Appealing Sherriff Court Decision
Discussion
Earlier in the summer I was the victim of an accident. A youth came round a blind bend completely on my side of the road and hit me head on which destroyed my car and I was blue lighted to hospital suffering from 4 broken ribs,punctured lung ,whiplash and severe bruising from trapped legs. Knees are
still painfull.
Police charged driver with dangerous driving and I was happy with that. The accused appeared in court in October where he pleaded not guilty and we were to go to trial in January. I recieved a letter from Procurator fiscal on Friday which said he had pleaded guilty. I phoned the procurator fiscal today only to be told he had pleaded guilty to a lesser charge. He has been given a small fine and 12 month ban.
To say I am disgusted is putting it mildly. He came round a blind bend at 80mph and could easily have killed me if I had not been tight to my side of the road. I spoke to the policeman who was first on scene mid summer and he warned me that charges are often downgraded but that should definently not happen in this case!
I believe I have 4 weeks to appeal the sentence on a point of law but wanted to know if I am just wasting my time? What point of law would I appeal on.? Any advice gratefully recieved as I believe my 3 young kids came very close to celebrating Xmas without dad and I don't believe justice has been served and neither do the police!
still painfull.
Police charged driver with dangerous driving and I was happy with that. The accused appeared in court in October where he pleaded not guilty and we were to go to trial in January. I recieved a letter from Procurator fiscal on Friday which said he had pleaded guilty. I phoned the procurator fiscal today only to be told he had pleaded guilty to a lesser charge. He has been given a small fine and 12 month ban.
To say I am disgusted is putting it mildly. He came round a blind bend at 80mph and could easily have killed me if I had not been tight to my side of the road. I spoke to the policeman who was first on scene mid summer and he warned me that charges are often downgraded but that should definently not happen in this case!
I believe I have 4 weeks to appeal the sentence on a point of law but wanted to know if I am just wasting my time? What point of law would I appeal on.? Any advice gratefully recieved as I believe my 3 young kids came very close to celebrating Xmas without dad and I don't believe justice has been served and neither do the police!
In England, this would have been charged as causing serious injury by dangerous driving (rather than dangerous driving). Minimum 2 year ban. Maximum 5 years in prison with custody as the starting point.
I don’t know anything about Scottish law or procedure, so I can’t answer your question about an appeal.
I don’t know anything about Scottish law or procedure, so I can’t answer your question about an appeal.
I feel he has basically got off with the offence the way it is now. The police thought it was non negotiable dangerous driving. It makes me feel now like it is the old boys club,the lawyer gets a win with a lesser sentence,the prosecutor gets a conviction so it's a win but I and the police feel shafted!
alexmonkey said:
Perhaps contacting a solicitor who specialises in personal injury claims would be better? It sounds like, if circumstances are exactly as you describe, you should be in-line for a significant sum to cover your injuries and any lost productivity whilst recovering :-)
This all day long.stichill99 said:
Earlier in the summer I was the victim of an accident. A youth came round a blind bend completely on my side of the road and hit me head on which destroyed my car and I was blue lighted to hospital suffering from 4 broken ribs,punctured lung ,whiplash and severe bruising from trapped legs. Knees are
still painfull.
Police charged driver with dangerous driving and I was happy with that. The accused appeared in court in October where he pleaded not guilty and we were to go to trial in January. I recieved a letter from Procurator fiscal on Friday which said he had pleaded guilty. I phoned the procurator fiscal today only to be told he had pleaded guilty to a lesser charge. He has been given a small fine and 12 month ban.
To say I am disgusted is putting it mildly. He came round a blind bend at 80mph and could easily have killed me if I had not been tight to my side of the road. I spoke to the policeman who was first on scene mid summer and he warned me that charges are often downgraded but that should definently not happen in this case!
I believe I have 4 weeks to appeal the sentence on a point of law but wanted to know if I am just wasting my time? What point of law would I appeal on.? Any advice gratefully recieved as I believe my 3 young kids came very close to celebrating Xmas without dad and I don't believe justice has been served and neither do the police!
I don't think you will be able to appeal the sentence. Ultimately in Scotland the COPFS service have the final say on what offence is charged and whether or not to accept a plea to a lesser charge.still painfull.
Police charged driver with dangerous driving and I was happy with that. The accused appeared in court in October where he pleaded not guilty and we were to go to trial in January. I recieved a letter from Procurator fiscal on Friday which said he had pleaded guilty. I phoned the procurator fiscal today only to be told he had pleaded guilty to a lesser charge. He has been given a small fine and 12 month ban.
To say I am disgusted is putting it mildly. He came round a blind bend at 80mph and could easily have killed me if I had not been tight to my side of the road. I spoke to the policeman who was first on scene mid summer and he warned me that charges are often downgraded but that should definently not happen in this case!
I believe I have 4 weeks to appeal the sentence on a point of law but wanted to know if I am just wasting my time? What point of law would I appeal on.? Any advice gratefully recieved as I believe my 3 young kids came very close to celebrating Xmas without dad and I don't believe justice has been served and neither do the police!
As you sustained the injuries you did then I'm surprised the initial charge was dangerous driving as opposed to causing serious injury by dangerous driving.
It may be the case that despite what they were originally charged with the PF felt that there was insufficient evidence to support a charge for DD or CSIbDD and this is why they elected to accept a plea to a lesser charge.
If I was in your position I would get back in touch with the PF service and ask what the other driver was originally charged with, if it was dangerous driving and not causing serious injury by dangerous driving then ask for an explanation of why that was the case. I would also ask what the lesser charge was and why they opted to accept a plea rather than go to trial.
If you don't get an acceptable answer you can make a formal complaint.
Cat
I have had a reply from the procurator fiscal's office which said he was originally charged with causing serious injury by dangerous driving and that they plea bargained it down to causing serious injury by careless driving.
I find this quite unacceptable as deliberately taking a corner on the wrong side of road at 80mph is not careless but dangerous in the extreme! I suppose I will just have to accept it but it really grates as he had a history of maniacal driving and accidents! I suppose until he kills somebody they don't care!
I find this quite unacceptable as deliberately taking a corner on the wrong side of road at 80mph is not careless but dangerous in the extreme! I suppose I will just have to accept it but it really grates as he had a history of maniacal driving and accidents! I suppose until he kills somebody they don't care!
stichill99 said:
I have had a reply from the procurator fiscal's office which said he was originally charged with causing serious injury by dangerous driving and that they plea bargained it down to causing serious injury by careless driving.
I find this quite unacceptable as deliberately taking a corner on the wrong side of road at 80mph is not careless but dangerous in the extreme! I suppose I will just have to accept it but it really grates as he had a history of maniacal driving and accidents! I suppose until he kills somebody they don't care!
worth reading https://www.police.uk/advice/advice-and-informatio...I find this quite unacceptable as deliberately taking a corner on the wrong side of road at 80mph is not careless but dangerous in the extreme! I suppose I will just have to accept it but it really grates as he had a history of maniacal driving and accidents! I suppose until he kills somebody they don't care!
lets say the other driver drifted over to the wrong side of the road whilst sneezing - that's probably careless. If they were overtaking someone round a blind bend, thats probably dangerous. If the prosecutor didn't think they'd definitely get a conviction for dangerous (few witnesses, etc), then a sure-fire conviction for careless is probably a reasonable decision.
based on the charge, the sentancing is here
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magi...
based on which, if they only got a 1 year ban (and no community order), I'd agree it seems extremely linient. Culpability is B (unsafe positioning), I would guess your injuries are category 1 - so starting point should be High level community order – 1 year’s custody, reduced due to guilty plea.
Having worked in the justice system in England..
Unfortunately for you, 'that is life' - its just easier for them to accept a guilty plea to avoid a trial - I've seen it many times.
One reason perhaps is that the people who make these decisions are very detached from the original investigation - so rightly or wrongly they are not as invested.
Unfortunately for you, 'that is life' - its just easier for them to accept a guilty plea to avoid a trial - I've seen it many times.
One reason perhaps is that the people who make these decisions are very detached from the original investigation - so rightly or wrongly they are not as invested.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
Would 10 years inside make you feel better and make your recovery easier?
Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
Come on JBS, you can do better than that. The OP is quite rightly miffed about the sentence seeing as his car is written off and he suffered from extensive injuries. He wants a bit of help and advice, not to be berated. Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
5lab said:
worth reading https://www.police.uk/advice/advice-and-informatio...
lets say the other driver drifted over to the wrong side of the road whilst sneezing - that's probably careless. If they were overtaking someone round a blind bend, thats probably dangerous. If the prosecutor didn't think they'd definitely get a conviction for dangerous (few witnesses, etc), then a sure-fire conviction for careless is probably a reasonable decision.
based on the charge, the sentancing is here
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magi...
based on which, if they only got a 1 year ban (and no community order), I'd agree it seems extremely linient. Culpability is B (unsafe positioning), I would guess your injuries are category 1 - so starting point should be High level community order – 1 year’s custody, reduced due to guilty plea.
Those sentencing guidelines don't apply in Scotland. lets say the other driver drifted over to the wrong side of the road whilst sneezing - that's probably careless. If they were overtaking someone round a blind bend, thats probably dangerous. If the prosecutor didn't think they'd definitely get a conviction for dangerous (few witnesses, etc), then a sure-fire conviction for careless is probably a reasonable decision.
based on the charge, the sentancing is here
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magi...
based on which, if they only got a 1 year ban (and no community order), I'd agree it seems extremely linient. Culpability is B (unsafe positioning), I would guess your injuries are category 1 - so starting point should be High level community order – 1 year’s custody, reduced due to guilty plea.
Cat
pocketspring said:
Jordie Barretts sock said:
Would 10 years inside make you feel better and make your recovery easier?
Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
Come on JBS, you can do better than that. The OP is quite rightly miffed about the sentence seeing as his car is written off and he suffered from extensive injuries. He wants a bit of help and advice, not to be berated. Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
But telling the law what to do is never a good look.
Apologies.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
pocketspring said:
Jordie Barretts sock said:
Would 10 years inside make you feel better and make your recovery easier?
Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
Come on JBS, you can do better than that. The OP is quite rightly miffed about the sentence seeing as his car is written off and he suffered from extensive injuries. He wants a bit of help and advice, not to be berated. Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
But telling the law what to do is never a good look.
Apologies.
AIUI the entire CPS and courts system are so over-worked that any opportunity to reduce the collective workload is desperately welcome.
...and if that's a cheeky plea-bargain, in their eyes it's still better than pushing it to court as that case would only delay another, potentially-more deserving case. And the longer a case delays, the more risk of witnesses getting fed up, forgetting important details, etc. etc.
...and if that's a cheeky plea-bargain, in their eyes it's still better than pushing it to court as that case would only delay another, potentially-more deserving case. And the longer a case delays, the more risk of witnesses getting fed up, forgetting important details, etc. etc.
havoc said:
AIUI the entire CPS and courts system are so over-worked that any opportunity to reduce the collective workload is desperately welcome.
...and if that's a cheeky plea-bargain, in their eyes it's still better than pushing it to court as that case would only delay another, potentially-more deserving case. And the longer a case delays, the more risk of witnesses getting fed up, forgetting important details, etc. etc.
Does CPS operate in Scotland? ...and if that's a cheeky plea-bargain, in their eyes it's still better than pushing it to court as that case would only delay another, potentially-more deserving case. And the longer a case delays, the more risk of witnesses getting fed up, forgetting important details, etc. etc.
5lab said:
worth reading https://www.police.uk/advice/advice-and-informatio...
lets say the other driver drifted over to the wrong side of the road whilst sneezing - that's probably careless. If they were overtaking someone round a blind bend, thats probably dangerous. If the prosecutor didn't think they'd definitely get a conviction for dangerous (few witnesses, etc), then a sure-fire conviction for careless is probably a reasonable decision.
based on the charge, the sentencing is here
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magi...
based on which, if they only got a 1 year ban (and no community order), I'd agree it seems extremely lenient. Culpability is B (unsafe positioning), I would guess your injuries are category 1 - so starting point should be High level community order – 1 year’s custody, reduced due to guilty plea.
Scotland isn’t England. That guideline is not applicable there.lets say the other driver drifted over to the wrong side of the road whilst sneezing - that's probably careless. If they were overtaking someone round a blind bend, thats probably dangerous. If the prosecutor didn't think they'd definitely get a conviction for dangerous (few witnesses, etc), then a sure-fire conviction for careless is probably a reasonable decision.
based on the charge, the sentencing is here
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magi...
based on which, if they only got a 1 year ban (and no community order), I'd agree it seems extremely lenient. Culpability is B (unsafe positioning), I would guess your injuries are category 1 - so starting point should be High level community order – 1 year’s custody, reduced due to guilty plea.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
Would 10 years inside make you feel better and make your recovery easier?
Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
No it would not but I would have liked to see him banned for much longer than a year.Ultimately, if you need financial damages to aid your recovery, that is what you should be persuing. You are not the law.
When you are shown his social media of him out on the p*ss celebrating his 'victory' he is laughing at the LAW as it is
Worth contemplating how you might feel had they tried to push for the DD charge, and failed to prove it cleared that bar, with the guy being found not guilty…
As you’ve described it an argument could be made for it being prosecuted as CD, as they did, instead of DD, for the simple reason that it wasn’t (or at least it couldn’t be proven) a catalogue of bad driving, “just” a singular poor manoeuvre.
Logically the guy was probably driving like a knob for several minutes before hitting you, but if they can’t prove that then his defence can easily frame it all as an isolated poor decision, “a moment of madness”.
I’d also argue that a 12 month ban is not trivial, looked at objectively.
I can fully sympathise with how you’re feeling about it and what you’ve gone through, but there’s no real point in hypothesising about “what ifs” and feeling that punishment should be based upon that. It isn’t, it’s based on what happened with aggravating and mitigating factors considered. Otherwise someone getting caught doing 40 in a 20 could be done for DD on the basis that they might have hit and killed a child had they been there at the time.
As you’ve described it an argument could be made for it being prosecuted as CD, as they did, instead of DD, for the simple reason that it wasn’t (or at least it couldn’t be proven) a catalogue of bad driving, “just” a singular poor manoeuvre.
Logically the guy was probably driving like a knob for several minutes before hitting you, but if they can’t prove that then his defence can easily frame it all as an isolated poor decision, “a moment of madness”.
I’d also argue that a 12 month ban is not trivial, looked at objectively.
I can fully sympathise with how you’re feeling about it and what you’ve gone through, but there’s no real point in hypothesising about “what ifs” and feeling that punishment should be based upon that. It isn’t, it’s based on what happened with aggravating and mitigating factors considered. Otherwise someone getting caught doing 40 in a 20 could be done for DD on the basis that they might have hit and killed a child had they been there at the time.
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