How to get married safely to a foreign national
Discussion
I have a good friend, and it seems to me they are on the verge of making a very bad decision, and I would like some advice for them.
They have met online a Pakistani girl who lives in Saudi Arabia currently .
He is 45, with 2 kids from a previous partner. Was not married to last partner. I estimate he has around 500K in assets. ( house, pension, stocks etc )
She is 40, never married. Currently lives with family. Very little in the way of assets.
They have been talking about 4 months, and he is quite smitten with her. Apparently, she is very traditional and religious ( Muslim, the same as him ) , and really wants the traditional wife experience, which is something he doesn't think he can find in the UK. She works in healthcare, and could transfer jobs to the UK without too many issues.
Neither want any /more children.
Now, to my eyes, this looks like a classic asset grab/greencard , and she will move to the UK, and after a year divorce and go after him for everything she can.
However, I have to confess my knowledge of international law is lacking. Would it really be this simple for her to ruin his life ?
She has stated her requirement to be married is purely to satisfy her religion and family, and would be happy with a religious ceremony in Saudi. However my understanding is that a foreign marriage is recognized by UK courts, and if they did this they would be legally be married under UK law.
I also understand that any pre-nuptial agreement would not be honored by a UK court.
Is there a safe way for him to do this ?
They have met online a Pakistani girl who lives in Saudi Arabia currently .
He is 45, with 2 kids from a previous partner. Was not married to last partner. I estimate he has around 500K in assets. ( house, pension, stocks etc )
She is 40, never married. Currently lives with family. Very little in the way of assets.
They have been talking about 4 months, and he is quite smitten with her. Apparently, she is very traditional and religious ( Muslim, the same as him ) , and really wants the traditional wife experience, which is something he doesn't think he can find in the UK. She works in healthcare, and could transfer jobs to the UK without too many issues.
Neither want any /more children.
Now, to my eyes, this looks like a classic asset grab/greencard , and she will move to the UK, and after a year divorce and go after him for everything she can.
However, I have to confess my knowledge of international law is lacking. Would it really be this simple for her to ruin his life ?
She has stated her requirement to be married is purely to satisfy her religion and family, and would be happy with a religious ceremony in Saudi. However my understanding is that a foreign marriage is recognized by UK courts, and if they did this they would be legally be married under UK law.
I also understand that any pre-nuptial agreement would not be honored by a UK court.
Is there a safe way for him to do this ?
This is one relationship thread that I have little experience on. Can your friend do a trial? As in not marry her first and see if she's who she says she is? I mean it's not like he's into dating every night from the sounds of things. And also suggest to him it's a lot easier to get a local girl so he can move on quickly if things don't work out vs marrying someone and hoping for the best.
ExPat2B said:
my understanding is that a foreign marriage is recognized by UK courts, and if they did this they would be legally be married under UK law.
Correct.Presumably the idea is that she will come and live in UK so UK law will govern the marriage once she's living here.
What this guy needs is a a pre-nuptial agreement properly drawn up by solicitors. Both parties (him and her) will need separate advice from separate UK solicitors who provide a certificate to say full disclosure of all assets has been given and proper legal advice obtained. Assuming the couple don't have any more children (including adopted children) the agreement should stand up fine if the relationship comes apart. Needs to be done properly or it's not worth doing at all.
Of course, if she finds this unacceptable....
GilletteFan said:
This is one relationship thread that I have little experience on. Can your friend do a trial? As in not marry her first and see if she's who she says she is? I mean it's not like he's into dating every night from the sounds of things. And also suggest to him it's a lot easier to get a local girl so he can move on quickly if things don't work out vs marrying someone and hoping for the best.
I think they are planning on meeting in Saudi. From what I understand, her requirements are around 4-5 dates and then marriage. No physical contact beyond hug/hand holding allowed beforehand. I have made the local girl argument, he is not unsuccessful at dating UK girls, but has had some bad experiences, in particular his last ex was a real piece of work. I think this whole idea stems from frustration his idea that UK girls are very westernised and entitled. He wants someone who wants a long term relationship, who would be happy being at home, working part time and cooking food for him and managing the household, and he thinks, with some justification, that UK girls avoid that lifestyle, whereas for a traditional girl, it is literally her dream.
I think there are several flaws with this plan,, and probably some idealisation of each other that is occuring, as over distance you can't see each others day to day issues, that make the chances of this actually being a successful marriage quite low......I have given my opinion but I don't think he is listening.
This post is mainly around the legal/financial side of things - is he as screwed as I think he would be, with a Saudi religious ceremony being legal and a 50/50 split of assets/ monthly payment to "lifestyle to which she is accustomed" if it went south after a year ?
ExPat2B said:
is he as screwed as I think he would be?
If it all goes off the rails and ends up in court the factors in account would be,The income, earning capacity, property and other financial resources which each of the parties to the marriage has or is likely to have;
The financial needs, obligations and responsibilities which each of the parties to the marriage has or is likely to have in the foreseeable future;
The standard of living enjoyed by the family before the breakdown of the marriage;
The age of each party to the marriage and the duration of the marriage;
The contributions made by each of the parties to the welfare of the family, including any contribution made by looking after the home;
The value to either of the parties to the marriage of any benefit (for example, a pension) which that party will lose the chance of acquiring.
How long's a piece of string?
It's not worth the risk. See my earlier post. This bloke is leaving himself wide open if he goes in without a proper pre-nup agreement.
GreatGranny said:
He's a big boy.
You've warned him of the possible downsides, he's still wants to go ahead.
Just let him get on with it.
This. You can only go so far.You've warned him of the possible downsides, he's still wants to go ahead.
Just let him get on with it.
However you can also recommend he speak to someone at the sharia council or a sharia lawyer.
As previous, if he had a sharia marriage in uk it wouldn’t be recognized under uk law, but if it’s done in Saudi it would be.
Not sure on divorce rights or legality of any prenup. By pure sharia she/ her family should be paying him a dowry, so beat to check. Plenty of uk/sharia law firms about.
Alternative would be for him to move to Saudi, that way he holds all the cards.
Not all foreign marriages are recognised in the UK
Certainly European ones are but we were told, for example, that if we wanted to marry in the Maldives we would have to have a legally binding ceremony in the UK in addition. Not sure about Saudi.
For a short marriage with no children, the courts would likely put both parties back in the position they were before the marriage took place.
However, this is a risk (as with everything legal) If she's going for a UK passport, it's likely that is the primary focus, rather than trying to take him for half of everything.
IANAL.
Certainly European ones are but we were told, for example, that if we wanted to marry in the Maldives we would have to have a legally binding ceremony in the UK in addition. Not sure about Saudi.
For a short marriage with no children, the courts would likely put both parties back in the position they were before the marriage took place.
However, this is a risk (as with everything legal) If she's going for a UK passport, it's likely that is the primary focus, rather than trying to take him for half of everything.
IANAL.
Muzzer79 said:
Not all foreign marriages are recognised in the UK
we were told, for example, that if we wanted to marry in the Maldives we would have to have a legally binding ceremony in the UK in addition.
UK marriage law is governed by Lex Loci - which means the laws of the country where the marriage happens. All lawful foreign marriages are, in theory, recognised. we were told, for example, that if we wanted to marry in the Maldives we would have to have a legally binding ceremony in the UK in addition.
The only point to bear in mind is that if it's a country that doesn't bother with marriage certificates or issues them in a foreign language there might be difficulties proving the existence of that marriage. An official translation accompanying a foreign language certificate can be used to bridge that gap.
t ! To each his own i suppose. No doubt plenty more desperados will give her a go if he doesn't.Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff