FL5 Civic Type R

[VTECMatt]

Little bit of history, I had one of the very first EK9 Civic Type R’s to come to the UK back in 1998/99 and enjoyed 4 years of fun and most recently enjoyed 5 years from new an FK8 so I guess you could call me a fanboy.
The Type R has changed significantly since the original so not even worth comparing and if you are a die hard Honda person no doubt the thought of a Turbo VTEC is the devils work, but if you are being honest the lack of torque was as frustrating as fun in the EK9. The K20 engines addressed this a little starting in the EP3 (Breadvan version) then developing into the FK2 the first turbo engine in a Type R.



Firstly Let me tell you buying this 47K car was not fun (more on that shortly). As we all know it isn’t cheap and I feel privileged to be in a position to own a car such as this and I’ll start by saying this isn’t a 15k better car than the FK8 that I bought in 2017 new. How ever things move on, a loaf of bread is 40% more expensive than what it was 12 months ago so a car you would expect might be too?



So I placed my £500 deposit in March 2022, sorry expression of interest, I chose a big dealership group as with the FK8, best chance of getting a car and had it confirmed I would receive their first car as placed deposit first, great news!
Over the next twelve months the lack of information was zero until December when I found out allocations were happening with deliveries in January 2023, not perfect as away but still something to finally look forward to. I’d not had a call from the dealer so I phoned up, they told me no news so I was like ‘you are one of the largest in the North West, how come others are’ re getting cars had paperwork sent etc? Their responses were dismissive with the promise I would be getting a car and they would be in touch. The only caveat being you will get the colour that is delivered, no choice, its that or you wait an unbeknown time.
Coming into January now and I knew via facebook groups owners were getting their cars and wo betold a picture of a Blue FL5 Civic Type R appeared on the groups website, removing the delivery wrapping, staff excited saying how the first owner is looking forward to delivery, I was like I didn’t even know the car was there, so phoned up only to be told and sit down for this, this was sold to someone who put down their deposit in August, but its ok he has decided he doesn’t want it but happy to sell for a 10K premium payable directly to him. At this point I was fuming, the dealer claiming I had put my deposit down late August and was second in the list (later found out I wasn’t second either) after some polite but frustrated exchange of words I though forget it but then thought nope I’m going to call them out. So I wrote to Honda UK, Honda Japan and Senior person at Dealer.
In a nut shell I believe that they sold their first car to a ‘good’ customer (maybe themselves) to turn a profit, I have no evidence of this and was told by a senior person that they didn’t sell that car on in the end but that car disappeared shortly afterwards.
After that st show, I eventually got allocated a car via Honda UK and that given the situation most likely get the colour I wanted which I duly collected in March.




I didn’t buy this car to pose in or as a primary track car, it is a car I use for fun on B roads in all weathers and will transport me and my family across Europe for our family holiday this year. I had the car PPF’d and ceramic coated as the paint is piss poor, trust me after 10k miles the paintwork will start looking tired, my FK8 got chipped in random places too.

Now people tell me I’m very picky and fussy and I am so maybe my feedback seems petty but it is what is.
Negatives

• Too many bloody warnings, lane departure, rear seats, flashing lights on hard breaking, arse too fat, I can go on. Sadly this isn’t just a Honda thing, pisses me off.
• Centre screen needs angling a little to the driver
• Can’t get Wi-Fi hot spot
• Not enough storage in the cabin, the centre storage is useless
• Window rattles when half way down, it did the same on the FK8, yes you can fit wind deflectors but they look st, how many illiterations do you need to get something so simple right,
• When I heard tyre noise was bad I thought well can’t be that bad, but it really is, it wouldn’t be so bad if they fitted a half decent set of speakers. Hey ho it’s a performance car.
• Engine sounds like a tractor but then I expected that it’s the same as previous two versions.
• Lo res reversing camera is appalling, on a 47k car very poor.
• Maybe being picky but I find the cruise with lane control a bit average, it brakes too soon when it sees a car in front and tends to hunt around a bit across the lane you are in. The Tesla is much better.
• It has a nasty buzz somewhere from the middle of the dash, maybe the speaker at high revs, I'm sure the dealer will enjoy working that one out!

Positives

• Oh my word I didn’t think on a car this heavy you could nail the handling any better than the FK8. It is phenomenal, rear grip is crazy and whilst you can get movement you need to be really on it and lift. Cornering is flat, maybe it’s down to the surprisingly (surprising as the bolsters are not that big) supportive seats? But at any point and it just goes where you point it. It is as good a handling car that I would want in a 4 door family car.
• The steering is perfectly waited in sport and I love the steering wheel.
• When watching videos you see how much people move in the car so you assume must be uncomfortably bad however I was pleasantly surprised by the damping, yes you do move but rides over some of the b roads I lifted on in the FK8, that I don’t need to in the FL5, some witch craft that.
• The drivability has improved over FK8 with very little lag, really noticeable on road less so on track
• R+ on track is brilliant although found slightly stiff for a small section of the Nurburgring
• Comfort is well comfortable, happy poodling along at 70mph on the motorways.
• As a driver they have designed the seating position, the wheel, the pedals in a way that makes you feel like you are sat in a racing car, all round good visibility, low enough seat and a screen that shows just enough information. You want more glance left for all the dials on a screen you’d ever want.
• Seats are brilliant, just drove from Nurburgring back to the Lake District in one hit, no back issues although I had to adjust on way out as wasn’t so comfy.
• Brakes as per the updated FK8 are good and what I expected. Not quite as good as I want as a bit too much pedal travel but being very picky, 3 laps back to back on The ring and still good although did bring up a warning light.
• Interior is light and day ahead of everything I have had Honda wise and getting on par with German brands and in some case better. The switchgear is bang on and gets the JDM and luxury feel bang on. Using the screen is simple and easy to follow. (Good for me as I’m a dinosaur)

I love the red carpets, harks back to the original EK9, however they get dirty so fitted my spare set in black from my FK8 which pretty much fit.

• I actually don’t mind the pipes in sound thought I’d hate it but given I can’t wind down the windows does the trick for me.
• The ability to select everything in individual mode is great for me, really should have been available on all FK8’s.
• Gear shift is so nice, not quite as good as I remember in my EK9, you could flat in that, not sure I could do this, certainly not in the FK8, well you could but you got resistance.
• Looks great, going to get the winglets colour coded as think the rear wing disappears in certain photos.
• What surprised me most was how on track it didn’t get flustered despite doing 3 hard laps back to back at Nurburgring, everything felt good, it could do with another 50bhp, braided lines and upgraded fluid I think but for now leaving completely stock.
• I’ve saved the best till last, it’s easy to clean, the FK8 was a right old ball ache, oh and black wheel nuts.

The car feels very stable at speed hitting over 150mph, think it was 158mph on GPS on the Autobahn trying to stay with a tuned V10 R8!



So all in just done 2K mileage, so far very pleased with my purchase, originally this was gong to be a short term purchase as thought may be just same as FK8 but I’m really enjoying the car, feels quick enough for me.

For any owners or prospective owners thinking of using the tunnel make sure you tell them in advance to allocate as a large car so you go on the single deck, it is tight on the duel deck, requested to be moved on return journey.



I'll continue to update as and when I think worthwhile, for now, all my personal time is focused on heading into Italy in July.

[Mezzanine]

Look forward to your updates, it looks great in the blue.

Well done for calling out the dealership BS too, nice to see HUK sorted you out.

[Bright Halo]

Looks great in blue.
Why is it that when a car is in high demand the dealers turn into arses?
Keep the updates coming and thanks for sharing!

[lel]

What a beauty, I'm a firm believer that a Type R has to be CW but that's a stunning colour.

I have the window rattle on my FN2 also, nice to see they haven't found a fix in the last 15 years

[TameRacingDriver]

Refreshingly honest post and nice car

[craig-A]

Great write up.

I'm 1300 miles in to mine, I've just returned from a weekend in Aviemore and came back via Aberfeldy Crieff then Glen Devon where it was awesome.
The front end grip and turn in is amazing, how they get all that power through the front wheels and still have amazing turn in defies physics.
I traded in GRY to this so the comparison has been interesting.

I have the same irritating buzz from the dash as you which is interesting, I'll see what the dealer says about it.

I had a decent experience with the dealer, in fact the car arrived 4 weeks early which was a bit of a ball ache tbh, but I shouldn't complain.

Interestingly in the recent best hot hatch of the last 20 years poll I voted for the Clio Trophy, I car I owned in the past, over the GRY as I felt it was more of a hot hatch than the GRY. Having owned and driven the honda since March, I'd still vote for the Clio.
The Honda cannot be described as a hot hatch, too big and too expensive and probably the best car I've ever driven.

C.

[jwwbowe]

Fantastic, what a family wagon, if I could I would though for me it would have to be championship white. Well done on calling out the stealer, I’m not surprised in this day there are hardly any dealers anymore that have a long term association with one manufacturer, most are franchisees that sell every brand of car at various sites which is where IMO you get the worst in sales and aftercare. As said previously well done Honda UK in response. My local Honda dealer looked after my S2000 years ago and was very good as an independent but went sharply downhill after it was bought out by a large franchise with a similar first name to that of the man that invented the Model T

The FL5 seems to rightfully be getting all the credit but it should as it is ruddy expensive whichever way you cut it. Can’t see it depreciating a lot though so I guess you can put man maths in to full effect

On paper it is very comparable to a JDM Hawkeye STI minus the rear driveshafts and that is no bad thing IMO. Must get myself a go in one soon to find out if that translates to the road, have you had a go in both?

Hang onto it I say and enjoy it as long as you can, we’ll sorely miss these when Honda chuck batteries in a CTR and tell us VTEC stands for Voltage Transform Electrical Capacitor or something s***e like that.

Edited by jwwbowe on Monday 8th May 18:25

Edited by jwwbowe on Monday 8th May 18:27

[VTECMatt]

So bit of a small update, put a few more miles on the back roads that I know well, still very impressed how well it handles rough roads, but feel roads I drove happily in Sport in the FK8 now require the Comfort setting in the FL5. Fortunately the individual mode you can tweak everything so you can have R+ for pretty much everything else and comfort suspension.

I’ve yet to drive without the traction control off, I did most of the time with the FK8 but feel that the car rotates so well as is, so make reserve this for a trackday.

The other thing I notice is I feel it could do with some more power, it puts it down so well. I always said I’d never consider upping it and 5 years in the FK8 I always felt was enough so another tweak by Honda with the FL5.

Swapped the red mats with black ones from my old car as they get dirty so quickly.

[Mezzanine]

Looks great, Matt

[Mike1990]

Really refreshing write up on your experiences. The car though! What a machine, just utterly spectacular in every way.

[d_a_n1979]

Superb car & thread

Fantastic colour too

[JAMSXR]

Good write up, I agree with all the negative and positive experiences that you’ve had.

The speakers really get me, they’re awful and need sorting. Not something I’ve done before so interested to hear about any well reviewed specialists who could sort it out.

[TameRacingDriver]

I'd expect a 50 grand car to at least have decent speakers

[JAMSXR]

TameRacingDriver said:

I'd expect a 50 grand car to at least have decent speakers

Agreed but there’s a long list of 50k cars with crap speakers. My C63 was pretty awful. The type R more than makes up for it in plenty of other areas, just frustrating the US got Bose and we got the alcantara steering wheel and rear seats instead…

[Speed Badger]

The blue colour is really eye-catching, it made me chuckle in your original post about it being easy to clean, I always fall asleep before I finish cleaning my FK8!

The looks are slowly growing on me, still miss the madness of the FK8 design.

[VTECMatt]

So I’m happy to share the positive parts of this ownership and unfortunately the negatives.

The pedestrian safety system is extremely sensitive as I found out after an incident this weekend and I have to go through insurance to get fixed, being quoted 3 months to get full fix. Apparently needs 3 replacement sensors, behind the bumper, the bonnet brackets, as they fold 90 degrees so have to be replaced too, as this is a painted item adds to the cost and then what ever I need to do to get the rods back down, realignment of bonnet then reset the system.

There is zero damage to the bodywork or paint, it really was just a tap, it is ridiculous such a small thing has to involve an insurance claim, the cost will no doubt be substantial even after me declining the hire car.

In my old FK8 hit a pheasant, pigeon all much harder than the lamb I gently nudged, it was fine btw thankfully. Never set it off, guess very lucky as has a similar system.

With the bonnet up like this the whoosh noise from the turbo sounds so nice!

[Dblue]

Great to see an owners detailed opinions on the FL5 who has previously had the FK8.
Seem to be lots of new to the brand comments in the FL5 availability thread but not so many who know the FK8 well.
And whilst I love the look and feel of the new car I'm still umming and ahhing about the near £20k cost of changing.

Your comments about the changes/improvements are very interesting. I had 50k in a 2017 Type R over 3 years- Longest I've ever owned a car for, just couldn't think of anything better to replace it with. Ultimately was tempted to trade it for a used C63S and it lasted 6 months before I realised the Honda was just a much better thing to drive and bought a facelift FK8.
Compared to the 2017 car I found the steering (and wheel), gearchange, infotainment screen , suspension composure and braking all better than the earlier car. And even better now its done 15k more miles. So given that the FK8 FL was improved over the first Type R just how much better is the FL5??

Seems to me the cabin materials and design ,new screen and selectable driver modes are clear improvements - but everything else a bit marginal for £20k
Personally I rather like the ricer looks and stance of the FK8 and find the new car a little less characterful - and I cant get it in polished metal which is a great colour.

Need to drive one I reckon