Discussion
moleamol said:Because people are scared of the unknown?
Why are we all still here when we get screwed at every turn? And I mean this as a serious question. Why are we all staying here? Why not just go somewhere more pleasant?
Often people say that work/children are holding them back but I tend to think that’s a side issue, most of the places British people move to have perfectly adequate health and education systems. I would suggest that most PHers could adapt to almost any business environment no matter what industry they are in.
At the end of the day you can probably think of endless reasons why you should stay in Britain and a lot of people are quite satisfied with that.
I got bumped from pillar to post with my family chasing work through my childhood. I would not put my stepdaughter through the same. As soon as she is independant, we are outta here.
I may have been born free, but I have no intention of being taxed to death.
Phil
edit to add: that sounds like we were pikeys, we weren't
>> Edited by philthy on Tuesday 6th September 01:26
I may have been born free, but I have no intention of being taxed to death.
Phil
edit to add: that sounds like we were pikeys, we weren't
>> Edited by philthy on Tuesday 6th September 01:26
philthy said:
I got bumped from pillar to post with my family chasing work through my childhood. I would not put my stepdaughter through the same. As soon as she is independant, we are outta here.
I may have been born free, but I have no intention of being taxed to death.
Phil
edit to add: that sounds like we were pikeys, we weren't
"B-o-r-n f-r-e-e, 'till s-o-m-e-b-o-d-y t-a-x-e-d m-e!"..............
I've spent 11 years of my life living in other people's countries, being continually told that it isn't my country and that I have no right to complain about things, and if I don't like it I should go home. This despite always making an effort to learn the language(s) and integrate with the locals. Integration isn't easy, whoever you are and wherever you go. This isn't racism, this isn't the mythical "social exclusion", this is human nature. The UK is the only country I have ever been to where "social inclusion" is demanded of the host people and human nature treated as contemptible. And the English are the most tolerant and accommodating nation on earth.
Living abroad means disenfranchisement. So, you go home and discover a regime that apparently puts the rights and opinions of minorities above those of the indigenous people.
I'm a proud Englishman. That doesn't make me a racist or a bigot. I'm proud of the natural beauty, culture, achievements and social values of my own country. I'm proud of our tolerance and I'm proud that so many people from all over the world yearn to experience it for themselves. I have a strong sense of that mythical fair play thing and in general, I do think diversity is positive, and I certainly want Britain to be enriched by immigrants of all shades based on a pure meritocracy. I would never discriminate against any person based on the colour of their skin or the religion they choose to follow, but I wouldn't hesitate to cricise any person who is a destructive influence on my country, regardless of who they are or where they come from.
However, I also want to be able to live in my own country, feel that my own way of life isn't subjugated and that my own culture, origins and sense of pride are treated with respect. I won't ever run away again, but I won't rest until we have a Government that finally allows me to have the pride in my identity and basic liberty that I deserve as much as any other citizen of planet earth. In particular, I won't rest until political correctness is something people laugh about in history books.
Don't run away - life isn't perfect in any country (although the weather may be better). There is one country in the world where your opinion can make a difference. Run away now and one day you will have no home to return to. Fight for the values you believe in.
Vote Conservative...
Living abroad means disenfranchisement. So, you go home and discover a regime that apparently puts the rights and opinions of minorities above those of the indigenous people.
I'm a proud Englishman. That doesn't make me a racist or a bigot. I'm proud of the natural beauty, culture, achievements and social values of my own country. I'm proud of our tolerance and I'm proud that so many people from all over the world yearn to experience it for themselves. I have a strong sense of that mythical fair play thing and in general, I do think diversity is positive, and I certainly want Britain to be enriched by immigrants of all shades based on a pure meritocracy. I would never discriminate against any person based on the colour of their skin or the religion they choose to follow, but I wouldn't hesitate to cricise any person who is a destructive influence on my country, regardless of who they are or where they come from.
However, I also want to be able to live in my own country, feel that my own way of life isn't subjugated and that my own culture, origins and sense of pride are treated with respect. I won't ever run away again, but I won't rest until we have a Government that finally allows me to have the pride in my identity and basic liberty that I deserve as much as any other citizen of planet earth. In particular, I won't rest until political correctness is something people laugh about in history books.
Don't run away - life isn't perfect in any country (although the weather may be better). There is one country in the world where your opinion can make a difference. Run away now and one day you will have no home to return to. Fight for the values you believe in.
Vote Conservative...
Mon Ami Mate said:
I've spent 11 years of my life living in other people's countries, being continually told that it isn't my country and that I have no right to complain about things, and if I don't like it I should go home. This despite always making an effort to learn the language(s) and integrate with the locals. Integration isn't easy, whoever you are and wherever you go. This isn't racism, this isn't the mythical "social exclusion", this is human nature. The UK is the only country I have ever been to where "social inclusion" is demanded of the host people and human nature treated as contemptible. And the English are the most tolerant and accommodating nation on earth.
Living abroad means disenfranchisement. So, you go home and discover a regime that apparently puts the rights and opinions of minorities above those of the indigenous people.
I'm a proud Englishman. That doesn't make me a racist or a bigot. I'm proud of the natural beauty, culture, achievements and social values of my own country. I'm proud of our tolerance and I'm proud that so many people from all over the world yearn to experience it for themselves. I have a strong sense of that mythical fair play thing and in general, I do think diversity is positive, and I certainly want Britain to be enriched by immigrants of all shades based on a pure meritocracy. I would never discriminate against any person based on the colour of their skin or the religion they choose to follow, but I wouldn't hesitate to cricise any person who is a destructive influence on my country, regardless of who they are or where they come from.
However, I also want to be able to live in my own country, feel that my own way of life isn't subjugated and that my own culture, origins and sense of pride are treated with respect. I won't ever run away again, but I won't rest until we have a Government that finally allows me to have the pride in my identity and basic liberty that I deserve as much as any other citizen of planet earth. In particular, I won't rest until political correctness is something people laugh about in history books.
Don't run away - life isn't perfect in any country (although the weather may be better). There is one country in the world where your opinion can make a difference. Run away now and one day you will have no home to return to. Fight for the values you believe in.
Vote Conservative...
Here here - I couldn't have said it better myself.
I often wonder, when reading some posts on subjects like this, how many of the moaners actually bothered to vote or voted for the current lot ?
Eric Mc said:
Also, those who express interest in emmigration often express their distrut of immigrants - not realing the irony of the fact that they would become immigrants in someone else's country.
I've pointed this out on here in the past but strangely it goes over some people's heads...
... each to their own though 
)Mon Ami Mate said:
I've spent 11 years of my life living in other people's countries, being continually told that it isn't my country and that I have no right to complain about things, and if I don't like it I should go home. This despite always making an effort to learn the language(s) and integrate with the locals. Integration isn't easy, whoever you are and wherever you go. This isn't racism, this isn't the mythical "social exclusion", this is human nature. The UK is the only country I have ever been to where "social inclusion" is demanded of the host people and human nature treated as contemptible. And the English are the most tolerant and accommodating nation on earth.
Living abroad means disenfranchisement. So, you go home and discover a regime that apparently puts the rights and opinions of minorities above those of the indigenous people.
I'm a proud Englishman. That doesn't make me a racist or a bigot. I'm proud of the natural beauty, culture, achievements and social values of my own country. I'm proud of our tolerance and I'm proud that so many people from all over the world yearn to experience it for themselves. I have a strong sense of that mythical fair play thing and in general, I do think diversity is positive, and I certainly want Britain to be enriched by immigrants of all shades based on a pure meritocracy. I would never discriminate against any person based on the colour of their skin or the religion they choose to follow, but I wouldn't hesitate to cricise any person who is a destructive influence on my country, regardless of who they are or where they come from.
However, I also want to be able to live in my own country, feel that my own way of life isn't subjugated and that my own culture, origins and sense of pride are treated with respect. I won't ever run away again, but I won't rest until we have a Government that finally allows me to have the pride in my identity and basic liberty that I deserve as much as any other citizen of planet earth. In particular, I won't rest until political correctness is something people laugh about in history books.
Don't run away - life isn't perfect in any country (although the weather may be better). There is one country in the world where your opinion can make a difference. Run away now and one day you will have no home to return to. Fight for the values you believe in.
Vote Conservative...
Well Said
I'll probably live abroad for a few years. Not because I dislike blighty but because its an experience I'd like to have.
How many middle aged people whine about how shite everything in their life and yet have done nothing to change it since they left school?
At least if you do spend a few years abroad you can come back and whinge about bloody foriegners with a modicum of authority
Bloody foriegners...... they all speak English behind your back..... 
How many middle aged people whine about how shite everything in their life and yet have done nothing to change it since they left school?
At least if you do spend a few years abroad you can come back and whinge about bloody foriegners with a modicum of authority
Bloody foriegners...... they all speak English behind your back..... I'm off to New Zealand in less than two weeks.
For lots of reasons but mainly because we think we'll have a better quality of life there, with a different emphasis - more active, outdoor lifestyle.
We find the UK (at least where we live) crowded, dirty, high crime, to far to commute to work etc. We could move localy, or move somewhere else in the UK but finding somewhere with jobs for both of us that wouldnt mean slaving away for a massive mortgage is next to impossible, even then we have mad traffic, chavs, 'new labour' et al to put up with.
So were 'brave' enough to emmigrate, give a new land a try, I know from stats that 50% come back within a few years, if we do we wont have lost much and gained an awful lot.
Biggest issue is being so far from friends and family, we'll do our best to make new friends, family will have to visit (not that some have bothered visiting us in the UK...).
Its alot of work, effort and expense to do what were doing, but not masses more than moving areas in the UK and finding 2 new jobs.
And no, I dont mind immigrants in the UK, one issue I have with the area I live in is its lack of diversity and racism in general.
For lots of reasons but mainly because we think we'll have a better quality of life there, with a different emphasis - more active, outdoor lifestyle.
We find the UK (at least where we live) crowded, dirty, high crime, to far to commute to work etc. We could move localy, or move somewhere else in the UK but finding somewhere with jobs for both of us that wouldnt mean slaving away for a massive mortgage is next to impossible, even then we have mad traffic, chavs, 'new labour' et al to put up with.
So were 'brave' enough to emmigrate, give a new land a try, I know from stats that 50% come back within a few years, if we do we wont have lost much and gained an awful lot.
Biggest issue is being so far from friends and family, we'll do our best to make new friends, family will have to visit (not that some have bothered visiting us in the UK...).
Its alot of work, effort and expense to do what were doing, but not masses more than moving areas in the UK and finding 2 new jobs.
And no, I dont mind immigrants in the UK, one issue I have with the area I live in is its lack of diversity and racism in general.
speedy_thrills said:
A lot of countries tax their citizens more than the UK
Sources please! (Mainly for personal interest).
I want to see % of income paid in tax.
www.taxpolicycenter.org/TaxFacts/TFDB/TFTemplate.cfm?Docid=104&Topic2id=95 is a little out of date - 2000 - but I suspect still largely relevant.
The only country with a top rate of tax lower than here is New Zealand at 39%, and much of Europe has a top rate of 60% or more.
Retained pay for the average UK worker with 2 kids is pretty standard at 78.8% (EU average is 79.3%). Denmark is the worst at 62.2%, but if you really want to avoid any tax then Mexico is the place to go at a whopping 97% retained pay!
So there you have it - things really aren't that bad here, tax-wise. Yes it could be better, but it could be a whole lot worse. What's interesting - although pretty damn obvious if you think about it - is that countries that are considered 'good' places to live wrt standard of living are generally those with high taxes. The worst for retained income are Denmark, Finland, Sweden and Holland which all regularly top the polls as places to live.
deckster - that data only takes into account income tax, and the highest bracket too, its well screwey.
NZ as you said comes out on top there - thats not the whole picture.
In the UK I have never paid top rate income tax, I will in NZ. In NZ you get taxed on every penny you earn, no tax exempt earnings.
It doesnt mention UK NI contributions which hit both employee and employer, or VAT, fuel tax, stamp duty et al, this new labour government has been raising stealth taxes for 8 years just so charts like that will show them in a good light. The UK Tax burden is the highest its been in a long time.
NZ as you said comes out on top there - thats not the whole picture.
In the UK I have never paid top rate income tax, I will in NZ. In NZ you get taxed on every penny you earn, no tax exempt earnings.
It doesnt mention UK NI contributions which hit both employee and employer, or VAT, fuel tax, stamp duty et al, this new labour government has been raising stealth taxes for 8 years just so charts like that will show them in a good light. The UK Tax burden is the highest its been in a long time.
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