Vented discs and quad piston callipers experience?
Discussion
Evening all,
Excited to say I’ve just put my name down for one of the new Sigma Caterhams
They come as standard with vented discs and quad piston callipers, as well as an updated master cylinder. Can anyone who’s had experience of the standard setup vs the above comment on the differences? I’ve read lots of people saying they’re completely unnecessary and just add unsprung weight. If that’s the case, why are they ever used / marketed as being desirable?
Thanks,
Tim
Excited to say I’ve just put my name down for one of the new Sigma Caterhams
They come as standard with vented discs and quad piston callipers, as well as an updated master cylinder. Can anyone who’s had experience of the standard setup vs the above comment on the differences? I’ve read lots of people saying they’re completely unnecessary and just add unsprung weight. If that’s the case, why are they ever used / marketed as being desirable?
Thanks,
Tim
Well done on the choice, they look great.
For the front brakes, the "big fronts" are the norm really. Whether they are needed or not it's another question. For normal road driving almost certainly not, but there is lots about that car that is not "needed". The extra bhp is certainly not needed.
But as an overall package it looks great and I'd certainly not think of down speccing it.
For the front brakes, the "big fronts" are the norm really. Whether they are needed or not it's another question. For normal road driving almost certainly not, but there is lots about that car that is not "needed". The extra bhp is certainly not needed.
But as an overall package it looks great and I'd certainly not think of down speccing it.
Never used the 'stadard' setup, but I can tell you lots of people complain of a spongy brake feel, particulary on track with the standard master cylinder, and end up upgrading it.
The 4-pots are brilliant on trackdays to be honest, they always feel solid. I suspect the feel of the setup will win a lot over.
The 4-pots are brilliant on trackdays to be honest, they always feel solid. I suspect the feel of the setup will win a lot over.
timrw81 said:
I ve read lots of people saying they re completely unnecessary and just add unsprung weight. If that s the case, why are they ever used / marketed as being desirable?
A lot of "big brake" stuff is appearance and bravado, especially where a very light car like the Caterham is involved.Are bigger brakes potentially more powerful? Yes.
Do you need more powerful brakes? That's a completely different question.
Panamax said:
A lot of "big brake" stuff is appearance and bravado, especially where a very light car like the Caterham is involved.
Are bigger brakes potentially more powerful? Yes.
Do you need more powerful brakes? That's a completely different question.
They're only of benefit on a Caterham for any difference in feel/modulation they provide. Not necessary for cooling on the font. Are bigger brakes potentially more powerful? Yes.
Do you need more powerful brakes? That's a completely different question.
The rear brakes on the other hand are a problem - nowhere for the heat to go.
Thanks for the replies. Bert, the only reason I’d ‘down-spec’ is that I want it to go in a diet before it leaves the factory, not after. Don’t think 500kg is on the cards but 520 would be nice. To that end, windscreen and weather gear will be ditched, as will wiper motor. But such things are for another thread.
timrw81 said:
Thanks for the replies. Bert, the only reason I d down-spec is that I want it to go in a diet before it leaves the factory, not after. Don t think 500kg is on the cards but 520 would be nice. To that end, windscreen and weather gear will be ditched, as will wiper motor. But such things are for another thread.
Fair enough and understood.framerateuk said:
Never used the 'stadard' setup, but I can tell you lots of people complain of a spongy brake feel, particulary on track with the standard master cylinder, and end up upgrading it.
The 4-pots are brilliant on trackdays to be honest, they always feel solid. I suspect the feel of the setup will win a lot over.
I've used the standard fronts (on track) and they are fine for track days. I had spongy feel which was completely banished by change of pedal to the high ratio one. Is that the right way round? The one with less travel that you have to push harder The 4-pots are brilliant on trackdays to be honest, they always feel solid. I suspect the feel of the setup will win a lot over.
BertBert said:
I've used the standard fronts (on track) and they are fine for track days. I had spongy feel which was completely banished by change of pedal to the high ratio one. Is that the right way round? The one with less travel that you have to push harder
Makes sense to me!My car had a really strange setup, someone had used a short/high effort pedal for the clutch.
I always felt it was a little heavy (especially when people have said the sigma has a light clutch). When i got an upgraded clutch and flywheel, I could hardly press the pedal (no joke, I actually had sore ankles driving back from the garage!). Switched the pedal for the 'correct' one, and it feels the same as before.
I can well imagine that changing the brake pedal would make a big difference!
Before I ordered my 420 I got a rental weekend in an S3 Sigma car. Within 10 minutes of driving the car I knew the car really needed the wide body; lowered Floors; and the easiest decision were the uprated front brakes. You want the car to stop as fast at it goes off the line. They also took off the price of the rental off of the price of the car, but I have no idea if that is still a thing.
To present an alternative view. Although I have no experience of the four pot front brakes, I’ve spent a lot of time fettling my standard two pot set up & the result is the best brakes I’ve ever experienced on a car, by some margin.
I also have the uprated master cylinder & like BertBert, I fitted the ‘high effort’ pedal, which shortens the pedal travel by quite a bit, improves the feel & makes heel & toe a lot easier. I added flexible hoses along the dedion tube for more efficient bleeding of the rear calipers, uprated pads (Ferodo DS3000 front, DS2500 rear) & finally good quality fluid (Castrol React SRF).
A couple of years ago, I went for a drive, following a friend in his Cayman GT4. The one area where my Seven stood head & shoulders above the GT4 was braking. The Porsche’s brakes seemed comically bad by comparison.
I also have the uprated master cylinder & like BertBert, I fitted the ‘high effort’ pedal, which shortens the pedal travel by quite a bit, improves the feel & makes heel & toe a lot easier. I added flexible hoses along the dedion tube for more efficient bleeding of the rear calipers, uprated pads (Ferodo DS3000 front, DS2500 rear) & finally good quality fluid (Castrol React SRF).
A couple of years ago, I went for a drive, following a friend in his Cayman GT4. The one area where my Seven stood head & shoulders above the GT4 was braking. The Porsche’s brakes seemed comically bad by comparison.
In my opinion they give a bit more feel and control when at the limit. As to unsprung weight, the 4 pot caliper is lighter than the old style triumph cast iron jobby, but the vented disc is a bit heavier + rotating mass. I couldnt feel one jot of difference as far as that goes.
As far as build options go, big brakes are an easy later upgrade while lightweight flywheel and limited slip diff are better to have from the get-go. Adding later adds significant labor costs.
Have fun enjoying the anticipation!
As far as build options go, big brakes are an easy later upgrade while lightweight flywheel and limited slip diff are better to have from the get-go. Adding later adds significant labor costs.
Have fun enjoying the anticipation!
In my opinion they give a bit more feel and control when at the limit. As to unsprung weight, the 4 pot caliper is lighter than the old style triumph cast iron jobby, but the vented disc is a bit heavier + rotating mass. I couldnt feel one jot of difference as far as that goes.
As far as build options go, big brakes are an easy later upgrade while lightweight flywheel and limited slip diff are better to have from the get-go. Adding later adds significant labor costs.
Have fun enjoying the anticipation!
As far as build options go, big brakes are an easy later upgrade while lightweight flywheel and limited slip diff are better to have from the get-go. Adding later adds significant labor costs.
Have fun enjoying the anticipation!
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