MAX RPM
Author
Discussion

wantalotus

Original Poster:

386 posts

274 months

Tuesday 4th October 2005
quotequote all
just wondering guys, what it the max RPM of the 111R, just seen the print out from my next ride, and it shows 8671, coolant 83 but I pulled my old one from 1st service of old car and the max rpm was 8238 at 87 deg. Not overly worried at moment, but 500 rpm does appear a big difference. The rev limiter is not reset after 1st service is it?

beachbum

2,610 posts

262 months

Tuesday 4th October 2005
quotequote all
If memory serves its supposed to be 8500max, with constant being 8000

MJK 24

5,679 posts

267 months

Tuesday 4th October 2005
quotequote all
I think the limiter is set at 8,500rpm. If its gone over you must have mechanically over reved it. ie you've changed down into 2nd for example too soon and the engine has over reved.

gooby

9,269 posts

265 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
the rev limit is 8500. If you bounce it of the limit then it will adjust the limit to just over 8000 for about 2 mins. Peak power is at 7800 when the change light comes on.

beachbum

2,610 posts

262 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
Listen to Gooby, he knows all about rev limits, first hand

gooby

9,269 posts

265 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
wantalotus said:
just wondering guys, what it the max RPM of the 111R, just seen the print out from my next ride, and it shows 8671, coolant 83 but I pulled my old one from 1st service of old car and the max rpm was 8238 at 87 deg. Not overly worried at moment, but 500 rpm does appear a big difference. The rev limiter is not reset after 1st service is it?


That readout would indicate a "buzz". Be Very careful. There is talk of a few cars in the states that have suffered BIG problems due to a buzz that small.

Buzzing these engines is VERY BAD. Dont do it.

chris_n

1,232 posts

289 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
I thought max revs was 8350 rpm for the Toyota engine.

beachbum

2,610 posts

262 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
The owners manual says 8000 constant, 8500 transient.

I'm guessing each engine/limiter, will a degree of slack in those figures, but not much

wantalotus

Original Poster:

386 posts

274 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
well, thats opened a can of worms. 4 out of the 5 max rpms are in excess of 8700, I cannot see it being buzzed 4 times, so that raises the question how accurate are the rev limiters, and if it is capable of achieving these 'high' rpm in normal operating conditions what would Lotus' approach be should engine failure occur at some point in the future. This may well affect some people here if the limiters are inaccurate and we are exceeding 8500 rpm via the throttle not the gearbox. Any input by people in the know would be most welcome.

MJK 24

5,679 posts

267 months

Wednesday 5th October 2005
quotequote all
I would have expected that if the engine has been damaged, or later appears to be damaged, and you've not mechanically over reved it then the responsibility lies with Lotus.

If their limiters are not cutting in at xxxx rpm then that's down to them and not you.

I wouldn't worry too much - sounds like you've done nothing that all other 111r / Exige owners do all the time.

gooby

9,269 posts

265 months

Thursday 6th October 2005
quotequote all
um ... no. Not any more. I learnt the hard way. I used to over rev. Not any more. Dont over rev, when that change light comes on, then change.

If I had that many over limit readings I would have the issue checked by your dealer ASAP! If you can proove that it is the fault of the limiter then you are very lucky. I would bet that you are not that lucky.

The limiter is relativly simple in operation, it simply stops the ignition signal when you go over 8500 and subsequently 8000 revs. In a buzz, this flushes un-burnt fuel into the exhaust. At worst this will force the engine management to shut down into safe mode untill the ECU is reset or over repeated occasions it will screw the cat and lambda sensor. Huge bill. If you are very unlucky the big ends will go, taking with it the main engine bearings and a couple of con rods.

You go over the rev limit, it is most definately your problem. Lotus have the figures from the download and they are exempt from responsibility.

New engine circa £5k. My rebuild £5.5k. When the guys got into the engine as there was far more damage than expected.

wantalotus

Original Poster:

386 posts

274 months

Thursday 6th October 2005
quotequote all
I know I am splitting hairs here, but its a big investment, a used lotus. I have a reply from somebody concerned that up to 9000 is not too bad, but over that is BAD. As mine are 8752, 8748 I feel quite happy, also I have a dated ECU print out showing that the over revs took place before ownership.
Well, you have to take some risks dont you, thats why we have 150mph sports cars!!!!!

gooby

9,269 posts

265 months

Friday 7th October 2005
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wantalotus said:
I know I am splitting hairs here, but its a big investment, a used lotus. I have a reply from somebody concerned that up to 9000 is not too bad, but over that is BAD. As mine are 8752, 8748 I feel quite happy, also I have a dated ECU print out showing that the over revs took place before ownership.
Well, you have to take some risks dont you, thats why we have 150mph sports cars!!!!!


Coffee hits screen...

Phil-CH

1,132 posts

295 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2006
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Sorry for reviving such an old topic, but I do have a few questions about max rpm and over reving.

From what I gather: The maximum rev limit of the Toyota Engine is normally 8000 rpm, but it allows up to 8500 rpm in lower gears, right?

Anyway, is it okay, when accelerating in 1st gear to let the engine rev up to 8500 rpm (until basically the rev-limiter sets in) and then change into 2nd? The reason why I'm asking is because from 1st -> 2nd gear at ~8000 rpm, the rev drops below the cam-switchover point and loses a bit of steam.

On the other hand, if reving it to 8500 is not good at all (Though it isn't directly buzzing, but I'm a bit concerned having read Gooby's posts above), it's something that probably shouldn't be done at all?

fish

4,064 posts

313 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2006
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You should always be changing gears before the rev limiter. It is very bad practice to hit the limiter.

hbaumhardt

950 posts

310 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2006
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if you have a change up light, do what it suggests ?

wantalotus

Original Poster:

386 posts

274 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2006
quotequote all
here we are some time later, just had A service done with no problems, have attended a Walshy day last month, and a bit of spitited driving locally since this topic was first posted. The top 5 max revs are still the same, so obviously the rev limiter is set below these figures, as I have seen the red change light several times, 2nd and 3rd gears. The over revs MUST have been caused by incorrect gear selection/timing by previous owner.

I have in writing that'it is unlikely that these excursions should have caused any engine damage'.

I fail to see that significant damage could be caused whilst accelerating, as the limiter will intervene, but when changing gear, then your guess is as good as mine.

obviously, miss use will eventually lead to failure one way or another.

gooby

9,269 posts

265 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2006
quotequote all
wantalotus said:

I fail to see that significant damage could be caused whilst accelerating, as the limiter will intervene, but when changing gear, then your guess is as good as mine.




I dont have to guess


Play nice with your toys.

GTRene

22,758 posts

255 months

Thursday 23rd February 2006
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when that happens Gooby, its time to replace it by this, I see you cleaned the engenbay already

GTRene

aelord

337 posts

256 months

Thursday 23rd February 2006
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gooby said:
wantalotus said:

I fail to see that significant damage could be caused whilst accelerating, as the limiter will intervene, but when changing gear, then your guess is as good as mine.




I dont have to guess


Play nice with your toys.


So, Gooby, just to be perfectly clear, yours blew up through throttle revving and not through selecting the wrong gear? If so, that is sobering to say the least.