Engagement ring
Discussion
Hi All,
I thought watches might be better than the Lounge. I’d seen some older posts and think that’s helped me have an idea.
I proposed last year with a placeholder ring as didn’t trust myself to get it right, turns out I wasn’t too far off of the mark.
It’s been three months now and I thought I better sort the engagement ring. I’d always said this was a placeholder and there has not been any pressure but if we’re getting married later this year I’d like to have the engagement ring sorted.
I did try contacting a certain factory place and they didn’t confirm my appointment until 50mins before and a week after I made the appointment and by then it was too late for me to get there in time. Although with it being a visit with my fiancé this time I’m tempted to give them another go if they’re highly recommended and I’ve just put my nose out of joint. I’ve not tried looking past this due to life challenges and she’s been really patient and understanding so I’d like to get this sorted.
So far my research has got me as far as:
Manufactured more value for money and the other associated reasons help here.
I had thought platinum as more hard wearing but my fiancé has expressed an interest for yellow gold (not white gold, as understand that wears). See how taste changes as a few years ago she wouldn’t wear her yellow gold jewellery.
Look for a more claw like setting and not tall to prevent it getting caught on clothes
Princess cut is more traditional
Half carat is a good base?
Clarity is more important such as VVS1/VVS2?
Colour a ‘G’ or up?
I’ve seen Eric mentioned and is it Nightmare? So might be worth giving them a shout?
I’ve no idea of budget but also don’t want something ridiculous that can’t be worn out and on the other end of the scale it’ll be nice to have something that’s a trade off with value, quality and presentation. The placeholder is a sub £100 ring and she loves it.
Thanks in advance.
I thought watches might be better than the Lounge. I’d seen some older posts and think that’s helped me have an idea.
I proposed last year with a placeholder ring as didn’t trust myself to get it right, turns out I wasn’t too far off of the mark.
It’s been three months now and I thought I better sort the engagement ring. I’d always said this was a placeholder and there has not been any pressure but if we’re getting married later this year I’d like to have the engagement ring sorted.
I did try contacting a certain factory place and they didn’t confirm my appointment until 50mins before and a week after I made the appointment and by then it was too late for me to get there in time. Although with it being a visit with my fiancé this time I’m tempted to give them another go if they’re highly recommended and I’ve just put my nose out of joint. I’ve not tried looking past this due to life challenges and she’s been really patient and understanding so I’d like to get this sorted.
So far my research has got me as far as:
Manufactured more value for money and the other associated reasons help here.
I had thought platinum as more hard wearing but my fiancé has expressed an interest for yellow gold (not white gold, as understand that wears). See how taste changes as a few years ago she wouldn’t wear her yellow gold jewellery.
Look for a more claw like setting and not tall to prevent it getting caught on clothes
Princess cut is more traditional
Half carat is a good base?
Clarity is more important such as VVS1/VVS2?
Colour a ‘G’ or up?
I’ve seen Eric mentioned and is it Nightmare? So might be worth giving them a shout?
I’ve no idea of budget but also don’t want something ridiculous that can’t be worn out and on the other end of the scale it’ll be nice to have something that’s a trade off with value, quality and presentation. The placeholder is a sub £100 ring and she loves it.
Thanks in advance.
My wife is super picky so I just took her with me and she chose her own, if it was left to me on my own it would have been wrong.
For what it's worth she went with white gold with an oval cut diamond. She has worn it for about 15 years now and it still looks like new. Be careful with the oval cut diamonds as you will need to get a wedding ring with a curve in it to go around the diamond and its setting. Also pay close attention to the type of metal and its ct, if they are different then one of the rings will change colour slowly over time and not match any more, don't ask how I discovered that..........
For what it's worth she went with white gold with an oval cut diamond. She has worn it for about 15 years now and it still looks like new. Be careful with the oval cut diamonds as you will need to get a wedding ring with a curve in it to go around the diamond and its setting. Also pay close attention to the type of metal and its ct, if they are different then one of the rings will change colour slowly over time and not match any more, don't ask how I discovered that..........
Wife 1- super fussy and chose it herself.
Turned out to be a wrong un. Ring sold for 10% of cost. Proposer beware!
Current wife- taken to Birmingham jewellery quarter. I hadn't realised just how many jewelry shops there are.
Ended up choosing something off the shelf, I thought we would get something custom made.
Diamond clarity and inclusions. I've never examined a ring so closely, other that while buying, to spot colour inclusion cut or any of the stuff that is upsold.
In the office there are several chunky diamond rings floating about. Two owners only found out the value when insuring them.
Can you tell your diamonds? Can your wife? Is anyone getting a magnifying glass out and examine the stone?
If the answers no to those three, what do you gain with this stuff?
If it's something, go for whatever makes you happy.
If not, just get one you/ she likes the look of.
Typed wearing a plain Ti £30 ring that from any distance looks the same as my mates plain platinum band.
Turned out to be a wrong un. Ring sold for 10% of cost. Proposer beware!
Current wife- taken to Birmingham jewellery quarter. I hadn't realised just how many jewelry shops there are.
Ended up choosing something off the shelf, I thought we would get something custom made.
Diamond clarity and inclusions. I've never examined a ring so closely, other that while buying, to spot colour inclusion cut or any of the stuff that is upsold.
In the office there are several chunky diamond rings floating about. Two owners only found out the value when insuring them.
Can you tell your diamonds? Can your wife? Is anyone getting a magnifying glass out and examine the stone?
If the answers no to those three, what do you gain with this stuff?
If it's something, go for whatever makes you happy.
If not, just get one you/ she likes the look of.
Typed wearing a plain Ti £30 ring that from any distance looks the same as my mates plain platinum band.
Obviously you know your wife and you also need to consider the wedding band, does she want something shaped to fit round the engagement ring?
I used a small family jewellers near me who made the ring to my design, first in wax then had it cast and finished the job. They made a shaped wedding run to match it with some stones that had came from a ring of her mum’s that broke.
If you’re anywhere near South Yorkshire I can highly recommend them.
https://www.wjshawjewellers.co.uk/wedding-engageme...
In the interest of clarity, my wife now works there.
I used a small family jewellers near me who made the ring to my design, first in wax then had it cast and finished the job. They made a shaped wedding run to match it with some stones that had came from a ring of her mum’s that broke.
If you’re anywhere near South Yorkshire I can highly recommend them.
https://www.wjshawjewellers.co.uk/wedding-engageme...
In the interest of clarity, my wife now works there.
Can you not go to some shops in a jewellery quarter in Birmingham or London (Hatton Garden). Try some on? Will be helpful for the stone size and cut. Like on my Mrs’s finger, between 1 and 1.2 carats looks just right. She tried a 2 carat ring, but a rock that size didn’t sit right in her finger. Less than 0.8, it looked like a tiddler. You got to look at a few I reckon, some stones might speak to you, regardless of grading and colour.
Honestly never saw her so engaged (!) with a purchase before, so might be a fun day out for her.
Honestly never saw her so engaged (!) with a purchase before, so might be a fun day out for her.
Edited by wyson on Tuesday 16th January 17:14
I know a little bit about stones. Apologies if you know all this and I’m boring you but few comments on the diamond side in case you don’t.
If you hope to view the diamond itself as an investment as well as a love token it’s very hard. Certain criteria can ensure they keep some value (4 C’s… cut, clarity plus a GIA triple X with certificate etc etc). E.g see https://4cs.gia.edu/en-us/blog/triple-x-diamonds/
but in all honesty it’s very difficult for a single retail purchase of a ‘normal size diamond’ to be anything close in value to what you’ll pay for it so it is defo about the emotional value (which is for me at least more than enough)
Sure, go over 1 carat, buy the best and one can limit losses…. But then you’ll be spending more and even if you do that diamond prices vary over time. They dropped after I got married (obv…) maybe as the trend has been not to drop cash on diamonds in the same way Boomers did. Post pandemic saw a big rise in ‘value’ but now prices have dropped back again in most categories and so you can get some reasonable stones for not too much. Message though is as per other posters above, make sure the style is right for the partner.. I checked with mine and got my Mrs something that she could wear even doing sport and not some dainty trinket. Just as well as she has worn it a lot doing the basic chores of life.
Personally I’d recommend to buy something that was eye clean (down to about VS1 or maybe 2 and ‘colourless’ to a point you don’t notice a tint in the classic round engagement cut (which to my eye helps it look bigger, limits tint as more light gets reflected), but everyone is different. Scroll down that GIA page and there are tips to get best value for money when comparing grades and cuts etc.
For example you’ll struggle to see any difference of similar quality stone say between a .95 carat diamond and one at 1.0 carat, but you’ll pay extra for it going over the 1 carat threshold. Unless one needs bragging rights it’s obviously not important. I’m old so I like the look of classic engagement rings with natural stones which plays into the emotional value. Obviously one can also buy manmade diamonds these days but that’s another thing…
Oh and if you want to look at it properly to make sure it looks nice and is set well take a 10x loupe (£15) or ask to see it using the shop one (or at least a magnifying glass) and then check with just your eye that you can’t see anything that puts you off once you know where any irregularities are.
If you hope to view the diamond itself as an investment as well as a love token it’s very hard. Certain criteria can ensure they keep some value (4 C’s… cut, clarity plus a GIA triple X with certificate etc etc). E.g see https://4cs.gia.edu/en-us/blog/triple-x-diamonds/
but in all honesty it’s very difficult for a single retail purchase of a ‘normal size diamond’ to be anything close in value to what you’ll pay for it so it is defo about the emotional value (which is for me at least more than enough)
Sure, go over 1 carat, buy the best and one can limit losses…. But then you’ll be spending more and even if you do that diamond prices vary over time. They dropped after I got married (obv…) maybe as the trend has been not to drop cash on diamonds in the same way Boomers did. Post pandemic saw a big rise in ‘value’ but now prices have dropped back again in most categories and so you can get some reasonable stones for not too much. Message though is as per other posters above, make sure the style is right for the partner.. I checked with mine and got my Mrs something that she could wear even doing sport and not some dainty trinket. Just as well as she has worn it a lot doing the basic chores of life.
Personally I’d recommend to buy something that was eye clean (down to about VS1 or maybe 2 and ‘colourless’ to a point you don’t notice a tint in the classic round engagement cut (which to my eye helps it look bigger, limits tint as more light gets reflected), but everyone is different. Scroll down that GIA page and there are tips to get best value for money when comparing grades and cuts etc.
For example you’ll struggle to see any difference of similar quality stone say between a .95 carat diamond and one at 1.0 carat, but you’ll pay extra for it going over the 1 carat threshold. Unless one needs bragging rights it’s obviously not important. I’m old so I like the look of classic engagement rings with natural stones which plays into the emotional value. Obviously one can also buy manmade diamonds these days but that’s another thing…
Oh and if you want to look at it properly to make sure it looks nice and is set well take a 10x loupe (£15) or ask to see it using the shop one (or at least a magnifying glass) and then check with just your eye that you can’t see anything that puts you off once you know where any irregularities are.
Edited by weeve on Thursday 18th January 21:13
I didn't have much cash when we got engaged, but wife is super particular about her jewelry, but I know she likes Art Deco. I ended up getting her designed and custom made, which was far cheaper and better value than "off the shelf" and a really good experience. I "made the most" of my budget and he did a matching wedding ring too.
As you have done the deed, maybe working with someone would be a really great thing to do?
Happy to discuss the whole thing if you want to PM me for details.
As you have done the deed, maybe working with someone would be a really great thing to do?
Happy to discuss the whole thing if you want to PM me for details.
Just to elaborate and maybe add a bit more info to help you along....
Princess cuts aren't commonly thought of as the traditional shape, they're effectively brilliant cuts in a square . Brilliant cuts are the modern version of the old cut / round cut / European cut stones. Princess cuts actually pretty hard to shift these days, more commonly sold in a 3 or 5 stone configuration. That's just fashion for you. Obviously they do sell, but in the last 10 years I'd say less than 10% of my sales are in this shape.
Emerald cuts are pretty traditional and are very nice, but usually higher value because the stones typically have to be a better quality due to the windowing / visual characteristics of the cut, a bit like baguette cuts are. Old cuts are lovely and classy, we sell a lot of these. Each one is personal and different. Brilliant cuts are modern standard and there is choice galore..... but are tough to navigate if you're not looking at the right things.
Pricing of stones is an absolute minefield and not helped by internet advice. The chains / cartels, and online sellers, someone suggested a popular one above, are crafty. You think you're getting a decent stone at low cost, but there's always a reason whey they're cheap. The 4 C's is only part of a story and a certificate is like company turnover.... vanity! Many people don't care and cost is everything..... but that's modern society i guess. Odd that somebody talks about losses too, like the engagement was never meant to be permanent. Your eyes will tell you so much more than a GIA cert. World class certificate providers are naughty too, but like Disney, they have the public under a spell. They all have margins for error, some more than others, some to suit their own ends. Use your eyes
Anyway, I'm always happy to help and have done so with loads of PHers over the years. Usually I get stones in for customers so they can pick the one that jumps out to them. Certification I leave off the table until they've picked a stone and then explain why they've made the choice they have. Like I said, the 4 C's only say so much and it's your eyes that you need to trust.
Lab stones are pretty much worthless now. Anyone looking to buy one is looking to burn their money. The big players in natural stones, De Beers for example are flooding the market with certificated (IGI) lab stones to bring the values down to £0. Currently they're worth almost £0. Any dealer looking to sell you lab stones with a value of more than the mount it's sat in is either pulling your pants down or is so heavily invested in lab stock that he / she has to tell the outdated story to keep afloat. Lab stones are all laser etched on the girdle and jeweller / trader will know to check for this before buying in secondhand rings. If it's got LG or LabGrown lasered onto it it will only be worth the scrap value of the metal. Nobody buys secondhand lab stuff, it's a big lie. Ethically it's BS too. The working conditions and labour used to produce them are as you might fear they'd be in far away lands.
Platinum has come down in price a lot in the past few years thanks to the car industry and batteries. White gold has gone up loads for the same reasons, just like rhodium has. This has put platinum at a similar price point to 18ct white now, which is great. Platinum is by far the superior metal so it's a good time to choose it for a ring. It's dense, it's white and it's low maintenance. The only downside is that platinum currently has a pretty low scrap value..... but because we all aim to be engaged once and married forever this shouldn't be the thought when buying.
I've emailed you back anyway so hopefully we can chat at your convenience.
Eddie, not Eric
Princess cuts aren't commonly thought of as the traditional shape, they're effectively brilliant cuts in a square . Brilliant cuts are the modern version of the old cut / round cut / European cut stones. Princess cuts actually pretty hard to shift these days, more commonly sold in a 3 or 5 stone configuration. That's just fashion for you. Obviously they do sell, but in the last 10 years I'd say less than 10% of my sales are in this shape.
Emerald cuts are pretty traditional and are very nice, but usually higher value because the stones typically have to be a better quality due to the windowing / visual characteristics of the cut, a bit like baguette cuts are. Old cuts are lovely and classy, we sell a lot of these. Each one is personal and different. Brilliant cuts are modern standard and there is choice galore..... but are tough to navigate if you're not looking at the right things.
Pricing of stones is an absolute minefield and not helped by internet advice. The chains / cartels, and online sellers, someone suggested a popular one above, are crafty. You think you're getting a decent stone at low cost, but there's always a reason whey they're cheap. The 4 C's is only part of a story and a certificate is like company turnover.... vanity! Many people don't care and cost is everything..... but that's modern society i guess. Odd that somebody talks about losses too, like the engagement was never meant to be permanent. Your eyes will tell you so much more than a GIA cert. World class certificate providers are naughty too, but like Disney, they have the public under a spell. They all have margins for error, some more than others, some to suit their own ends. Use your eyes
Anyway, I'm always happy to help and have done so with loads of PHers over the years. Usually I get stones in for customers so they can pick the one that jumps out to them. Certification I leave off the table until they've picked a stone and then explain why they've made the choice they have. Like I said, the 4 C's only say so much and it's your eyes that you need to trust.
Lab stones are pretty much worthless now. Anyone looking to buy one is looking to burn their money. The big players in natural stones, De Beers for example are flooding the market with certificated (IGI) lab stones to bring the values down to £0. Currently they're worth almost £0. Any dealer looking to sell you lab stones with a value of more than the mount it's sat in is either pulling your pants down or is so heavily invested in lab stock that he / she has to tell the outdated story to keep afloat. Lab stones are all laser etched on the girdle and jeweller / trader will know to check for this before buying in secondhand rings. If it's got LG or LabGrown lasered onto it it will only be worth the scrap value of the metal. Nobody buys secondhand lab stuff, it's a big lie. Ethically it's BS too. The working conditions and labour used to produce them are as you might fear they'd be in far away lands.
Platinum has come down in price a lot in the past few years thanks to the car industry and batteries. White gold has gone up loads for the same reasons, just like rhodium has. This has put platinum at a similar price point to 18ct white now, which is great. Platinum is by far the superior metal so it's a good time to choose it for a ring. It's dense, it's white and it's low maintenance. The only downside is that platinum currently has a pretty low scrap value..... but because we all aim to be engaged once and married forever this shouldn't be the thought when buying.
I've emailed you back anyway so hopefully we can chat at your convenience.
Eddie, not Eric
Edited by ecain63 on Monday 29th January 21:23
wyson said:
Can normal punters get labstones for free / minimal cost then? I read they cost $200 to $300 to grow per carat? Is DeBeers taking a massive hit?
Yeah, of course you can. The secondhand pile is gowing daily. Why would you buy a lab for £1000 knowing it's got no resale? It's like buying a pair of fake Air Jordans for £50 and hoping they'll be worth £30 when you don't like them anymore. They're bin fodder.To answer the above about unmarked lab stones: yeah, I've already seen a couple with the markings ground off. It's something that will catch jewellers out and it'll cost them. Luckily stones can be tested by the lab so if a trader is unsure they can offer to test before purchase. If the seller knows it's not legit then it's unlikely they'll go forward. At the other end.... if scammer traders are buying labs in to then sell as genuine with no markings then that's more difficult to prove for the consumer. It happens, and will happen more. But this is why the big natural producers want lab stones killed off. If there's no market then they'll stop being made. Slowly the stock out there will get sucked up for use in machinery and tech. That's the hope, because I hate seeing people spend thousands on lab crap because greedy sellers forced it on them as "the next big thing."
Well from what you are saying, lab diamonds are worthless. If I could get a 1ct lab diamond for £50 and set it in 18c white gold for £500 and give it as a gift, honestly wouldn’t make any difference to me. Would rather that, than pay £16k for an ‘investment grade’ flawless 1ct natural diamond. So pay £550, get something that might look identical to something costing £16,500. Bargain if you ask me. Stick that £16k into shares, go on an unforgettable honeymoon or whatever.
Definitely going to start looking for these worthless diamonds now! The Mrs wanted another 1ct diamond ring as an anniversary gift, I was thinking I’d have to cough up at least £3k, was bracing myself to pay £5k or £6k, but if its less than a grand, I’m quids in! Definitely not going to mention the £50 lab grown bit
Definitely going to start looking for these worthless diamonds now! The Mrs wanted another 1ct diamond ring as an anniversary gift, I was thinking I’d have to cough up at least £3k, was bracing myself to pay £5k or £6k, but if its less than a grand, I’m quids in! Definitely not going to mention the £50 lab grown bit
Edited by wyson on Monday 29th January 21:52
ecain63 said:
Like a Ferrari MR2
She probably wouldn’t be able to tell anyway.
She told me her friend got a new small Toyota SUV. I thought it must be a Yaris Cross or CH-R. Went to said friend’s house, it was a VW T-Roc. She admitted to me they all look the same to her. LOL.
Edited by wyson on Monday 29th January 22:20
100% on what Eddie said about lab grown diamonds.
Wife said they're a plague at the minute, absolutely everywhere and utterly worthless as an investment piece. Customers have come in to ask for insuracne valuations and left very disappointed. As a previous posted intimated they're pretty much a throwaway piece that costs a fraction of a mined diamond so you dont have to care about it.
Alongside her engagement ring my wife has an alternate, almost identical ring which she wears when we're going somewhere like a bike rally in a field so she can not worry about her real one.
Its a great idea to consider getting a duplicate with a lab grown or alternate stone alongside rather than in place of.
Wife said they're a plague at the minute, absolutely everywhere and utterly worthless as an investment piece. Customers have come in to ask for insuracne valuations and left very disappointed. As a previous posted intimated they're pretty much a throwaway piece that costs a fraction of a mined diamond so you dont have to care about it.
Alongside her engagement ring my wife has an alternate, almost identical ring which she wears when we're going somewhere like a bike rally in a field so she can not worry about her real one.
Its a great idea to consider getting a duplicate with a lab grown or alternate stone alongside rather than in place of.
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