2018-19 year and claimed I owe them tax - coincidentally the amount they say is due is the same amount as the refund for the tax years prior to 2018-19. The useless staff and systems can't even keep correct records or calculations. And don't get me started on the ridiculous system of having to separately apply to get higher rate relief on pension contributions!
Brisvegas 997C2S said:
he has a business and is so brazen with how avoids paying any tax, its so brazen I always think he's going to get caught out, but it never seems to be the case.
Small but important point - avoiding tax is legal (anyone with an ISA is avoiding tax); evading tax is not. So you can arrange your affairs to reduce tax liability legally and boast about it if you wish. Note that having a business doesn't necessarily make you rich; it can equally well make you bankrupt. It does open up more financial options than being PAYE, but on the downside, there's nobody to give you money when you're sick or on holiday. Risk/reward.That said, if your friend is actually doing something illegal and boasting about it on social media, he's not that smart.
Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 16th January 10:19
Simpo Two said:
Small but important point - avoiding tax is legal (anyone with an ISA is avoiding tax); evading tax is not. So you can arrange your affairs to reduce tax liability legally and boast about it if you wish. Note that having a business doesn't necessarily make you rich; it can equally well make you bankrupt. It does open up more financial options than being PAYE, but on the downside, there's nobody to give you money when you're sick or on holiday. Risk/reward.
That said, if your friend is actually doing something illegal and boasting about it on social media, he's not that smart.
I don't know all the ins and outs of it or the business to know whether its illegal or not or being efficient. but the attitude towards is what stinks, which makes me feel like something isn't as it should be. That said, if your friend is actually doing something illegal and boasting about it on social media, he's not that smart.
Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 16th January 10:19
AnotherUsername said:
Do the (hundreds of) thousands of ‘companies’ who took out multiple £50k BBL’s, withdraw the cash, walked away from the company then bother to keep records of where they spent the money incase they get an investigation?
Not a chance.
I know of a guy who’s done exactly that and from what I can tell HMRC aren’t remotely interested.
Supposedly over a billion pounds of bounce back loans have been identified as likely fraudulent. It's going to take decades to process them all, he may well get away with it. Some don't, of course.Not a chance.
I know of a guy who’s done exactly that and from what I can tell HMRC aren’t remotely interested.
Yep, even when they were dishing out the loans it was obvious folk were taking the piss. As a wage slave it's incredibly frustrating to watch the pot you have contributed to be squandered so carelessly.
The richest guys where I live (billionaires) have a well known criminal past and have built their business on ruthlessly underhand tactics, bribes and threats. There's another guy I know that seems to be raking in a fortune running a Ponzi scheme dressed up as property investment and is making further money by running seminars recruiting people to his Ponzi scheme. Many of his social media channels have comments from people saying they were ripped off by him either through this business or through his previous ForEx business. He's still getting away with it though and has been for years.
It seems that ruthless people with no conscience do well.
The richest guys where I live (billionaires) have a well known criminal past and have built their business on ruthlessly underhand tactics, bribes and threats. There's another guy I know that seems to be raking in a fortune running a Ponzi scheme dressed up as property investment and is making further money by running seminars recruiting people to his Ponzi scheme. Many of his social media channels have comments from people saying they were ripped off by him either through this business or through his previous ForEx business. He's still getting away with it though and has been for years.
It seems that ruthless people with no conscience do well.
Since this is a car forum.
Why doesnt HMRC just do a trawl of those people driving cars worth more than ~£200K.
A conversation like this
HMRC: We think you owe us tax! Make us an offer to go away otherwise full audit while we bend you over!
N Zahawi: How about £1m.
HMRC: Make it £5m and we'll call it quits. You have 30 days.
No time wasting lengthy investigations. Straight into the Treasuries coffers.
Why doesnt HMRC just do a trawl of those people driving cars worth more than ~£200K.
A conversation like this
HMRC: We think you owe us tax! Make us an offer to go away otherwise full audit while we bend you over!
N Zahawi: How about £1m.
HMRC: Make it £5m and we'll call it quits. You have 30 days.
No time wasting lengthy investigations. Straight into the Treasuries coffers.
Mogul said:
I like that idea - but where would the UK tax inspectors hit to catch them all - no real oligarch ski slopes to talk of (sorry Scotland)?I guess outside Harrods wouldn't be a bad start.....
Brisvegas 997C2S said:
I don't know all the ins and outs of it or the business to know whether its illegal or not or being efficient. but the attitude towards is what stinks, which makes me feel like something isn't as it should be.
Fair point. So a bit like the 'Considerably Richer Than Yow' character of Harry Enfield.
I know of a few tax dodging contractors in my line of work. I mean properly off radar not paying any tax. One of them even has a council house even though he's taking home 2 grand every week and has done week in week out in the 8 years I've known him.
Not quite business related but another guy I know, contractor via Ltd company avoiding as much tax as possible, grows cannabis providing around 3k per month income, his GF is an accountant and does only fans in her spare time, they have a housing association house so very cheap rent and sublet the spare room out to a family member which almost covers the rent in full. Oh and a 10k covid grant too, plus furlough money.
I try not to hate the player, but when I see him rolling round in a V10 daily and aircraft hanger of collectable cars through ill-gotten gains while we tread water most of the time trying to do the right thing, it does piss me off.
Not quite business related but another guy I know, contractor via Ltd company avoiding as much tax as possible, grows cannabis providing around 3k per month income, his GF is an accountant and does only fans in her spare time, they have a housing association house so very cheap rent and sublet the spare room out to a family member which almost covers the rent in full. Oh and a 10k covid grant too, plus furlough money.
I try not to hate the player, but when I see him rolling round in a V10 daily and aircraft hanger of collectable cars through ill-gotten gains while we tread water most of the time trying to do the right thing, it does piss me off.
Edited by Raymond Reddington on Monday 16th January 18:41
Raymond Reddington said:
Not quite business related but another guy I know, contractor via Ltd company avoiding as much tax as possible, grows cannabis providing around 3k per month income, his GF is an accountant and does only fans in her spare time, they have a housing association house so very cheap rent and sublet the spare room out to a family member which almost covers the rent in full.
Who wouldn't aspire to a life like that? 
Raymond Reddington said:
Sheepshanks said:
Who wouldn't aspire to a life like that?
I certainly don't, but they have plenty of money, holidays, shop daily at waitrose, and have a very nice lifestyle by all accounts, which feels unfair when you are a normal person trying to do the right thing all the time. Raymond Reddington said:
GF <...> does only fans in her spare time, they have a housing association house
Thats some fked up version of a "very nice lifestyle".deckster said:
Thats some fked up version of a "very nice lifestyle".
The cheap house and six figure income means the lifestyle is very good, even if they do live in a sked up version of a "very nice lifestyle".t house. As I said before, not something to aspire to for sure, but I do aspire to their car collection - personally I'd rather earn properly and legally or not have it at all. Raymond Reddington said:
The cheap house and six figure income means the lifestyle is very good, even if they do live in a st house. As I said before, not something to aspire to for sure, but I do aspire to their car collection - personally I'd rather earn properly and legally or not have it at all.
The pedantry of PH is incredible. t house. As I said before, not something to aspire to for sure, but I do aspire to their car collection - personally I'd rather earn properly and legally or not have it at all. Don't worry, your posts make sense in context of the thread, there are just some funny f
kers on here. Yes having that much disposable income from illegal and morally dubious activities isn't fair and you are right to feel annoyed by it. Doing the right thing doesn't always seem worth it when you see things like this.
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