Highway Code 129 and bikers
Highway Code 129 and bikers
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Discussion

Wilf Hodgson

Original Poster:

2 posts

1 month

Thursday 21st August
quotequote all
This seems very straightforward but I have a query over "must not cross or straddle". With the absence of any other wording, is this to be interpreted by purely meaning tyres on the road surface and the solid white line paint? I have an IAM interpretation which maintains this applies to any part of you or your vehicle. So if you have door mirror extensions for towing your caravan, panniers or handle bars on a motorcycle or even if you do an arm signal to legally cross a solid white line to turn right into a junction, are you breaking the law by breaking the vertical plane of a solid white line on the road?
Anyone any experience of this or know where there is detailed, hopefully legal, written information on this matter, please?

bogie

16,799 posts

289 months

Thursday 21st August
quotequote all
From the rule Straddling = "This means driving with one or more wheels on or over the line, which is also prohibited. "

Ive always gone with keep wheels inside the line to be legal, not body/handlebars etc although its obviously a good idea to keep well inside on blind bends where you may meet oncoming vehicles close to/over the white lines.

Ive passed RoSPA Gold and dont remember any more discussion than above. I can remember filtering inside double white lines during assessment as there was space to do so and my bars may have been over the line occasionally.

Rick448

1,706 posts

241 months

Thursday 21st August
quotequote all
bogie said:
From the rule Straddling = "This means driving with one or more wheels on or over the line, which is also prohibited. "

Ive always gone with keep wheels inside the line to be legal, not body/handlebars etc although its obviously a good idea to keep well inside on blind bends where you may meet oncoming vehicles close to/over the white lines.

Ive passed RoSPA Gold and dont remember any more discussion than above. I can remember filtering inside double white lines during assessment as there was space to do so and my bars may have been over the line occasionally.
That would be my assessment too.

Wilf Hodgson

Original Poster:

2 posts

1 month

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
Thanks for those who took the trouble to reply to my query. I now have detailed information from a trusted and respected official of the IAM who has sent me this which does support their guidance whereby no part of your bike or car should "overhang" a solid white line - its not just the tyres on the paint!

Traffic Signs General Directions 2016 Part 7 paragraph 9(1)(b) is where you find the directive. The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016



The wording of note is:



9.—(1) The requirements conveyed to vehicular traffic on roads by a road marking provided for at items 23 and 24 of the sign table in Part 6 of this Schedule are that—

(a)subject to sub-paragraphs (2) to (4), no vehicle is to stop on any length of road along which the marking has been placed at any point between the ends of the marking; and

(b)subject to sub-paragraph (5), every vehicle proceeding on any length of road along which the marking has been so placed, as viewed in the direction of travel of the vehicle, a continuous line is on the left of a broken line or of another continuous line, must be so driven as to keep the first-mentioned continuous line on the right hand or off side of the vehicle.



Thus ‘the vehicle’ must be to the left of the solid white line. The vehicle is ‘the vehicle’ in its entirety

Starfighter

5,294 posts

195 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
The whole point is to keep you on your side of the road. If someone does the same coming the other way then there would be a collision. Keep to your side in full.

IAM observer / RoADA Diploma

black-k1

12,510 posts

246 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
This is one that, despite "strong statements of opinion" there is no clear legal answer to. Ride with your wheels to the left of the line and I'd bet the farm you couldn't be prosecuted for crossing the line. However, it may become a contributing factor for without due care if there are other issues.

Birky_41

4,441 posts

201 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
Do a wheelie and then it'll only be 1 wheel touching the line


Orchardab

643 posts

143 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
I think this was touched on a while back on a 44 teeth video.

You can cross the line if the road is clear to pass a stationary vehicle.
Could that translate to a line of stationary vehicles?

outnumbered

4,641 posts

251 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
Orchardab said:
I think this was touched on a while back on a 44 teeth video.

You can cross the line if the road is clear to pass a stationary vehicle.
Could that translate to a line of stationary vehicles?
No. I believe there is some actual case law that confirms that vehicles that are, for example, not moving in a queue, don't count as "stationary vehicles" for the purposes of this rule.

This makes sense if you think about it, as otherwise any car could also just decide to overtake the queue because it's "stationary".



Orchardab

643 posts

143 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
outnumbered said:
Orchardab said:
I think this was touched on a while back on a 44 teeth video.

You can cross the line if the road is clear to pass a stationary vehicle.
Could that translate to a line of stationary vehicles?
No. I believe there is some actual case law that confirms that vehicles that are, for example, not moving in a queue, don't count as "stationary vehicles" for the purposes of this rule.

This makes sense if you think about it, as otherwise any car could also just decide to overtake the queue because it's "stationary".
I’m sure the legal guy on 44Teeth said it had not been tested in court. (I’ll have to re watch the episode)

If you passed each stationary vehicle individually, would that be ok?

Edited by Orchardab on Saturday 23 August 13:15

outnumbered

4,641 posts

251 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
Orchardab said:
I’m sure the legal guy on 44Teeth said it had not been tested in court. (I’ll have to re watch the episode)

If you passed each stationary vehicle individually, would that be ok?

Edited by Orchardab on Saturday 23 August 13:15
I went and rechecked my reference and you're right, there isn't case law on it.


Orchardab

643 posts

143 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
outnumbered said:
Orchardab said:
I’m sure the legal guy on 44Teeth said it had not been tested in court. (I’ll have to re watch the episode)

If you passed each stationary vehicle individually, would that be ok?

Edited by Orchardab on Saturday 23 August 13:15
I went and rechecked my reference and you're right, there isn't case law on it.
So if I was to do it….. and get pulled up, it will be a cap in hand asking for forgiveness for interpreting the guidance on the gov website incorrectly!

Austin Prefect

1,109 posts

9 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
outnumbered said:
No. I believe there is some actual case law that confirms that vehicles that are, for example, not moving in a queue, don't count as "stationary vehicles" for the purposes of this rule.

This makes sense if you think about it, as otherwise any car could also just decide to overtake the queue because it's "stationary".
It makes no sense at all. You are overtaking a stationary vehicle, stationary means not moving. An example give to me on a Bikesafe course was of a 100 yard queue of traffic waiting at a level crossing, the barriers are closed in this scenario so nobody is coming the other way. The recommendation from the police inspector running the course was that you cross the solid line and ride up to the front of the queue.

Of course a car can cross a solid line to overtake as well, though getting back into the traffic stream might be tricky there's no law against crossing the line in that situation.

scorcher

4,062 posts

251 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
If the ‘overhanging’ rule is a thing then pretty much every lorry/coach/ bus etc would break it at some point.
Best thing to do on a bike is start your overtake before the solid white line starts and come back into your lane after it’s finished thus you haven’t crossed or straddled it wink;)

66mpg

685 posts

124 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
I think that the most likely time to be guilty of overhanging the line is when you have moved to the right in an attempt to improve the view into a left hand bend. This carries some risk if someone coming the other way is trying to straighten their right hand bend.

With respect to passing stationary traffic at a railway level crossing, a friend told me that he was waiting at a level crossing with other vehicles behind him. His mate drove past the queue and waited on the wrong side of the road at the barriers. He knew that the right hand barriers lifted first. He drove around them as they went up and was gone whilst everyone else had to wait for the barriers in front of them to lift. Not recommended.

CHLEMCBC

823 posts

34 months

Saturday 23rd August
quotequote all
66mpg said:
I think that the most likely time to be guilty of overhanging the line is when you have moved to the right in an attempt to improve the view into a left hand bend. This carries some risk if someone coming the other way is trying to straighten their right hand bend.

With respect to passing stationary traffic at a railway level crossing, a friend told me that he was waiting at a level crossing with other vehicles behind him. His mate drove past the queue and waited on the wrong side of the road at the barriers. He knew that the right hand barriers lifted first. He drove around them as they went up and was gone whilst everyone else had to wait for the barriers in front of them to lift. Not recommended.
He was lucky the crossing didn't have CCTV or that it wasn't spotted.