F430 Coupe - What is Full Service History!
Discussion
Hi All,
I'm still looking to buy. Have investigated a number cars now and spoken to dealers/owners about their various histories.
It's an annoying but seemingly unavoidable fact that none of the cars I've looked at have 'full' histories. Many original and subsequent owners seem not to be aware of the 'annual or 6250 mile' interval...ie a service every year even if it hasn't moved! Aldous V in his great buyers guide mentions a period of storage with fluid change immediately before and immediately after is ok. But that he wouldn't buy anything with more than a two year gap outside of that situation. I'm having trouble finding one that fits that bill!
So the question is, what is reasonable? I've looked at cars that had great history until recently, where they've been at dealers for a long time, were already 2 years overdue and the dealer hasn't serviced it while he's had it...so nothing for 3-4 years. Or where the recent history is very good but original owner first serviced it three years into its life when it finally reached 6000 miles!
How important is this really? Can a car that's done a few hundred miles in four years with no service still be a good bet? Will I be able to sell it afterwards?
Important to note that I'm not in the Ferrari network here...would never spend £100k on the ones they are selling...I'm in the more £70-80k segment. I want to keep it long term and put 5000 a year mileage on it. And I will be fastidious with annual services from then on.
I know it's all very subjective...but I'm trying to see where future buyers will be when I present a car to them that, prior to my ownership, had gaps in the history. All the advice you read is that history is all important...and it's made me paranoid!
Cheers all,
J.
I'm still looking to buy. Have investigated a number cars now and spoken to dealers/owners about their various histories.
It's an annoying but seemingly unavoidable fact that none of the cars I've looked at have 'full' histories. Many original and subsequent owners seem not to be aware of the 'annual or 6250 mile' interval...ie a service every year even if it hasn't moved! Aldous V in his great buyers guide mentions a period of storage with fluid change immediately before and immediately after is ok. But that he wouldn't buy anything with more than a two year gap outside of that situation. I'm having trouble finding one that fits that bill!
So the question is, what is reasonable? I've looked at cars that had great history until recently, where they've been at dealers for a long time, were already 2 years overdue and the dealer hasn't serviced it while he's had it...so nothing for 3-4 years. Or where the recent history is very good but original owner first serviced it three years into its life when it finally reached 6000 miles!
How important is this really? Can a car that's done a few hundred miles in four years with no service still be a good bet? Will I be able to sell it afterwards?
Important to note that I'm not in the Ferrari network here...would never spend £100k on the ones they are selling...I'm in the more £70-80k segment. I want to keep it long term and put 5000 a year mileage on it. And I will be fastidious with annual services from then on.
I know it's all very subjective...but I'm trying to see where future buyers will be when I present a car to them that, prior to my ownership, had gaps in the history. All the advice you read is that history is all important...and it's made me paranoid!
Cheers all,
J.
Edited by jezzaaa on Sunday 20th April 17:16
Just like everything else the answer is: it depends - let us take the example of the 4 year no service car - if it has interim MOTs then at least it has been looked at - if you intend to keep a few months and not service then resale could be difficult BUT if you start with a full service and then sell in a few years with a regular & proper history I would not not consider that car - there are still quite a few cars whose use and service history were affected by Covid - remember lockdowns only ended 4 years ago and some folk needed time after then to get their lives together so servicing the Ferrari was not too high on their list of priorities
johnnyreggae said:
Just like everything else the answer is: it depends - let us take the example of the 4 year no service car - if it has interim MOTs then at least it has been looked at - if you intend to keep a few months and not service then resale could be difficult BUT if you start with a full service and then sell in a few years with a regular & proper history I would not not consider that car - there are still quite a few cars whose use and service history were affected by Covid - remember lockdowns only ended 4 years ago and some folk needed time after then to get their lives together so servicing the Ferrari was not too high on their list of priorities
Hi Johnny...yes you make a good point! I will factor that in...Covid seems like such a long time ago now 
I'm intending to keep it for the long haul, so the history will be solid from then on. Thanks 
Another car I've looked at (and am still considering) had a five year period of storage (with JCT600 service right before it went in) and was then recommissioned/serviced by Verdi Ferrari when it came out. It did c. 100 miles between the point it was serviced before storage and when Verdi commissioned it. Verdi's reputation doesn't seem to be great, although I don't think it was related to workshop stuff. It's another beautiful car...but this sort of worries me.
Edited by jezzaaa on Sunday 20th April 17:42
It sounds like this is really important to you. It was very important to me with my 458 - I will only ever service it with Ferrari and I am to keep mine for many years.
I’m told by Ferrari (yes, maybe this is what they think I want to hear) that there are not many 458s with FFSH…the numbers are reducing quite quickly as they age and the number of Keepers increases. Also, I’m told that there are fewer and fewer that are being properly maintained. (Again I know some might say they are telling me what I want to hear)
So I think if FFSH 458s are small in number, then 430s will be even harder to find.
I also think long term storage is a bad idea - there will be many issues to deal with. You want one that’s been driven and MOTd & serviced as often as possible.
So… I would think finding one with a full history will be hard - they are probably in long term ownership. But if you can wait until one comes up, then it sounds like you will be happier.
I’m told by Ferrari (yes, maybe this is what they think I want to hear) that there are not many 458s with FFSH…the numbers are reducing quite quickly as they age and the number of Keepers increases. Also, I’m told that there are fewer and fewer that are being properly maintained. (Again I know some might say they are telling me what I want to hear)
So I think if FFSH 458s are small in number, then 430s will be even harder to find.
I also think long term storage is a bad idea - there will be many issues to deal with. You want one that’s been driven and MOTd & serviced as often as possible.
So… I would think finding one with a full history will be hard - they are probably in long term ownership. But if you can wait until one comes up, then it sounds like you will be happier.
To keep to the terms of my 2 year guarantee which stated the F430 bought from Maranello's had to be serviced by the book
at a official Ferrari agent otherwise the guarantee would be come none-void,
Covered around 1800 miles the first year ,covered less than 500 miles the second year but had no choice to have the annual
service done costing double what the first service cost with no mechanical issue's ,just a service,
Then along came Covid ,along with life getting in the way and a 12 mile drive to where the car was stored hence only managed to clock up
less than a 100 miles in 2 1/2 years , Approximately 60 miles on my return trip from Maranello's collecting it from the service and 2 mot tests .
Nobody said you couldn't go to Sainsbury's in a Ferrari but felt i was taking the p--s living in a small community while people were dying and losing
their jobs around us,probably a little different in large towns like London where supercars are more of a common sight,
Had no problem selling the car even though it had not been serviced for that 2 1/2 years with common sense prevailing and the buyer knowing
that with only less than a 100 miles covered in between wasn't a problem for him although technically it was a year and a half overdue a service
and couldn't be advertised as a full service history car.
at a official Ferrari agent otherwise the guarantee would be come none-void,
Covered around 1800 miles the first year ,covered less than 500 miles the second year but had no choice to have the annual
service done costing double what the first service cost with no mechanical issue's ,just a service,
Then along came Covid ,along with life getting in the way and a 12 mile drive to where the car was stored hence only managed to clock up
less than a 100 miles in 2 1/2 years , Approximately 60 miles on my return trip from Maranello's collecting it from the service and 2 mot tests .
Nobody said you couldn't go to Sainsbury's in a Ferrari but felt i was taking the p--s living in a small community while people were dying and losing
their jobs around us,probably a little different in large towns like London where supercars are more of a common sight,
Had no problem selling the car even though it had not been serviced for that 2 1/2 years with common sense prevailing and the buyer knowing
that with only less than a 100 miles covered in between wasn't a problem for him although technically it was a year and a half overdue a service
and couldn't be advertised as a full service history car.
ratrod 2 said:
... although technically it was a year and a half overdue a service
and couldn't be advertised as a full service history car.
This is the rub; every car I've looked at is advertised as Full History! Despite them all being patchier than Donald Trumps morality!! The bit that makes me most paranoid is Aldous Voice's statement about the titanium conrods corroding if used engine oil is left in a car which sits for long periods. And yet there doesn't seem to be much (anecdotal or otherwise) evidence of engine failure other than for the manifold/pre-cat caused ones. I'm sure there would be more examples on t'internet if it were a problem. Has anyone heard of this happening to one of these engines?and couldn't be advertised as a full service history car.
Ta.
It sounds like this is really important to you. It was very important to me with my 458 - I will only ever service it with Ferrari and I am to keep mine for many years.
I’m told by Ferrari (yes, maybe this is what they think I want to hear) that there are not many 458s with FFSH…the numbers are reducing quite quickly as they age and the number of Keepers increases. Also, I’m told that there are fewer and fewer that are being properly maintained. (Again I know some might say they are telling me what I want to hear)
So I think if FFSH 458s are small in number, then 430s will be even harder to find.
I also think long term storage is a bad idea - there will be many issues to deal with. You want one that’s been driven and MOTd & serviced as often as possible.
So… I would think finding one with a full history will be hard - they are probably in long term ownership. But if you can wait until one comes up, then it sounds like you will be happier.
I’m told by Ferrari (yes, maybe this is what they think I want to hear) that there are not many 458s with FFSH…the numbers are reducing quite quickly as they age and the number of Keepers increases. Also, I’m told that there are fewer and fewer that are being properly maintained. (Again I know some might say they are telling me what I want to hear)
So I think if FFSH 458s are small in number, then 430s will be even harder to find.
I also think long term storage is a bad idea - there will be many issues to deal with. You want one that’s been driven and MOTd & serviced as often as possible.
So… I would think finding one with a full history will be hard - they are probably in long term ownership. But if you can wait until one comes up, then it sounds like you will be happier.
It sounds like this is really important to you. It was very important to me with my 458 - I will only ever service it with Ferrari and I am to keep mine for many years.
I’m told by Ferrari (yes, maybe this is what they think I want to hear) that there are not many 458s with FFSH…the numbers are reducing quite quickly as they age and the number of Keepers increases. Also, I’m told that there are fewer and fewer that are being properly maintained. (Again I know some might say they are telling me what I want to hear)
So I think if FFSH 458s are small in number, then 430s will be even harder to find.
I also think long term storage is a bad idea - there will be many issues to deal with. You want one that’s been driven and MOTd & serviced as often as possible.
So… I would think finding one with a full history will be hard - they are probably in long term ownership. But if you can wait until one comes up, then it sounds like you will be happier.
I’m told by Ferrari (yes, maybe this is what they think I want to hear) that there are not many 458s with FFSH…the numbers are reducing quite quickly as they age and the number of Keepers increases. Also, I’m told that there are fewer and fewer that are being properly maintained. (Again I know some might say they are telling me what I want to hear)
So I think if FFSH 458s are small in number, then 430s will be even harder to find.
I also think long term storage is a bad idea - there will be many issues to deal with. You want one that’s been driven and MOTd & serviced as often as possible.
So… I would think finding one with a full history will be hard - they are probably in long term ownership. But if you can wait until one comes up, then it sounds like you will be happier.
Virtually every Fcar I’ve bought from 70s/80/90s has been in storage at least once and done no miles sometimes for years on end - one not moving for 14 years ( in a museum ) - would I pay a huge premium for a car serviced yearly , no - current condition and a recent clean bill of health is what matters to me
POORCARDEALER said:
Virtually every Fcar I’ve bought from 70s/80/90s has been in storage at least once and done no miles sometimes for years on end - one not moving for 14 years ( in a museum ) - would I pay a huge premium for a car serviced yearly , no - current condition and a recent clean bill of health is what matters to me
Hi ya - that's interesting thanks. Ordinarily I would be the same. As I say it's only really the warnings importance of the history and potential engine corrosion that had me worried. But I think I'm over thinking it!!I sold my 360 Spider last year. It had been serviced every year from new with the first dozen being main dealer and the rest an independent Ferrari specialist, all supported by a complete folder of invoices. I don't think it made any difference to the sale price (although it was the highest priced listed) but I do think it made it easier to sell. Servicing it every year may have been more expensive but it certainly made owning it feel less of a gamble.
I’d go with that too,
My 430:was unused for a few years, not even MOT’d but was given a full service before storage and a reputable dealer, DK Engineering, recommissioned it, whom I bought it from.
It was faultless in the 10 k miles I did in it.
I took the view that it had been given a good going over, reputable dealer and I would keep for a few years and build up a new service history.
Covid scuppered that plan a bit so first year was 18 months but I gave it four services, including the big bugger at 40k miles just before sale.
I use an indie, who was a Ferrari master tech previously. It’s way cheaper and they have time to properly go over the car.
Some of the stories you hear about what actual servicing a car gets in the dealer network doesn’t provide faith in a full main dealer history.
My 458 was a one owner car and had been main dealer serviced, obviously it came with 7 years, but there was still a slightly longer gap one year, but it hadn’t been used much in that year.
But that was a few years before I bought it and had been serviced yearly since. So gave me confidence. And it’s been spot on, it needed anything in the servicing I’ve done.
Whilst an annual service is ideal I think you have to be a bit more pragmatic with cars that don’t get used much. For me lack of use is a bigger concern.
My 430:was unused for a few years, not even MOT’d but was given a full service before storage and a reputable dealer, DK Engineering, recommissioned it, whom I bought it from.
It was faultless in the 10 k miles I did in it.
I took the view that it had been given a good going over, reputable dealer and I would keep for a few years and build up a new service history.
Covid scuppered that plan a bit so first year was 18 months but I gave it four services, including the big bugger at 40k miles just before sale.
I use an indie, who was a Ferrari master tech previously. It’s way cheaper and they have time to properly go over the car.
Some of the stories you hear about what actual servicing a car gets in the dealer network doesn’t provide faith in a full main dealer history.
My 458 was a one owner car and had been main dealer serviced, obviously it came with 7 years, but there was still a slightly longer gap one year, but it hadn’t been used much in that year.
But that was a few years before I bought it and had been serviced yearly since. So gave me confidence. And it’s been spot on, it needed anything in the servicing I’ve done.
Whilst an annual service is ideal I think you have to be a bit more pragmatic with cars that don’t get used much. For me lack of use is a bigger concern.
Man this is so relatable when I was looking for a car. Yes they’re old cars now, but that’s not the point. It is soo frustrating when you think you’ve (finally) found the right spec car, only to then find it has patchy/broken history! Dunno if it’s just my OCD, but it’s a massive bugbear and dealbreaker for me.
A solid, reliable or near unbroken history definitely adds value on these cars IMO. I would pay a premium for such a car. You can mechanically and cosmetically restore a car to better than new; but you cannot restore provenance or any missing/skipped/deferred history, retrospectively.
A solid, reliable or near unbroken history definitely adds value on these cars IMO. I would pay a premium for such a car. You can mechanically and cosmetically restore a car to better than new; but you cannot restore provenance or any missing/skipped/deferred history, retrospectively.
SpecJunkie said:
Man this is so relatable when I was looking for a car. Yes they’re old cars now, but that’s not the point. It is soo frustrating when you think you’ve (finally) found the right spec car, only to then find it has patchy/broken history! Dunno if it’s just my OCD, but it’s a massive bugbear and dealbreaker for me.
A solid, reliable or near unbroken history definitely adds value on these cars IMO. I would pay a premium for such a car. You can mechanically and cosmetically restore a car to better than new; but you cannot restore provenance or any missing/skipped/deferred history, retrospectively.
Completely agree - "you cannot restore provenance". I think an annual service & MOT with either Ferrari or a known specialist would make all the difference for me - I just wouldn't buy with a patchy service history (other than over Covid). That way, you know there will be an annual condition report from the service - esp from Ferrari as they highlight **everything** they can find that's wrong!A solid, reliable or near unbroken history definitely adds value on these cars IMO. I would pay a premium for such a car. You can mechanically and cosmetically restore a car to better than new; but you cannot restore provenance or any missing/skipped/deferred history, retrospectively.
I also have mine under the Power15 warranty as it has to be highly maintained to keep the warranty valid. Again, I know the majority of people here would say its a waste of money - but I have claimed under it for a suspension failure.
There really are a group of buyers out there that will pay a premium for the most looked after cars, and you know you can sell it on quickly if you need to.
A slight aside but related. Mine had a FFSH up until the year before when I switched to a well-regarded independent as I'd lost faith in the main dealer. Background was that I'd had the car serviced at the dealer but 200 miles later took it to my indy for some suspension work and he discovered the sump bolt wasn't tightened correctly and was probably only a matter of time before it worked loose. I was not a happy bunny. Next service after that was with him and will stay like that until I sell.
andyr said:
Completely agree - "you cannot restore provenance". I think an annual service & MOT with either Ferrari or a known specialist would make all the difference for me - I just wouldn't buy with a patchy service history (other than over Covid). That way, you know there will be an annual condition report from the service - esp from Ferrari as they highlight **everything** they can find that's wrong!
I also have mine under the Power15 warranty as it has to be highly maintained to keep the warranty valid. Again, I know the majority of people here would say its a waste of money - but I have claimed under it for a suspension failure.
There really are a group of buyers out there that will pay a premium for the most looked after cars, and you know you can sell it on quickly if you need to.
Couldn’t agree more on Servicing History and Power 15 Warranty, different cars but the Black 458 & F12 & California at Autostore are used, on the dot servicing, main dealer, remaining warranty mot’s and imagine storage history. Also agree that 430’s probably very difficult to find now with that provenance. Good luck with next purchase, and target 2008 onwards car.I also have mine under the Power15 warranty as it has to be highly maintained to keep the warranty valid. Again, I know the majority of people here would say its a waste of money - but I have claimed under it for a suspension failure.
There really are a group of buyers out there that will pay a premium for the most looked after cars, and you know you can sell it on quickly if you need to.
Edited by maura on Monday 21st April 14:12
Edited by maura on Monday 21st April 17:55
Apols. Talk of F12s got me looking. Here is a prime example of this discussion - a special order F12. A one off.
And he missed out one of the free services.
https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/18203779
And he missed out one of the free services.
https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/18203779
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