What Chinese EVs do you like the look of?
Discussion
I'm sure this is going to end up going South but some of these cars look amazing, especially when compared to what some of the European legacy brands are up to (not mentioning any names Bavarian Motor Works..)
Anyone else have an appreciation or is it just me?
Avatr 12
Xpeng P7
Xiaomi YU7
BYD Han
Zeekr 001
Anyone else have an appreciation or is it just me?
Avatr 12
Xpeng P7
Xiaomi YU7
BYD Han
Zeekr 001
I've sat in the HiPhi cars, they're pretty mad in a good way.
I hope the legacy European car makers get a deserved kick up the backside, they've been playing it way too safe. BMW for example came out with brilliant ideas in the i3 and i8 and every EV since has just been bloated mediocrity.
I hope the legacy European car makers get a deserved kick up the backside, they've been playing it way too safe. BMW for example came out with brilliant ideas in the i3 and i8 and every EV since has just been bloated mediocrity.
God these are awful, the level of blatant plagiarism is frankly a joke. Just taking the Xiaomi YU7, Mclaren headlights, Purosangue arch surrounds, Purosangue rear haunch, Taycan bonnet at a start in one awful incoherent mess of a design. Not to mention the 'roof scoop' is laughable. Plenty of good new EVs coming out of Japan, Europe and USA at more reasonable prices now, no reason to be buying this Chinese s
t.
t.pissonheads said:
God these are awful, the level of blatant plagiarism is frankly a joke. Just taking the Xiaomi YU7, Mclaren headlights, Purosangue arch surrounds, Purosangue rear haunch, Taycan bonnet at a start in one awful incoherent mess of a design. Not to mention the 'roof scoop' is laughable. Plenty of good new EVs coming out of Japan, Europe and USA at more reasonable prices now, no reason to be buying this Chinese st.
If it is blatant as you say, why do manufacturers not sue the hell out of the Chinese car makers? I genuinely want to knowt.pissonheads said:
God these are awful, the level of blatant plagiarism is frankly a joke. Just taking the Xiaomi YU7, Mclaren headlights, Purosangue arch surrounds, Purosangue rear haunch, Taycan bonnet at a start in one awful incoherent mess of a design. Not to mention the 'roof scoop' is laughable. Plenty of good new EVs coming out of Japan, Europe and USA at more reasonable prices now, no reason to be buying this Chinese st.
Modern design language is pretty similar across the board these days. The new Toyota Crown Crossover looks similar to a Purosangue too, so are they Japanese st.t or Italian st?I've been in a number of Chinese cars now and they've been comfortable, rode nicely, looked good and had loads of useful tech in them. Intrigued to know how you are so sure they are all s
t?Pistonheadsdicoverer said:
pissonheads said:
God these are awful, the level of blatant plagiarism is frankly a joke. Just taking the Xiaomi YU7, Mclaren headlights, Purosangue arch surrounds, Purosangue rear haunch, Taycan bonnet at a start in one awful incoherent mess of a design. Not to mention the 'roof scoop' is laughable. Plenty of good new EVs coming out of Japan, Europe and USA at more reasonable prices now, no reason to be buying this Chinese st.
If it is blatant as you say, why do manufacturers not sue the hell out of the Chinese car makers? I genuinely want to knowt.There's no copyright infringement if there's no one to enforce it.
There are no fines if there's no one to collect.
At best, the you scratch my back... ethos may provide marginal leverage.
Ultimately, 'we' need their manufacturing more than 'they' need our $$$.
As the parity of global trade equalises (as it has with Japan for example), each side has more incentive to match policy.
For the moment though, they will rip off designs because they can produce faster, cheaper, and export on a scale we cannot compete with.
Patent on global scale is a gentlemens agreement because every player has a seat at an equal table.
One only needs to take a look at the grain situation in Ukraine, or the oil from the East to see how wafer thin equitable arrangements are, and how quickly that relationship deteriorates without both parties having equal sway.
i.e Why no one in their right mind thought that leaving the EU was a good idea when we had Aces up our sleeve and a shotgun under the table while wearing a smile.
Whilst the Chinese lack of care for plagiarism is not to be celebrated...
The end result is quite often perfectly good looking cars that are packed with tech, that work well and are cheaper than even the boggo spec of the cars they copied...
So in the context of this thread, are these cars quite desirable? Yes I think they are, for anyone that wants to buy a car, not make a political statement. That's a lot of people!
Lets see how these cars do over the next 2-3 years now they're starting to be sold in UK/EU. If they're perfectly reliable and drivers enjoy them, then for all the 'but it's Chinese' wrist wringing in the world, that will be the deciding factor - whether or not they're good, enjoyable, cars. I think many of them will prove to be just that.
And whilst it's easy to complain about the Chinese for various reasons, let's also be critical of what they're competing with in terms of EV's that 'anyone' can have. The VW ID line up...? Not exactly difficult to st all over such dull cars is it? At least part of the problem in terms of the threat of incoming Chinese cars is that our home grown (well, EU) cars are often not that amazing, or cheap, or generously specced.
The end result is quite often perfectly good looking cars that are packed with tech, that work well and are cheaper than even the boggo spec of the cars they copied...
So in the context of this thread, are these cars quite desirable? Yes I think they are, for anyone that wants to buy a car, not make a political statement. That's a lot of people!
Lets see how these cars do over the next 2-3 years now they're starting to be sold in UK/EU. If they're perfectly reliable and drivers enjoy them, then for all the 'but it's Chinese' wrist wringing in the world, that will be the deciding factor - whether or not they're good, enjoyable, cars. I think many of them will prove to be just that.
And whilst it's easy to complain about the Chinese for various reasons, let's also be critical of what they're competing with in terms of EV's that 'anyone' can have. The VW ID line up...? Not exactly difficult to s
t all over such dull cars is it? At least part of the problem in terms of the threat of incoming Chinese cars is that our home grown (well, EU) cars are often not that amazing, or cheap, or generously specced.Chinese cars are built cheaply not through innovation. Cheap labour through standards most western consumers would baulk at, cheap energy from Iranian oil (China buys >90% of Iranian oil) and coal plants, cheap minerals from batteries mined from sub-standard sources using 19th century colonial tactics in mineral rich, cash poor countries (notably Africa). The fact many of the batteries have been shown to have shortened lifespans than European equivalents or the plagiarised designs is only part of the issue. So yes they are st.
We are by no means perfect in Europe, but allowing a reliance on these kind of cheap products is not sustainable politically or economically. Europe grew close to Russia before the war in Ukraine in search of cheap gas to our detriment, growing close to China for a reliance in personal mobility is equally dangerous.
t. We are by no means perfect in Europe, but allowing a reliance on these kind of cheap products is not sustainable politically or economically. Europe grew close to Russia before the war in Ukraine in search of cheap gas to our detriment, growing close to China for a reliance in personal mobility is equally dangerous.
Edited by pissonheads on Thursday 30th January 20:15
pissonheads said:
Chinese cars are built cheaply not through innovation. Cheap labour through standards most western consumers would baulk at, cheap energy from Iranian oil (China buys >90% of Iranian oil) and coal plants, cheap minerals from batteries mined from sub-standard sources using 19th century colonial tactics in mineral rich, cash poor countries (notably Africa). The fact many of the batteries have been shown to have shortened lifespans than European equivalents or the plagiarised designs is only part of the issue. So yes they are st.
We are by no means perfect in Europe, but allowing a reliance on these kind of cheap products is not sustainable politically or economically. Europe grew close to Russia before the war in Ukraine in search of cheap gas to our detriment, growing close to China for a reliance in personal mobility is equally dangerous.
Who is allowing? I had this debate with a mate last week. And he baulked at my suggestion that it is largely demand driven, rather than "allowed" by someone or something else (why are so many things everyone else's fault these days?). He laughed until I asked him where his three most recent acquisitions - a new iPhone, garden furniture and a Ring doorbell - came from. t. We are by no means perfect in Europe, but allowing a reliance on these kind of cheap products is not sustainable politically or economically. Europe grew close to Russia before the war in Ukraine in search of cheap gas to our detriment, growing close to China for a reliance in personal mobility is equally dangerous.
Edited by pissonheads on Thursday 30th January 20:15
Mind you, to be fair to him, he wouldn't buy any EV (he calls me Torchy Boy because I have one), let alone a Chinese one.
pissonheads said:
Chinese cars are built cheaply not through innovation. Cheap labour through standards most western consumers would baulk at, cheap energy from Iranian oil (China buys >90% of Iranian oil) and coal plants, cheap minerals from batteries mined from sub-standard sources using 19th century colonial tactics in mineral rich, cash poor countries (notably Africa). The fact many of the batteries have been shown to have shortened lifespans than European equivalents or the plagiarised designs is only part of the issue. So yes they are st.
We are by no means perfect in Europe, but allowing a reliance on these kind of cheap products is not sustainable politically or economically. Europe grew close to Russia before the war in Ukraine in search of cheap gas to our detriment, growing close to China for a reliance in personal mobility is equally dangerous.
You have just neatly laid out the reasons we in the UK have been shunting manufacturing work to China for the last 40+ years. It worked great when the worst the workers could do with their pay packet was get the family Ox serviced... But now they can build factories capable of delivering 20 million cars a year at 2/3 the price of European cars.t. We are by no means perfect in Europe, but allowing a reliance on these kind of cheap products is not sustainable politically or economically. Europe grew close to Russia before the war in Ukraine in search of cheap gas to our detriment, growing close to China for a reliance in personal mobility is equally dangerous.
Edited by pissonheads on Thursday 30th January 20:15
As for reliance on China for personal mobility... we're already in deeper than that. We, I, you... are all reliant on Chinese products for something even more valuable and important than mobility, we're reliant on them to have a functioning internet. Such as this forum, where you raise your concerns, from whatever device you're using that is 90%+ Chinese.
I'm not sure that the Chinese are eating the Western auto industry's lunch entirely through plagiarism. From a Korean university, by the way.
Exploring Electric Vehicle Patent Trends through Technology Life Cycle and Social Network Analysis
Exploring Electric Vehicle Patent Trends through Technology Life Cycle and Social Network Analysis
paper said:
3.1.2. Technology Application Trends in Major Automobile-Producing Countries
Figure 7 presents the annual trends in EV-related patent applications from major automobile-producing countries between 2004 and 2023. It was possible to understand the technological development trends in the EV field and identify the primary contributors to EV innovation by analyzing the patent applications for EV technology from the world’s major automobile-producing countries. As depicted in the figure, Japan consistently held the highest number of patent applications from 2004 to 2012, leading other countries. However, in 2013, China surpassed Japan for the first time and continued to lead in subsequent years. Furthermore, Japan, the United States, and Germany experienced a turning point in 2019, with a subsequent annual decline in the number of patent applications. Korea experienced a turning point in 2020, and although China did not, its growth rate presented a significant slowdown.
Figure 7 presents the annual trends in EV-related patent applications from major automobile-producing countries between 2004 and 2023. It was possible to understand the technological development trends in the EV field and identify the primary contributors to EV innovation by analyzing the patent applications for EV technology from the world’s major automobile-producing countries. As depicted in the figure, Japan consistently held the highest number of patent applications from 2004 to 2012, leading other countries. However, in 2013, China surpassed Japan for the first time and continued to lead in subsequent years. Furthermore, Japan, the United States, and Germany experienced a turning point in 2019, with a subsequent annual decline in the number of patent applications. Korea experienced a turning point in 2020, and although China did not, its growth rate presented a significant slowdown.
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