How would you approach this?
Discussion
This is always a bone of contention locally.
Basicly a van turning right into Wigeon road however there is a car oncoming. The oncoming car, rather than getting back Ieft to pass and then getting back out once passed the van has continued to approach down the centre of the road and has stopped dead in the road (still in the centre) facing the van. This happens a lot, most people get back left and then pass allowing the van to then turn right into the road.
What's the law or highway code regarding a situation like this? Bearing in mind that like the first picture theres usually 2 or 3 cars parked along the road and the the road after the turning they are usually parked further up from the corner.
Just looking for advice and opinions.
Basicly a van turning right into Wigeon road however there is a car oncoming. The oncoming car, rather than getting back Ieft to pass and then getting back out once passed the van has continued to approach down the centre of the road and has stopped dead in the road (still in the centre) facing the van. This happens a lot, most people get back left and then pass allowing the van to then turn right into the road.
What's the law or highway code regarding a situation like this? Bearing in mind that like the first picture theres usually 2 or 3 cars parked along the road and the the road after the turning they are usually parked further up from the corner.
Just looking for advice and opinions.
NordicCrankShaft said:
This is always a bone of contention locally.
Basicly a van turning right into Wigeon road however there is a car oncoming. The oncoming car, rather than getting back Ieft to pass and then getting back out once passed the van has continued to approach down the centre of the road and has stopped dead in the road (still in the centre) facing the van. This happens a lot, most people get back left and then pass allowing the van to then turn right into the road.
What's the law or highway code regarding a situation like this? Bearing in mind that like the first picture theres usually 2 or 3 cars parked along the road and the the road after the turning they are usually parked further up from the corner.
Just looking for advice and opinions.
Are you asking what the van in the turning right box waiting to turn right should do, or the car driving along the middle of the road in the hatched area? The car in the hatched area marked 'your position along the markings' should have got back on his own side of the road after passing the parked cars. The van should wait for him to pass, then when clear, turn right. Don't see the difficulty. Can't see why any car would stop in a hatched box in the middle of the road for no reason.Basicly a van turning right into Wigeon road however there is a car oncoming. The oncoming car, rather than getting back Ieft to pass and then getting back out once passed the van has continued to approach down the centre of the road and has stopped dead in the road (still in the centre) facing the van. This happens a lot, most people get back left and then pass allowing the van to then turn right into the road.
What's the law or highway code regarding a situation like this? Bearing in mind that like the first picture theres usually 2 or 3 cars parked along the road and the the road after the turning they are usually parked further up from the corner.
Just looking for advice and opinions.
Sounds / looks like the van is in lane 2 (the turning lane) on the correct side of the road, the approaching car is driving through a central hatching in order to pass a series of obstructions (parked cars), so the car should yield at some point before reaching the van..
Are there double yellows on the approach to the junction? As long as the parked cars aren't parked on them, the approaching car should have enough room to move back to their lane before reaching the van..
It's probably one of those scenarios where common sense should - but sometimes doesn't - prevail. There's some roads in my area where there's a 'major' road with cars parked down one side, and you'll have someone emerge from a 'minor' road such as a housing development entrance into the passing / oncoming traffic...
Are there double yellows on the approach to the junction? As long as the parked cars aren't parked on them, the approaching car should have enough room to move back to their lane before reaching the van..
It's probably one of those scenarios where common sense should - but sometimes doesn't - prevail. There's some roads in my area where there's a 'major' road with cars parked down one side, and you'll have someone emerge from a 'minor' road such as a housing development entrance into the passing / oncoming traffic...
Super Sonic said:
Are you asking what the van in the turning right box waiting to turn right should do, or the car driving along the middle of the road in the hatched area? The car in the hatched area marked 'your position along the markings' should have got back on his own side of the road after passing the parked cars. The van should wait for him to pass, then when clear, turn right. Don't see the difficulty. Can't see why any car would stop in a hatched box in the middle of the road for no reason.
Exactly my train of thought, I'm the van driver BTW. But yes basically I always wait until the oncoming car has got back left and to pass before attempting to turn. Except today it's bothered me quite a bit as the person in the car was quite a lot more abusive than normal.
Just needed to know for my own peace of mind that I'm not in the wrong here.
smithyithy said:
Sounds / looks like the van is in lane 2 (the turning lane) on the correct side of the road, the approaching car is driving through a central hatching in order to pass a series of obstructions (parked cars), so the car should yield at some point before reaching the van..
Are there double yellows on the approach to the junction? As long as the parked cars aren't parked on them, the approaching car should have enough room to move back to their lane before reaching the van..
It's probably one of those scenarios where common sense should - but sometimes doesn't - prevail. There's some roads in my area where there's a 'major' road with cars parked down one side, and you'll have someone emerge from a 'minor' road such as a housing development entrance into the passing / oncoming traffic...
Unfortunately there are no double yellows. It's an estate that's 10 years old but the council have still yet to adopt the roads. It's shambolic really. Are there double yellows on the approach to the junction? As long as the parked cars aren't parked on them, the approaching car should have enough room to move back to their lane before reaching the van..
It's probably one of those scenarios where common sense should - but sometimes doesn't - prevail. There's some roads in my area where there's a 'major' road with cars parked down one side, and you'll have someone emerge from a 'minor' road such as a housing development entrance into the passing / oncoming traffic...
head.What is the car driver annoyed about? I can't see what they would be annoyed with a stationary vehicle waiting in a right turn lane to to turn right!. Perhaps if you had turned accross/in front of the car driver, but not be being stationary and giving the car driver priority. Bonkers.
Van driver’s action of waiting is OK, but has no priority to cross in front of the car.
Car driver should only enter hatched area if there is no alternative and it is a broken line bordering it.
Car driver should not enter hatched area if a solid line is bordering it, except in an emergency/to avoid a collision.
Parked cars should not be near the junction.
Car driver should return to near side and not jeopardise the van’s position (if van is waiting).
Car driver should only enter hatched area if there is no alternative and it is a broken line bordering it.
Car driver should not enter hatched area if a solid line is bordering it, except in an emergency/to avoid a collision.
Parked cars should not be near the junction.
Car driver should return to near side and not jeopardise the van’s position (if van is waiting).
As the van driver, I would expect one of two responses from the car driver.
1. Drive past the parked cars, return to the correct side of the road, and carry on past me - coming back out into the hatchings if there are more parked cars the other side of the junction.
2. Slow/stop prior to the junction, due to uncertainty around the size of the gap between the closest parked car and the van turning right. If they perceive that gap to be too small for the regular speed of that road they will either slow down or stop.
In scenario 1, if there isn't enough of a gap to make the turn prior to the oncoming car's arrival, you wait, they go past, you turn. Happy days.
In scenario 2, the van driver needs to make a judgement. Is the car driver slowing/stopping to allow the van to turn ahead of them, and thus clear their perceived obstruction? Or is the car driver slowing/stopping to give them more time to assess the gap, and they plan to carry on through the gap at what they perceive to be an appropriate speed? If I were the van driver, I would be looking at both the driver of the car, and the car itself for clues as to what their intentions were. But I'd always err on the side of caution, and not turn in front of them until I was certain it was safe to do so.
My guess would be that if the car driver gets irate, scenario 2 has played out, but the car and van drivers were not on the same page about the car driver's intentions. In my opinion, the van driver is absolutely not wrong for not turning ahead of the oncoming car if there was not absolute certainty.
Maybe the car driver stereotyped the van driver, and assumed they would dive into the smallest possible gap to make the turn ahead of the car, and had not planned for this not to be the case, leaving them frustrated ...
1. Drive past the parked cars, return to the correct side of the road, and carry on past me - coming back out into the hatchings if there are more parked cars the other side of the junction.
2. Slow/stop prior to the junction, due to uncertainty around the size of the gap between the closest parked car and the van turning right. If they perceive that gap to be too small for the regular speed of that road they will either slow down or stop.
In scenario 1, if there isn't enough of a gap to make the turn prior to the oncoming car's arrival, you wait, they go past, you turn. Happy days.
In scenario 2, the van driver needs to make a judgement. Is the car driver slowing/stopping to allow the van to turn ahead of them, and thus clear their perceived obstruction? Or is the car driver slowing/stopping to give them more time to assess the gap, and they plan to carry on through the gap at what they perceive to be an appropriate speed? If I were the van driver, I would be looking at both the driver of the car, and the car itself for clues as to what their intentions were. But I'd always err on the side of caution, and not turn in front of them until I was certain it was safe to do so.
My guess would be that if the car driver gets irate, scenario 2 has played out, but the car and van drivers were not on the same page about the car driver's intentions. In my opinion, the van driver is absolutely not wrong for not turning ahead of the oncoming car if there was not absolute certainty.
Maybe the car driver stereotyped the van driver, and assumed they would dive into the smallest possible gap to make the turn ahead of the car, and had not planned for this not to be the case, leaving them frustrated ...
Hypothetical scenario, van sits in the correct lane for the right turn and signalling. Waits for oncoming vehicle to do the correct thing which is return to correct side of road pass the van at which point if there is no more traffic the intention is to make the right turn.
However oncoming car stops, waits, flashes, driver gestures, whatever. Van driver decides in the cause of helping traffic to move to start to make the turn. Car driver at that moment moves and collision occurs. Who will be considered to be in the wrong for making a turn to cross the path of another vehicle? Van driver clearly.
This is a variant of another situation that irritates me. Waiting to turn right, nothing behind. Oncoming vehicles in a line. Leading vehicle stops and flashes thus holding up all the vehicles behind them. Yes they think they're being polite and helpful to me, true, but in the meantime they're holding up quite a few others. Sometimes they get very annoyed if you don't launch into a getaway driver rubber shredder. Morons. Just carry on and let others figure it out and look after themselves.
However oncoming car stops, waits, flashes, driver gestures, whatever. Van driver decides in the cause of helping traffic to move to start to make the turn. Car driver at that moment moves and collision occurs. Who will be considered to be in the wrong for making a turn to cross the path of another vehicle? Van driver clearly.
This is a variant of another situation that irritates me. Waiting to turn right, nothing behind. Oncoming vehicles in a line. Leading vehicle stops and flashes thus holding up all the vehicles behind them. Yes they think they're being polite and helpful to me, true, but in the meantime they're holding up quite a few others. Sometimes they get very annoyed if you don't launch into a getaway driver rubber shredder. Morons. Just carry on and let others figure it out and look after themselves.
FiF said:
However oncoming car stops, waits, flashes, driver gestures, whatever. Van driver decides in the cause of helping traffic to move to start to make the turn. Car driver at that moment moves and collision occurs. Who will be considered to be in the wrong for making a turn to cross the path of another vehicle? Van driver clearly.
If the oncoming driver clearly gives way but then drives into the turning van, then I would expect the oncoming driver to be at fault. This in one of the "crash for cash" methods, where a driver cedes priority, then claims that the other driver pulled out / turned across them unexpectedly.
Having good evidence is going to be key in such a situation, which is where dash cam footage would be very helpful.
NordicCrankShaft said:
smithyithy said:
Sounds / looks like the van is in lane 2 (the turning lane) on the correct side of the road, the approaching car is driving through a central hatching in order to pass a series of obstructions (parked cars), so the car should yield at some point before reaching the van..
Are there double yellows on the approach to the junction? As long as the parked cars aren't parked on them, the approaching car should have enough room to move back to their lane before reaching the van..
It's probably one of those scenarios where common sense should - but sometimes doesn't - prevail. There's some roads in my area where there's a 'major' road with cars parked down one side, and you'll have someone emerge from a 'minor' road such as a housing development entrance into the passing / oncoming traffic...
Unfortunately there are no double yellows. It's an estate that's 10 years old but the council have still yet to adopt the roads. It's shambolic really. Are there double yellows on the approach to the junction? As long as the parked cars aren't parked on them, the approaching car should have enough room to move back to their lane before reaching the van..
It's probably one of those scenarios where common sense should - but sometimes doesn't - prevail. There's some roads in my area where there's a 'major' road with cars parked down one side, and you'll have someone emerge from a 'minor' road such as a housing development entrance into the passing / oncoming traffic...
Gassing Station | Advanced Driving | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff