Company redundancies - is this legal?
Discussion
Can a company make UK staff redundant, but then immediately fill these positions with staff in an Indian call centre?
Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
TonyRPH said:
Can a company make UK staff redundant, but then immediately fill these positions with staff in an Indian call centre?
Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
It’s completely legal.Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
In some circumstances I think it’s legal to fire people and rehire the same people on cheaper contracts.
TonyRPH said:
Can a company make UK staff redundant, but then immediately fill these positions with staff in an Indian call centre?
Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
Yes. It’s called ‘outsourcing’Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
HTH
TonyRPH said:
Can a company make UK staff redundant, but then immediately fill these positions with staff in an Indian call centre?
Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
Yes, they can do it. In its rawest and simplest form they can just make all affected redundant and outsource the work to india or wherever.Is this actually legal, given that the positions are not redundant at all, but just making way for cheaper staff in another country doing the exact same job(s).
I thought companies were not allowed to do this?
Depending on what they're actually doing, they may be able to redeploy some or all of the people involved.
Edited by Deep Thought on Saturday 24th May 19:27
Thanks for the replies.
I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
TonyRPH said:
Thanks for the replies.
I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
You originally said the role(s) were moved to an Indian Call Centre?
Can you clarify which it is?
Deep Thought said:
You originally said the role(s) were moved to an Indian Call Centre?
Can you clarify which it is?
I know of a group of people within a company whose roles were made redundant and given to an Indian call centre. (recently)
And the question I posed was based on my own personal experience several years ago, that I cited above.
So two separate incidences.
I hope that provides clarification.
In other words, my question was prompted by my own experince several years ago.
TonyRPH said:
To clarify:
I know of a group of people within a company whose roles were made redundant and given to an Indian call centre. (recently)
And the question I posed was based on my own personal experience several years ago, that I cited above.
So two separate incidences.
I hope that provides clarification.
In other words, my question was prompted by my own experince several years ago.
Gotcha.I know of a group of people within a company whose roles were made redundant and given to an Indian call centre. (recently)
And the question I posed was based on my own personal experience several years ago, that I cited above.
So two separate incidences.
I hope that provides clarification.
In other words, my question was prompted by my own experince several years ago.
So yes, the answer to your original question still stands - yes they can.
And RE: the other person. Not legal, but i've seen it done. Giving the role a different job title wouldnt cover them - they'd need to be much smarter than that about it. The person involved would have a case against them.
Best done these days via either managing them out or via a compromise agreement and pay them off.
Edited by Deep Thought on Sunday 25th May 13:43
TonyRPH said:
Thanks for the replies.
I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
Happens all the time. It’s not legal but nigh on impossible to prove.I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
TonyRPH said:
Thanks for the replies.
I was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
If it's the same role at the same location then that's not redundancy, hence them trying to make it look like the role changedI was asking, because some years ago, a company I worked for wanted rid of a particular staff member but said role was quite important.
They made the aforementioned staff member redundant, but them immediately employed someone else for the same role, but gave them a different job title to avoid any legal issues.
Perhaps our HR was misinformed.
If the role had been outsourced to India then it would be redundancy.
The statutory definition of redundancy is found in section 139 of the Employment Rights Act 1996 which states:
"For the purposes of this Act an employee who is dismissed shall be taken to be dismissed by reason of redundancy if the dismissal is wholly or mainly attributable to-
(a) the fact that his employer has ceased or intends to cease-
(i) to carry on the business for the purposes of which the employee was employed by him, or
(ii) to carry on that business in the place where the employee was so employed, or
(b) the fact that the requirements of that business-
(i) for employees to carry out work of a particular kind, or
(ii) for employees to carry out work of a particular kind in the place where the employee was employed by the employer, have ceased or diminished or are expected to cease or diminish."
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