Clear something up?

[LHRFlightman]

Sitting here with my daughter totally perplexed.

Brundle always states "you're ahead and have the corner of you're front axle is level or ahead of the other car".

Max's clearly wasn't as his front wheel hit the side pod of Georges car.

So why wasn't Max given the penalty? Where was George supposed to go.

[HTP99]

To me, it looked like George turned in on him, regardless of the placement of the overtaker, you don't just turn in on them, hitting them.

Happy to be proved wrong though, just how it looked to me.

[Brainpox]

You can’t turn in on someone. Those drivers who are renowned for diving down the inside simply take advantage of this. George could have avoided an accident by opening up the corner.

[jazzybees]

George Russel, just admitting it was his fault.
He didn’t see Max. and turned, and made contact.

[spikyone]

LHRFlightman said:

Sitting here with my daughter totally perplexed.

Brundle always states "you're ahead and have the corner of you're front axle is level or ahead of the other car".

Max's clearly wasn't as his front wheel hit the side pod of Georges car.

So why wasn't Max given the penalty? Where was George supposed to go.

The bit in bold. Verstappen's front axle was alongside Russell's car. (I think the rule might be front axle level with, or ahead of, the rear axle of the car being overtaken. Don't quote me on that, as I may well be mistaken)

I don't necessarily agree with the rule generally as there are times that someone will poke their nose in and it'll be their corner to essentially do as they please, and Max has - in the past - thrown it down the inside with no prospect of both drivers making the corner.
In this case, even if the rule weren't written like that, it was a clean and fair move from Max and he had plenty of his car alongside. It was clearly George's fault for just turning in. At the point they made contact George had plenty of space on the outside.

[Hungrymc]

spikyone said:

Max has - in the past - thrown it down the inside with no prospect of both drivers making the corner.

In the past…. You have to go as far back as turn 1, lap 1 yesterday :-)

[Hungrymc]

LHRFlightman said:

Sitting here with my daughter totally perplexed.

Brundle always states "you're ahead and have the corner of you're front axle is level or ahead of the other car".

Max's clearly wasn't as his front wheel hit the side pod of Georges car.

So why wasn't Max given the penalty? Where was George supposed to go.

The rule is more complex than that, but getting a car predominantly alongside is a key part of winning the right to racing room.

Another other element is about being on a reasonable line (getting close to the apex if on the inside for example). And traveling at a speed that allows them to negotiate the corner on track and without forcing the other car off track. Though these are complex, all interlinked, and not entirely black and white. it’s about how all these things come together.

Max was certainly far enough alongside to have won the right to be there with George, and he wasn’t out of control / running off track. Max was innocent in this one.
Lap 1, T1, Max missed the apex and ran himself and Charles off track. Charles avoided the accident… Max was the offender there.

[HustleRussell]

The wording of the regs will be something like "a significant portion of the car", i.e. Max has earned the right to a car's width because he was approximately more than halfway alongside.

As far as I can tell it's exactly as in club racing. You can't just stick a nose up the inside and expect your competitor not to turn in on you.

In an F1 car you've got more than two meters of car behind you. The driver being overtaken can't see the overtaking car in their peripheral vision until roughly when the front axle is ahead of the driver's eyeline. The mirrors are rubbish, and with the amount of artificial light at a night race its probably very hard to see what's behind in a glimpse.

Edited by HustleRussell on Monday 20th November 12:03

[GlobalRacer]

The guideline states that the front tyres of the inside car have to be alongside the other car by no later than the apex. So if the front tyres are alongside the rear wheels at a minimum then it's your corner. Max was far more alongside than that.

No idea why Brundle thinks the front axle has to be level or ahead of the whole car. I don't know any circuit motorsport that follows a rule like that. A lot of racing is any overlap at all and the corner belongs to the inside car. Some tin top series you have to be up to the B pillar.