First time insurance for 21yo - black box, or no black box?
Discussion
I'm sure this must have been done to death somewhere on PH, but I cannot find anything - if there is a thread already running, I'd be grateful for a link.
I'm looking at quotes for my eldest on a group 3 car, 2017 reg and c. 60k miles. Having been pointed at Marmalade with full telematics as my best bet, I've now got a much cheaper quote (like, 40% cheaper) from Admiral, with no telematics. Policy in my kid's name, me and the wife named drivers, 5000mpa.
The Marmalade policy looks incredibly restrictive and requires me to have a separate policy for me in place, to do more miles than my kid in the car, etc etc, so it's totally unintuitive why it's so expensive (£2,000) vs. Admiral at £1,200.
I'm told after a year on a black box that premium can drop dramatically, but I can't see it falling my that much.
What am I missing?
I'm looking at quotes for my eldest on a group 3 car, 2017 reg and c. 60k miles. Having been pointed at Marmalade with full telematics as my best bet, I've now got a much cheaper quote (like, 40% cheaper) from Admiral, with no telematics. Policy in my kid's name, me and the wife named drivers, 5000mpa.
The Marmalade policy looks incredibly restrictive and requires me to have a separate policy for me in place, to do more miles than my kid in the car, etc etc, so it's totally unintuitive why it's so expensive (£2,000) vs. Admiral at £1,200.
I'm told after a year on a black box that premium can drop dramatically, but I can't see it falling my that much.
What am I missing?
He is taking his test in April, so I want to get a car now for him to practice in which I will insure in my name for a couple of months with him on provisonal. Looking ahead to when he's passed, I'm looking at quotes assuming he's already passed, the car was acquired today, and insurance starts in a month. Policy in his name, but me as owner/keeper/named driver
We never found Marmalade competitive. Just use the normal comparison sites.
I would be surprised if you can beat a black box policy for a new driver.
Additionally they also give you as the parent, confidence they aren't going to be stupid and wrap their car around a tree due to inexperience.
I would be surprised if you can beat a black box policy for a new driver.
Additionally they also give you as the parent, confidence they aren't going to be stupid and wrap their car around a tree due to inexperience.
I’ve just sorted out insurance for my 18yo daughter. Quotes were all over the place but Hastings came back the cheapest with a black box.
Paid about £1100 with her as driver and us as named drivers on a 2019 VW Up.
All seems fine so far couple of things have come up with her driving on the app but that’s to be expected and all in all seems to work well.
Paid about £1100 with her as driver and us as named drivers on a 2019 VW Up.
All seems fine so far couple of things have come up with her driving on the app but that’s to be expected and all in all seems to work well.
In which case assuming the Admiral quote is on that same basis ie just passed test, nothing wrong with taking that.
Fwiw all 3 of my children were Insured with Admiral ( few years ago now but think still holds true ) but from learner onwards in their name but with us as named drivers and limited mileages.
When they all passed yes the premiums obviously went up but not excessively and then as soon as they reached that first years NCB they all then got decent discounts as Admiral ignored the period they had passed their test for and just counted the time on risk from the original policy.
Fwiw all 3 of my children were Insured with Admiral ( few years ago now but think still holds true ) but from learner onwards in their name but with us as named drivers and limited mileages.
When they all passed yes the premiums obviously went up but not excessively and then as soon as they reached that first years NCB they all then got decent discounts as Admiral ignored the period they had passed their test for and just counted the time on risk from the original policy.
redrabbit said:
I'm sure this must have been done to death somewhere on PH, but I cannot find anything - if there is a thread already running, I'd be grateful for a link.
I'm looking at quotes for my eldest on a group 3 car, 2017 reg and c. 60k miles. Having been pointed at Marmalade with full telematics as my best bet, I've now got a much cheaper quote (like, 40% cheaper) from Admiral, with no telematics. Policy in my kid's name, me and the wife named drivers, 5000mpa.
The Marmalade policy looks incredibly restrictive and requires me to have a separate policy for me in place, to do more miles than my kid in the car, etc etc, so it's totally unintuitive why it's so expensive (£2,000) vs. Admiral at £1,200.
I'm told after a year on a black box that premium can drop dramatically, but I can't see it falling my that much.
What am I missing?
Just buy the Admiral policy. £1,200 is pretty good for a newly qualified young driver with zero NCD. I'm looking at quotes for my eldest on a group 3 car, 2017 reg and c. 60k miles. Having been pointed at Marmalade with full telematics as my best bet, I've now got a much cheaper quote (like, 40% cheaper) from Admiral, with no telematics. Policy in my kid's name, me and the wife named drivers, 5000mpa.
The Marmalade policy looks incredibly restrictive and requires me to have a separate policy for me in place, to do more miles than my kid in the car, etc etc, so it's totally unintuitive why it's so expensive (£2,000) vs. Admiral at £1,200.
I'm told after a year on a black box that premium can drop dramatically, but I can't see it falling my that much.
What am I missing?
superpp said:
We never found Marmalade competitive. Just use the normal comparison sites.
I would be surprised if you can beat a black box policy for a new driver.
Additionally they also give you as the parent, confidence they aren't going to be stupid and wrap their car around a tree due to inexperience.
Yep, maybe it's just Marmalade. Admiral with a box is 1,050, without a box 1,250. There are others slightly higher and slightly lower (e.g. Hastings, as another poster suggested). No idea why a company supposedly offering tailored insurance for young drivers is so off the mark....I would be surprised if you can beat a black box policy for a new driver.
Additionally they also give you as the parent, confidence they aren't going to be stupid and wrap their car around a tree due to inexperience.
My instinct is to go with telematics for the reasons you suggest above, but I've heard stories (some first hand, some probably apocryphal) about false flags (wrong way on a motorway, anyone?) and other potential downsides... but I guess I can research that separately.
Another parent who recently insured their 17 year old with Admiral.
Both the wife and I as named drivers, car owned in daughters name, insured in her name. 2014 Fiat 500 1.2. Black box. Price was around £1600 or so. We seem to get driving update emails, ranked out of 5 stars, every Tuesday evening, letting us know how she's getting on. If all good, they may remove black box at 6 month mark.
Both the wife and I as named drivers, car owned in daughters name, insured in her name. 2014 Fiat 500 1.2. Black box. Price was around £1600 or so. We seem to get driving update emails, ranked out of 5 stars, every Tuesday evening, letting us know how she's getting on. If all good, they may remove black box at 6 month mark.
My daughter also insured her Fiesta 1.25 with Admiral when she passed at 17 (with no black box, which is as well since I occasionally borrow her car). From recollection it was £1100 for the first year but went down over the next three years from £1100 to £200-£300 where it has stayed for the next 9 years even when she has moved from Sussex to London
The only oddity with Admiral is that all her policies have been for 10 months rather than 12, not sure why
The only oddity with Admiral is that all her policies have been for 10 months rather than 12, not sure why
I think after 9 years with them she'd have earned a full discount even if she moves. She's stayed with Admiral after getting a quote for changing address from rural Sussex (Band A) to London Docklands (garaged but Band E) that only increased her annual premium by £60, which rather surprised us
Whatever you decide to do please read the terms and conditions carefully.
I have two sons - the eldest was insured with a black box policy for the first year. On reading the terms and conditions at renewal they had changed them significantly and were able to cancel the policy after a single "transgression" compared to previously when it would have required 3 "warnings" first.
There were some inconsistencies in the data in that first 12 month period which could not be explained so I lost faith in the reliability of their technology. So we never bought a black box policy again.
My advice is if you can get a non-black box policy then choose it in preference to one that is black-box.
I have two sons - the eldest was insured with a black box policy for the first year. On reading the terms and conditions at renewal they had changed them significantly and were able to cancel the policy after a single "transgression" compared to previously when it would have required 3 "warnings" first.
There were some inconsistencies in the data in that first 12 month period which could not be explained so I lost faith in the reliability of their technology. So we never bought a black box policy again.
My advice is if you can get a non-black box policy then choose it in preference to one that is black-box.
rlg43p said:
Whatever you decide to do please read the terms and conditions carefully.
I have two sons - the eldest was insured with a black box policy for the first year. On reading the terms and conditions at renewal they had changed them significantly and were able to cancel the policy after a single "transgression" compared to previously when it would have required 3 "warnings" first.
There were some inconsistencies in the data in that first 12 month period which could not be explained so I lost faith in the reliability of their technology. So we never bought a black box policy again.
My advice is if you can get a non-black box policy then choose it in preference to one that is black-box.
Agree some black box insurers can be restrictive to the point of recording bad driving - quick steering, excess speed, heavy braking and then penalising you with warnings etc. or for good driving will refund some of your premium but that's rare.I have two sons - the eldest was insured with a black box policy for the first year. On reading the terms and conditions at renewal they had changed them significantly and were able to cancel the policy after a single "transgression" compared to previously when it would have required 3 "warnings" first.
There were some inconsistencies in the data in that first 12 month period which could not be explained so I lost faith in the reliability of their technology. So we never bought a black box policy again.
My advice is if you can get a non-black box policy then choose it in preference to one that is black-box.
When my daughter had the box I changed the brakes on her car and carried out a 'road test' of heavy braking. That came up on the telematics with a warning and it was something like 3 strikes and you're out. I rang them up to explain and had to email them a copy of the receipt for the parts to prove I'd done the work
When she had another black box policy she ignored any warnings and the insurer never bothered to chase up but I bet they would if there was a claim issue.
No black box = best option.
RicksAlfas said:
Hastings black box links to the youngster’s phone only, so wouldn’t pick up Dad’s test drives. It has a very fair scoring system too. Can’t knock it really.
+1 my daughter has a Hastings black box policy, cheapest quote (£1700 on a 1 litre Picanto) and no issues in 6 months.Only thing was we had to change the RK from her brother (his 'old' car) to my wifes (ie a parent), not bothered about one extra keeper on a 10+yr old runabout!
My eldest had Direct Lines 'black box' for 2yrs from passing his test, no issues, there isnt actually a black box in that they just use the youngsters phone with the Direct Line app installed to monitor.
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