Does anyone do home maintenance/repairs on EVs and Hybrids?

[Foss62]

The latest fascinating fault on my Friday afternoon PHEV Skoda involves the separate cooling system for the high voltage system. The VAG breakdown man wasn’t even allowed to top the expansion tank up - it is wired shut and “can only be accessed at an approved workshop”.
This got me thinking. Will anyone, ever, work on these at home? Are Haynes currently stripping down EVs and Hybrids to produce the classic manuals?

[shtu]

Foss62 said:

Will anyone, ever, work on these at home?

Of course. People already do.

I'm old enough to remember the howls of anguish as electronic ignition and fuel injection started to appear, and how it would kill-off non franchise garages and DIYers. Never happened.

[GT6k]

Definitely yes. Some systems, like Tesla, are easier than others and it requires a different skill set, (software).

[Foss62]

shtu said:

Foss62 said:

Will anyone, ever, work on these at home?

Of course. People already do.

I'm old enough to remember the howls of anguish as electronic ignition and fuel injection started to appear, and how it would kill-off non franchise garages and DIYers. Never happened.

It was the wired-on seal on the expansion tank - like the one on the main fuse of houses - that got me wondering. In theory they (at least the pure EVs) should be much simpler than ICE vehicles. I wonder if the ‘danger’ is being hyped a bit to try to ward off DIYers. I can’t imagine anything there that would terrify a normal domestic electrician - particularly now they are becoming more accustomed to home batteries in solar panel systems etc.

[5s Alive]

I serviced and maintained our Prius over the 12yrs we had it. It never had work carried out in a garage, bar the mot - test only. Usual oil/air filter changes, spark plugs, atf etc. I'd have been perfectly happy to replace individual HV battery modules but it was never necessary as it still had exactly the same ev only range as new. Fitted a dashcam and display that read out 32 different parameters, battery voltage, fuel flow, inverter temp, revs etc. 90% of it no different to working on an ice car. I've also recently replaced the reduction gear oil on our Kona EV.

[Pit Pony]

I work in the larger end of the motor industry, and last week one of our development engineers got a bit shock 48v but God knows what current. He had followed all the correct procedures, and touch something that should have been free of charge and wasn't.

Just invest in a pair of insulated gloves.

[frisbee]

5s Alive said:

I serviced and maintained our Prius over the 12yrs we had it. It never had work carried out in a garage, bar the mot - test only. Usual oil/air filter changes, spark plugs, atf etc. I'd have been perfectly happy to replace individual HV battery modules but it was never necessary as it still had exactly the same ev only range as new. Fitted a dashcam and display that read out 32 different parameters, battery voltage, fuel flow, inverter temp, revs etc. 90% of it no different to working on an ice car. I've also recently replaced the reduction gear oil on our Kona EV.

I worked with someone who replaced several battery modules on his first generation Prius. He had attached a wires so I could work out which module had failed, I guess the battery management was pretty crude on the first gen.

[5s Alive]

frisbee said:

5s Alive said:

I serviced and maintained our Prius over the 12yrs we had it. It never had work carried out in a garage, bar the mot - test only. Usual oil/air filter changes, spark plugs, atf etc. I'd have been perfectly happy to replace individual HV battery modules but it was never necessary as it still had exactly the same ev only range as new. Fitted a dashcam and display that read out 32 different parameters, battery voltage, fuel flow, inverter temp, revs etc. 90% of it no different to working on an ice car. I've also recently replaced the reduction gear oil on our Kona EV.

I worked with someone who replaced several battery modules on his first generation Prius. He had attached a wires so I could work out which module had failed, I guess the battery management was pretty crude on the first gen.

I had a version of Toyota's Techstream software and could see the state of health of individual modules. Once the main cutout has been pulled it's a simple job, at least on the 3rd gen, to replace individual modules. You do have to wait at least 20 mins for residual current to dissipate. In most instances only one or two modules ever fail and I'm fairly convinced that those had manufacturing defects.

The one major failure I was aware of was a case of someone unintentionally covering up the HV battery fan air inlet on the outside edge of the rear seat back. With it being air cooled it fried the battery pack. It didn't help that it was a hot summers day and that the driver was unable to stop immediately when the dash lit up like a Christmas tree.

[tr7v8]

Pit Pony said:

I work in the larger end of the motor industry, and last week one of our development engineers got a bit shock 48v but God knows what current. He had followed all the correct procedures, and touch something that should have been free of charge and wasn't.

Just invest in a pair of insulated gloves.

Will be minimal current unless his hands were wet. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extra-low_voltage

[ashenfie]

I got a bad burn on just 5volts. It’s all about the amps.

[annodomini2]

Tesla put their workshop manuals online:

https://service.tesla.com/docs/Model3/ServiceManua...

[TooLateForAName]

Foss62 said:

It was the wired-on seal on the expansion tank - like the one on the main fuse of houses - that got me wondering. In theory they (at least the pure EVs) should be much simpler than ICE vehicles. I wonder if the ‘danger’ is being hyped a bit to try to ward off DIYers. I can’t imagine anything there that would terrify a normal domestic electrician - particularly now they are becoming more accustomed to home batteries in solar panel systems etc.

Possibly it needs a non-conductive coolant and its wired shut to stop owners just topping it up with water. Just about people developing knowledge of the differences with battery systems.

[JonnyVTEC]

Installed a grid charger on my Insight, also swapped the battery. Read up before the process but it’s cleaner work!

[RobbyJ]

I've done a fair bit on my Model S. Replaced the main MCU screen, replaced all the dash trims, fitted a tow bar, replaced the air suspension compressor etc. All pretty straight forward, almost easier than other cars due to the build quality!

[5s Alive]

RobbyJ said:

I've done a fair bit on my Model S. Replaced the main MCU screen, replaced all the dash trims, fitted a tow bar, replaced the air suspension compressor etc. All pretty straight forward, almost easier than other cars due to the build quality!

You'll need to clarify that last sentence before someone pops up to suggest it's because those bits fell off.

[RobbyJ]

5s Alive said:

You'll need to clarify that last sentence before someone pops up to suggest it's because those bits fell off.

Haha. I've done a fair bit of home mechanic work over the years, basic stuff and electrics, I know my limits!

The Tesla isn't built like all the Audi's I've had, or Range Rovers. It's just engineered differently. Other cars I often look up a guide and instructions, on the Tesla I just start ripping into it and it's just straight forward to take apart and put back together. I can get all the cladding off and the frunk out in about 5 minutes which just exposes most things you need to get to. Try that on a modern twin turbo V8 and there are a billion pipes, wires and general stuff to contend with.

[98elise]

Pit Pony said:

I work in the larger end of the motor industry, and last week one of our development engineers got a bit shock 48v but God knows what current. He had followed all the correct procedures, and touch something that should have been free of charge and wasn't.

Just invest in a pair of insulated gloves.

Current is determined by resistance so the shock would be many times less then that of mains. 48v is in the Extra Low Voltage range.

[98elise]

ashenfie said:

I got a bad burn on just 5volts. It’s all about the amps.

Which is directly related to voltage (assuming your resistance is the same). Simple ohms law.

How did you manage to get a bad burn from just 5v?

Edited by 98elise on Monday 27th May 18:54

[5s Alive]

RobbyJ said:

5s Alive said:

You'll need to clarify that last sentence before someone pops up to suggest it's because those bits fell off.

Haha. I've done a fair bit of home mechanic work over the years, basic stuff and electrics, I know my limits!

The Tesla isn't built like all the Audi's I've had, or Range Rovers. It's just engineered differently. Other cars I often look up a guide and instructions, on the Tesla I just start ripping into it and it's just straight forward to take apart and put back together. I can get all the cladding off and the frunk out in about 5 minutes which just exposes most things you need to get to. Try that on a modern twin turbo V8 and there are a billion pipes, wires and general stuff to contend with.

EVs do lend themselves to a bit of home spannering due to their simplicity, contrary to the public perception that they're death on wheels. Even our previous Prius hybrid was easy to work on compared to many modern vehicles. Ford's Ecoboost engines are a standout example of how it shouldn't be done. Timing chains at the rear of tight engine bays are just as bad.

[ashenfie]

98elise said:

ashenfie said:

I got a bad burn on just 5volts. It’s all about the amps.

Which is directly related to voltage (assuming your resistance is the same). Simple ohms law.

How did you manage to get a bad burn from just 5v?

Edited by 98elise on Monday 27th May 18:54

Failed to discount the UPS when working on a server. My wedding ring got caught on the power rails and I got burnt