Is UK society about to implode?
Discussion
OK I am being a bit dramatic (and in a way just adding to the issue I am complaining about below).
It seems since Covid the UK has felt increasingly negative.
The two things that seem to be the issue are cost of living (especially housing) and immigration.
If you go onto the news media, YouTube or other major forums it seems like these are concerns everyone has and it feels like things are simmering.
I've recently been looking at moving abroad temporarily (not because I hate the UK but because I want a new experience for a few months) and it did occur to me the UK is bloody expensive if you were coming here as an outsider.
I wonder though is this just a case of echo chamber/bubble of being exposed to a few sources or whether everyone is feeling the same. Is this going to lead to anything real happening?
I also try to remind myself that we are extremely lucky to be able to live here and most of us can move abroad (whether we want to or not).
On top of all of this I've also become a bit disillusioned about life in general (mid life crisis) so the negativity is probably only exacerbating that.
The UK certainly doesn't feel like what it did pre 2020 and maybe it will never get better.
Do we just suck it and carry on or what?
I think what I want to hear from others is that they are having the time of their lives and loving it. Give us some positivity.
It seems since Covid the UK has felt increasingly negative.
The two things that seem to be the issue are cost of living (especially housing) and immigration.
If you go onto the news media, YouTube or other major forums it seems like these are concerns everyone has and it feels like things are simmering.
I've recently been looking at moving abroad temporarily (not because I hate the UK but because I want a new experience for a few months) and it did occur to me the UK is bloody expensive if you were coming here as an outsider.
I wonder though is this just a case of echo chamber/bubble of being exposed to a few sources or whether everyone is feeling the same. Is this going to lead to anything real happening?
I also try to remind myself that we are extremely lucky to be able to live here and most of us can move abroad (whether we want to or not).
On top of all of this I've also become a bit disillusioned about life in general (mid life crisis) so the negativity is probably only exacerbating that.
The UK certainly doesn't feel like what it did pre 2020 and maybe it will never get better.
Do we just suck it and carry on or what?
I think what I want to hear from others is that they are having the time of their lives and loving it. Give us some positivity.
A mix of everything IMO.....
The world is in a worse place than it was a few years ago - Trump, Ukraine, Gaza, climate change etc are not "cheery" news stories to be reading about every day.
The UK isn't really working as it should do - low economic growth, higher taxes, Brexit and Covid still hang over the country. There seems to be inertia due to regulation which the government is struggling to break out of. The country hasn't really recovered since the 2008 crash and the austerity which followed. A huge amount of our tax take goes on paying interest on Government borrowing - from memory more than the Police, courts, fire service and army combined, or just under 10% of all tax taken. When people ask why are taxes going up but services not, then that is a big reason why.
Populism is clearly on the rise again, with Trump, Reform, etc promising easy answers to difficult questions. Instead of feeding hope they feed fear, and keep pushing negative things to the fore claiming they can provide solutions.
I don't think a rolling 24/7 news cycle is very helpful - something which would have been a page 4 or 5 news article in a once-a-day paper is now 10 mins of news, every hour. Everything demands a response in real time. Once you add algorithms to this (and it's been proved that negative stories create more engagement than positive stories), then you get into a cycle of negative news and negative information.
That said, all is not bad with the world. There are loads of good news stories out there, and despite all the problems with the UK, objectively we are still unbelievably lucky to live where we do. The average salary across the world is £1000/m, and just under 10% of the world's population (700m people!) live on less than $2/day. We have security and safety, and we offer access to food and housing for the poor. Having lived abroad, there is no utopia - everywhere has taxes and everywhere has it's own issues.
The world is in a worse place than it was a few years ago - Trump, Ukraine, Gaza, climate change etc are not "cheery" news stories to be reading about every day.
The UK isn't really working as it should do - low economic growth, higher taxes, Brexit and Covid still hang over the country. There seems to be inertia due to regulation which the government is struggling to break out of. The country hasn't really recovered since the 2008 crash and the austerity which followed. A huge amount of our tax take goes on paying interest on Government borrowing - from memory more than the Police, courts, fire service and army combined, or just under 10% of all tax taken. When people ask why are taxes going up but services not, then that is a big reason why.
Populism is clearly on the rise again, with Trump, Reform, etc promising easy answers to difficult questions. Instead of feeding hope they feed fear, and keep pushing negative things to the fore claiming they can provide solutions.
I don't think a rolling 24/7 news cycle is very helpful - something which would have been a page 4 or 5 news article in a once-a-day paper is now 10 mins of news, every hour. Everything demands a response in real time. Once you add algorithms to this (and it's been proved that negative stories create more engagement than positive stories), then you get into a cycle of negative news and negative information.
That said, all is not bad with the world. There are loads of good news stories out there, and despite all the problems with the UK, objectively we are still unbelievably lucky to live where we do. The average salary across the world is £1000/m, and just under 10% of the world's population (700m people!) live on less than $2/day. We have security and safety, and we offer access to food and housing for the poor. Having lived abroad, there is no utopia - everywhere has taxes and everywhere has it's own issues.
Edited by Condi on Sunday 3rd August 16:03
It's been coming since the GFC IMO. We're just running out of street to kick the can down so anyone who didn't bag some assets is screwed and many of those who did will be in the future crosshairs.
No democratically elected politician is going to run on a platform of the future getting worse (see May trying to address future care of the elderly) so they'll either make promises they can't keep or find scapegoats.
Going after the truly rich is nigh on impossible due to their transnational or corporate nature. Long term investments win't pay off in a political cycle and will be robbed for more pressing issues.
It's basically going to suck until the population pyramid inverts. I wonder how the Koreans are planning for it?
No democratically elected politician is going to run on a platform of the future getting worse (see May trying to address future care of the elderly) so they'll either make promises they can't keep or find scapegoats.
Going after the truly rich is nigh on impossible due to their transnational or corporate nature. Long term investments win't pay off in a political cycle and will be robbed for more pressing issues.
It's basically going to suck until the population pyramid inverts. I wonder how the Koreans are planning for it?
Edited by glazbagun on Sunday 3rd August 16:05
You want a positive story...life for our family is great!
I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
Mojooo said:
The UK certainly doesn't feel like what it did pre 2020 and maybe it will never get better.
Do we just suck it and carry on or what?
I think what I want to hear from others is that they are having the time of their lives and loving it. Give us some positivity.
I would type in a response about the UK situation but I need to get back to the cheap lager and women wearing very little poolside. Do we just suck it and carry on or what?
I think what I want to hear from others is that they are having the time of their lives and loving it. Give us some positivity.
Love from Spain.
200bhp said:
You want a positive story...life for our family is great!
I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
For a moment I thought you were going to say you lived in my village except the GP thing although I have seen them the same day with the kids. I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
It’s not that bad in all areas of the UK but nobody is going to publish a story like this.
Carl_VivaEspana said:
I would type in a response about the UK situation but I need to get back to the cheap lager and women wearing very little poolside.
Hmmm, a comma would help our understanding.I need to get back to the cheap lager and women, wearing very little poolside.
or
I need to get back to the cheap lager, and women wearing very little poolside.
200bhp said:
You want a positive story...life for our family is great!
I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
Pretty much all that matches what we have here in Wiltshire. I had a next-day GP appointment in 2019 and 4 days later was diagnosed and on chemo. Kids get the bus to and from school independently. Admittedly my car was stolen from outside the house but it’s hardly crime central. I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
Nonetheless I agree the UK is on a downward trajectory. The job market is a horror show right now, no one is investing and after a decade of earning well I’m facing into 40% pay cut right now. Our benefits system is unaffordable and our ability to get diagnosed with increasingly crazy numbers of conditions keeps increasing.
I would encourage my kids to get out at their first opportunity. Sadly the voting madness of short-sighted cretins has scuppered a big part of that.
Mojooo said:
OK I am being a bit dramatic (and in a way just adding to the issue I am complaining about below).
It seems since Covid the UK has felt increasingly negative.
The two things that seem to be the issue are cost of living (especially housing) and immigration.
If you go onto the news media, YouTube or other major forums it seems like these are concerns everyone has and it feels like things are simmering.
I've recently been looking at moving abroad temporarily (not because I hate the UK but because I want a new experience for a few months) and it did occur to me the UK is bloody expensive if you were coming here as an outsider.
I wonder though is this just a case of echo chamber/bubble of being exposed to a few sources or whether everyone is feeling the same. Is this going to lead to anything real happening?
I also try to remind myself that we are extremely lucky to be able to live here and most of us can move abroad (whether we want to or not).
On top of all of this I've also become a bit disillusioned about life in general (mid life crisis) so the negativity is probably only exacerbating that.
The UK certainly doesn't feel like what it did pre 2020 and maybe it will never get better.
Do we just suck it and carry on or what?
I think what I want to hear from others is that they are having the time of their lives and loving it. Give us some positivity.
I think taking your news from forums and YouTube - other social media as well? - means that you're receiving info that the algorithms think you'll read because you read similar material. Read something about how down everyone is? They'll give you more. It's what they do.It seems since Covid the UK has felt increasingly negative.
The two things that seem to be the issue are cost of living (especially housing) and immigration.
If you go onto the news media, YouTube or other major forums it seems like these are concerns everyone has and it feels like things are simmering.
I've recently been looking at moving abroad temporarily (not because I hate the UK but because I want a new experience for a few months) and it did occur to me the UK is bloody expensive if you were coming here as an outsider.
I wonder though is this just a case of echo chamber/bubble of being exposed to a few sources or whether everyone is feeling the same. Is this going to lead to anything real happening?
I also try to remind myself that we are extremely lucky to be able to live here and most of us can move abroad (whether we want to or not).
On top of all of this I've also become a bit disillusioned about life in general (mid life crisis) so the negativity is probably only exacerbating that.
The UK certainly doesn't feel like what it did pre 2020 and maybe it will never get better.
Do we just suck it and carry on or what?
I think what I want to hear from others is that they are having the time of their lives and loving it. Give us some positivity.
How about friends, relatives, family? How do they feel?
Politics has always been a negative subject. I say always, but in my first 20-odd years there was, more or less, consensus politics. Then came Thatcher, mass unemployment and the start of the increasing gap between the rich and poor as a policy of governments. It's become very divisive. Only concentrate on politics every now and again, and in the meantime, take up a hobby. Or two. Get a dog and go for walks in green areas. Can't afford a dog? Go for walks in greener areas.
Work out what you can change in your own life to improve it, and do so.
On a personal note, I was chasing promotion. I then took a close look at most of those who were being promoted, what it did to their lives, and their general manner, and stayed where I was. I worked fewer hours than those above me, and then I cut my hours to my contracted ones in the main. No one gave a damn. Instead of taking work home all the time (although I did later) if it didn't get done at work, it didn't get done. My next but one boss, frantic to put up a good show, dumped jobs on me. When I'd had enough, the next time I asked him which of the previous ones he wanted me to ignore. He said, 'You're one of those, eh.' There were more like me! I found some, and they were all happy in their job. They were mostly happy at home.
Only push yourself for things you really want. If you find yourself browsing through Amazon, ask yourself why. Most of the time, I found, it was for something that others said was better; better than the stuff I was happy enough with.
No one seemed to mind me not doing as much work, not having the latest bike or camera. Not going somewhere exotic for holidays.
A neighbour gets wound up about immigrants, 'boat people' in particular. What can he do about them? Post on line I suppose.
Look around. There's lots of really pleasant people near you. Join a club. I met with plane spotters when I worked at Gatwick. Most of my colleagues took the mickey out of them. I found them pleasant to chat to, self deprecating, funny and they knew what they liked. I'm not suggesting you go plane spotting, god, no! but find something you like, or want to try, and join a club for like-minded people. A friend goes bowling. Had never tried it before, gave it a go, and loves it. (Talks about it a lot as well.) He's happy with his hobby.
Anything's better than believing it's all gone rat-droppings.
Indeed, to borrow from my Dad, in the face of bad economic news.
Tomorrow the sun will still rise, the world will continue, the sky isn't falling. I just switch off and take the dog out when the negativity gets too much. There are a lot of people making a living on spreading bad news.
Gargamel said:
Indeed, to borrow from my Dad, in the face of bad economic news.
Tomorrow the sun will still rise, the world will continue, the sky isn't falling. I just switch off and take the dog out when the negativity gets too much. There are a lot of people making a living on spreading bad news.
Totally agree with that. Tomorrow the sun will still rise, the world will continue, the sky isn't falling. I just switch off and take the dog out when the negativity gets too much. There are a lot of people making a living on spreading bad news.
200bhp said:
You want a positive story...life for our family is great!
I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
Op mentions "cost of living (especially housing)" - how is that going in Australia?I have a job I love that I've been in for nearly 15 years and business is going well (manufacturing specialist machinery), have a small business I run as a hobby that's also booming (manufacturing 4WD vehicle accessories), we've got two primary shcool aged kids who go to a great school, have great friends and dont have to worry about a madman gunning them down in the classroom. They can safely walk to and from school every day.
I can leave tools in my vehicle on the driveway overnight, knowing they wont get stolen - I recently left a laptop and camera on the passenger seat of my car in a shopping centre car park returning two hours later to find them still there. My wife can go for a walk around the neighbourhood any time of day or night without looking over her shoulder all the time and the worst thing that happened in the neighbourhood recently was that the council sprayed the weeds on a roundabout whilst someone was walking their dog (according to the local facebook group).
My wife recently had a health scare (GP suspected colon cancer). My wife had a colonoscopy within a week. The day before the procedure they called and asked if she'd like them to do a endoscopy whilst they were at it. She had both done and was in and out in a few hours - Luckily no cancer found.
We can get a GP appointment the same day we call, normally with our regular GP. If we dont mind seeing another GP we can often get an appointment within a few hours.
Did I mention we moved from Staffordshire to Western Australia nearly 15 years ago?
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