UK driving licence category entitlement
Discussion
Bit of an ongoing discussion with the DVLA on this one - I'll explain as best I can.
Passed my car driving test in 1990 in Ireland
Moved to Germany in 1993, and had to swap my driving licence from Ireland to Germany within 12 months. My German licence made no reference to Ireland, and it just said Date of Issue: 1994.
Moved to the UK in 1999, and did a motorcycle test in 2001; in order to get that done, I had to swap my German licence for a UK licence first, then add my bike test to that licence.
All straightforward, except my German licence said I could drive up to 7.5t, whereas my newly issued UK licence said 3.5t. I didn't think too much about it at the time, but recently myself and my UK-based Irish friend were comparing driving licences - and his has way more categories than mine has - despite us doing the same car test in 1990. He swapped to a UK licence in recent years.
I queried my categories with the DVLA, and they wrote back to me saying if i could prove I was entitled to more categories, they would add them!
So, why the difference in categories between our 2 licences? I know the nomenclature of classes changed over the years - was a sort-of amnesty given to add / round up to different classes at some stage (depending on when you passed your test)? There's reference to a "Category B - if you passed your test before 1 January 1997" on https://www.gov.uk/driving-licence-categories, but does it apply to me?
Passed my car driving test in 1990 in Ireland
Moved to Germany in 1993, and had to swap my driving licence from Ireland to Germany within 12 months. My German licence made no reference to Ireland, and it just said Date of Issue: 1994.
Moved to the UK in 1999, and did a motorcycle test in 2001; in order to get that done, I had to swap my German licence for a UK licence first, then add my bike test to that licence.
All straightforward, except my German licence said I could drive up to 7.5t, whereas my newly issued UK licence said 3.5t. I didn't think too much about it at the time, but recently myself and my UK-based Irish friend were comparing driving licences - and his has way more categories than mine has - despite us doing the same car test in 1990. He swapped to a UK licence in recent years.
I queried my categories with the DVLA, and they wrote back to me saying if i could prove I was entitled to more categories, they would add them!
So, why the difference in categories between our 2 licences? I know the nomenclature of classes changed over the years - was a sort-of amnesty given to add / round up to different classes at some stage (depending on when you passed your test)? There's reference to a "Category B - if you passed your test before 1 January 1997" on https://www.gov.uk/driving-licence-categories, but does it apply to me?
As I understand it, your licence should be returned to its original entitlements from when you passed. If you still have your pass certificate then I'd send that in to the DVLA (or a copy if they'll accept it) and they should add on any entitlements you would've had back then. Perhaps it's a default of changing from a German to a UK licence?
It's not unheard of for licence entitlements to go missing with renewals and such. The DVLA are usually quite good at reinstating them from what I've seen.
It's not unheard of for licence entitlements to go missing with renewals and such. The DVLA are usually quite good at reinstating them from what I've seen.
Doofus said:
If you passed your test in Ireland, did you actually get those entitlements in the first place?
Some of them, yes. The "up to 7.5t" bit was definitely there at one stage. What I'm wondering is, what categories of entitlement should I have on my licence having passed a car test in 1990. My friend has more categories ticked than I do (Irish car test / now on UK licence). So does my wife (UK car test in the 80's). Even my friends who only ever did a car test in Ireland at the same time as me (and are still there) have way more entitlements.What I have:
AM
A
B1
B
BE
fkpq
My wife has...
AM
A (trike)
B1
B
C1
D1
BE
C1E
D1E
fklnpq
Friends have C1 (up to 7.5t) which I guess is the main one I'm querying.
Edited by BFleming on Tuesday 3rd December 13:30
RazerSauber said:
As I understand it, your licence should be returned to its original entitlements from when you passed. If you still have your pass certificate then I'd send that in to the DVLA (or a copy if they'll accept it) and they should add on any entitlements you would've had back then. Perhaps it's a default of changing from a German to a UK licence?
It's not unheard of for licence entitlements to go missing with renewals and such. The DVLA are usually quite good at reinstating them from what I've seen.
I've had several customers who have had to re-test their bike test, because DVSA has "lost" their entitlement.It's not unheard of for licence entitlements to go missing with renewals and such. The DVLA are usually quite good at reinstating them from what I've seen.
One chap passed his bike test in the 1970s - oddly enough he didn't have the pass certificate....
As far as I understand it, if you passed a car test before 1997 you should be entitled to those ‘grandfather’ rights. If:
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
You have not had your licence revoked (or indeed, surrendered it) because of some medical condition. I lost that 7.5t limit after surrendering mine owing to epilepsy, it came back with 3.5t limits.
Quote:
Standard driving licences issued before 1 January 1997 included the categories C1 (lorries weighing between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes) and D1 (minibuses, 9-16 seats, not for hire or reward). Licences issued after 1 January 1997 do not include these categories. If you’ve had to give up your pre-1997 licence for medical reasons, the C1 and D1 categories will have been taken off. To drive these category vehicles, you need to meet the stricter medical standards for bus and lorry drivers.
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
You have not had your licence revoked (or indeed, surrendered it) because of some medical condition. I lost that 7.5t limit after surrendering mine owing to epilepsy, it came back with 3.5t limits.
Quote:
Standard driving licences issued before 1 January 1997 included the categories C1 (lorries weighing between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes) and D1 (minibuses, 9-16 seats, not for hire or reward). Licences issued after 1 January 1997 do not include these categories. If you’ve had to give up your pre-1997 licence for medical reasons, the C1 and D1 categories will have been taken off. To drive these category vehicles, you need to meet the stricter medical standards for bus and lorry drivers.
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Pica-Pica said:
As far as I understand it, if you passed a car test before 1997 you should be entitled to those ‘grandfather’ rights. If:
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
Unless you've turned 70? (Not implying you have OP The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
)2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Pica-Pica said:
As far as I understand it, if you passed a car test before 1997 you should be entitled to those ‘grandfather’ rights. If:
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
Unless you've turned 70? (Not implying you have OP The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
)BFleming said:
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Pica-Pica said:
As far as I understand it, if you passed a car test before 1997 you should be entitled to those ‘grandfather’ rights. If:
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
Unless you've turned 70? (Not implying you have OP The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
)
BFleming said:
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Pica-Pica said:
As far as I understand it, if you passed a car test before 1997 you should be entitled to those ‘grandfather’ rights. If:
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
Unless you've turned 70? (Not implying you have OP The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
)
Pica-Pica said:
As far as I understand it, if you passed a car test before 1997 you should be entitled to those ‘grandfather’ rights. If:
The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
You have not had your licence revoked (or indeed, surrendered it) because of some medical condition. I lost that 7.5t limit after surrendering mine owing to epilepsy, it came back with 3.5t limits.
Quote:
Standard driving licences issued before 1 January 1997 included the categories C1 (lorries weighing between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes) and D1 (minibuses, 9-16 seats, not for hire or reward). Licences issued after 1 January 1997 do not include these categories. If you’ve had to give up your pre-1997 licence for medical reasons, the C1 and D1 categories will have been taken off. To drive these category vehicles, you need to meet the stricter medical standards for bus and lorry drivers.
Interesting. Not medical related, but the other half had a Swedish licence (now transferred to a UK one) passed pre 1997. But the Swedes did not give you C1 at the time when you passed your test, so her transferred UK licence is a little empty with not a lot other than standard car on it.The licence issuer was recognised by the U.K.
You have not had your licence revoked (or indeed, surrendered it) because of some medical condition. I lost that 7.5t limit after surrendering mine owing to epilepsy, it came back with 3.5t limits.
Quote:
Standard driving licences issued before 1 January 1997 included the categories C1 (lorries weighing between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes) and D1 (minibuses, 9-16 seats, not for hire or reward). Licences issued after 1 January 1997 do not include these categories. If you’ve had to give up your pre-1997 licence for medical reasons, the C1 and D1 categories will have been taken off. To drive these category vehicles, you need to meet the stricter medical standards for bus and lorry drivers.
Is there any way to get the UK to recognise a pre-97 European licence and grandfather in the C1 or is this a lost cause?
Thanks
covboy said:
OverSteery said:
I've had several customers who have had to re-test their bike test, because DVSA has "lost" their entitlement.
One chap passed his bike test in the 1970s - oddly enough he didn't have the pass certificate....
Didn't this happen to some serving Traffic Police oficers ?One chap passed his bike test in the 1970s - oddly enough he didn't have the pass certificate....
another-steveb said:
Is there any way to get the UK to recognise a pre-97 European licence and grandfather in the C1 or is this a lost cause?
I think that's my challenge - but the DVLA just throws it back at me and says "prove you're entitled". I suspect the Grandfather rights will apply only to a licence originally obtained in the UK.Can someone with a 1990 UK test pass tell me what the flipside of their licence tells them they're entitled to?
BFleming said:
another-steveb said:
Is there any way to get the UK to recognise a pre-97 European licence and grandfather in the C1 or is this a lost cause?
I think that's my challenge - but the DVLA just throws it back at me and says "prove you're entitled". I suspect the Grandfather rights will apply only to a licence originally obtained in the UK.Can someone with a 1990 UK test pass tell me what the flipside of their licence tells them they're entitled to?
AM
A
B1
B
C1
D1 (101)
BE
C1E (107)
D1E (101,119)
fklnpq (118)
Entitlements by year here
https://www.gov.uk/old-driving-licence-categories
Edited by worsy on Wednesday 4th December 15:09
worsy said:
BFleming said:
another-steveb said:
Is there any way to get the UK to recognise a pre-97 European licence and grandfather in the C1 or is this a lost cause?
I think that's my challenge - but the DVLA just throws it back at me and says "prove you're entitled". I suspect the Grandfather rights will apply only to a licence originally obtained in the UK.Can someone with a 1990 UK test pass tell me what the flipside of their licence tells them they're entitled to?
AM
A
B1
B
C1
D1 (101)
BE
C1E (107)
D1E (101,119)
fklnpq (118)
Entitlements by year here
https://www.gov.uk/old-driving-licence-categories
BFleming said:
another-steveb said:
Is there any way to get the UK to recognise a pre-97 European licence and grandfather in the C1 or is this a lost cause?
I think that's my challenge - but the DVLA just throws it back at me and says "prove you're entitled". I suspect the Grandfather rights will apply only to a licence originally obtained in the UK.Can someone with a 1990 UK test pass tell me what the flipside of their licence tells them they're entitled to?
Jan 2025 update. The Irish authorities came back to me. Back when I did my test, driving licencing was part of the County Council's responsibilities (along with car tax) - but that changed in 2013. There's now the Road Safety Authority (a government body), who manage the National Driver Licence Service. Records pre 2013 are scant, and because I haven't lived there since 1993, nor renewed my Irish licence in that time, they're saying there's no records to extract.
Over the Christmas break however, I did manage to find a photocopy of my German licence, the one traded in (!) to the DVLA all those years ago. So I'm going to poke the hornet's nest that is the DVLA with that one, and see what happens.
Over the Christmas break however, I did manage to find a photocopy of my German licence, the one traded in (!) to the DVLA all those years ago. So I'm going to poke the hornet's nest that is the DVLA with that one, and see what happens.
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