The death of going out in the UK
Discussion
Enough time had passed that I had forgotten how much I don't enjoy the theatre, and last night found myself with Mrs Furbo at the Royal Concert Hall in Nottingham.
Pre-show and interval G&Ts didn't really numb the pain, when they cost me a total of £54 for four doubles with two packets of crisps. They were served from a bar and by staff consistent with the council-run establishment that it is.
A "show stop" lasting fifteen minutes allowed me time to browse the web for places to eat post-show. It allowed the ladies next to me to open their flasks and Tupperwares to tuck into their sandwiches.
I struggled. Where once there were many late restaurants locally, now 10pm is considered late. But I found a couple open till 11pm.
Show over, we made our way to one of the two "late" places locally, to find the staff wiping down the empty restaurants. There was no one in there at all. The second place was equally devoid of life.
We ended up at an Indian behind the theatre frequented by performers and road crew for the acts. When we entered we were the only diners, surrounded by bored staff. By 11:30 a few more had arrived, but the place was 75% empty.
We fairly often used to eat late after the theatre, both here and in London, and places were full and lively. But, it seems to me, people don't do it now. When I add up what last night cost, it perhaps becomes clear why.
Two Ubers £50
Theatre tickets £114
The drinks £54
Dinner (two courses, no naan, one bottle of the cheapest wine). £90.
This was an evening out courtesy of Mohammed in a Prius, a show at a council-run provincial theatre, drinks in plastic cups and a cheap curry. It cost me £308.00. Ritzy it was not.
Now, as you might reasonably expect for a PHer, for me such sums of money are trivial. For many, however, they are not.
It seems to me that going out has become so expensive that people aren't doing it.
Any thoughts on this chaps?
Pre-show and interval G&Ts didn't really numb the pain, when they cost me a total of £54 for four doubles with two packets of crisps. They were served from a bar and by staff consistent with the council-run establishment that it is.
A "show stop" lasting fifteen minutes allowed me time to browse the web for places to eat post-show. It allowed the ladies next to me to open their flasks and Tupperwares to tuck into their sandwiches.
I struggled. Where once there were many late restaurants locally, now 10pm is considered late. But I found a couple open till 11pm.
Show over, we made our way to one of the two "late" places locally, to find the staff wiping down the empty restaurants. There was no one in there at all. The second place was equally devoid of life.
We ended up at an Indian behind the theatre frequented by performers and road crew for the acts. When we entered we were the only diners, surrounded by bored staff. By 11:30 a few more had arrived, but the place was 75% empty.
We fairly often used to eat late after the theatre, both here and in London, and places were full and lively. But, it seems to me, people don't do it now. When I add up what last night cost, it perhaps becomes clear why.
Two Ubers £50
Theatre tickets £114
The drinks £54
Dinner (two courses, no naan, one bottle of the cheapest wine). £90.
This was an evening out courtesy of Mohammed in a Prius, a show at a council-run provincial theatre, drinks in plastic cups and a cheap curry. It cost me £308.00. Ritzy it was not.
Now, as you might reasonably expect for a PHer, for me such sums of money are trivial. For many, however, they are not.
It seems to me that going out has become so expensive that people aren't doing it.
Any thoughts on this chaps?
Edited by Furbo on Saturday 11th October 08:51
I’d agree, everything is just so ridiculously expensive, I’m on a decent salary (not ph director level) for the area I live and I just don’t bother going out much at all and save my spending for trips and short breaks, there’s no way I’ll spend £300 on a night out, where’s the value?
It would seem lots of people are doing the same also given how empty everywhere is in an evening.
It would seem lots of people are doing the same also given how empty everywhere is in an evening.
Agreed. I'd often have a couple of pints in town whilst strolling about midweek. Finding it a touch more expensive than I'm used to, £6ish I tried a couple of other nearby pubs. I'd caveat that these are rough arse s
tty pubs, sticky carpets, dirty bar, tramp like people in the corner... maybe okay for a quick pint but you certainly wouldn't take your partner there. I wouldn't touch the real ale in such a place so generic Peroni it is. Was smart enough to ask how much before ordering this time. £6.80.
Forget it. Walked out. Found a proper ale pub little further out of town, beer started with a £4 so I had a couple. There are decent places out there but they are few and far between.
tty pubs, sticky carpets, dirty bar, tramp like people in the corner... maybe okay for a quick pint but you certainly wouldn't take your partner there. I wouldn't touch the real ale in such a place so generic Peroni it is. Was smart enough to ask how much before ordering this time. £6.80.Forget it. Walked out. Found a proper ale pub little further out of town, beer started with a £4 so I had a couple. There are decent places out there but they are few and far between.
Edited by Rick101 on Saturday 11th October 08:50
Furbo said:
It seems to me that going out has become so expensive that people aren't doing it.
Any thoughts on this chaps?
To some extent, night's out have always been expensive but even more so now. Combined with the rise in the cost of living in general, the few hundred ££ spunked on a night out hits harder having less disposable income.Any thoughts on this chaps?
So I'm not surprised restaurants are less busy and closing earlier. People are not going 'out' as often as they used to which I guess is down to money and convenience. The same reason shops on the high streets are closing.
butchstewie said:
Good of you to get the taxi drivers name.
As you would expect, projecting as you do negative attitudes upon other PHers at every available opportunity, I don't actually have any interest at all in the names of dark-skinned people. If they are working in low-paid jobs like taxi driving my contempt is only heightened. I only ask the names of white taxi drivers, but even then assume that they have previously spent time in prison or otherwise harbour a serious personality disorder that prevents them from securing more respectable work.But the thing with Uber is that they do insist upon forcing upon you the name of your driver. Which, on both occasions last night, was Mohammed. I can only assume that this was due to the extremely limited lexicon of names that foreign people have.
Grow up.
xx99xx said:
To some extent, night's out have always been expensive but even more so now. Combined with the rise in the cost of living in general, the few hundred ££ spunked on a night out hits harder having less disposable income.
So I'm not surprised restaurants are less busy and closing earlier. People are not going 'out' as often as they used to which I guess is down to money and convenience. The same reason shops on the high streets are closing.
I don't consider myself to be particularly old at 44 but I have zero interest in a night out anymore, in this country at least. Throwing a couple of hundred at a night out is to my mind now a decent down payment on a long weekend away flying from my local airport or even the ferry port where I can be somewhere much more interesting than my local city. So I'm not surprised restaurants are less busy and closing earlier. People are not going 'out' as often as they used to which I guess is down to money and convenience. The same reason shops on the high streets are closing.
Gnits said:
I was out last night having a yearly meeting with some chums in a nice village with a decent restaurant. Didn't book in advance which suddenly became a concern until it turns out there was no need to, we were the only ones left at 9:30.
Big retail park nearby and I was working late in the week and stopped for a burger on the way back.I think about 10.15.
Nandos and Pizza Express both lights out totally dark with chairs on tables at Nando's so not sure what time they closed.
Couldn't see anyone inside and the car park was totally empty.
I'm assuming that's just a midweek thing but I really didn't expect them to look so dead.
xx99xx said:
Furbo said:
It seems to me that going out has become so expensive that people aren't doing it.
Any thoughts on this chaps?
To some extent, night's out have always been expensive but even more so now. Combined with the rise in the cost of living in general, the few hundred ££ spunked on a night out hits harder having less disposable income.Any thoughts on this chaps?
So I'm not surprised restaurants are less busy and closing earlier. People are not going 'out' as often as they used to which I guess is down to money and convenience. The same reason shops on the high streets are closing.
When I was a child, for most people going to the theatre was a big night out. Eating at nice restaurants, driving expensive cars, foreign holidays were all the preserve of a small percentage of society. The rest of us had an occasional special night at the Wimpy, a second-hand Escort and a week on the Kent coast once a year.
Over the last forty years luxury has become more mainstream, to a point where it has become the norm.
I am wondering whether we are seeing a regression in terms of affordability, and if we will see a return to a time when the luxury to which we have become accustomed again becomes the preserve of only the wealthier in society.
I don't think it's a regressions so much as things we previous saw as "cheap" are now expensive and things that we didn't always take for granted now seem normal.
If I look at your bill gut reaction is the theatre tickets and the meal don't look super expensive.
The drinks and the taxis?
The price of drinks shocks me and "when I was a child" I don't remember taxis being so commonplace.
That's the difference between a £200 night out and a £300 night out so a 50% uplift for a drink and not having to drive.
Everyone is different but stuff costs more and I also think some people try to do more as "normal".
I'd skip the drinks and drive and save £100.
If I look at your bill gut reaction is the theatre tickets and the meal don't look super expensive.
The drinks and the taxis?
The price of drinks shocks me and "when I was a child" I don't remember taxis being so commonplace.
That's the difference between a £200 night out and a £300 night out so a 50% uplift for a drink and not having to drive.
Everyone is different but stuff costs more and I also think some people try to do more as "normal".
I'd skip the drinks and drive and save £100.
Furbo said:
I've thought about this in the broader context of the divide between "rich" and "poor".
When I was a child, for most people going to the theatre was a big night out. Eating at nice restaurants, driving expensive cars, foreign holidays were all the preserve of a small percentage of society. The rest of us had an occasional special night at the Wimpy, a second-hand Escort and a week on the Kent coast once a year.
Over the last forty years luxury has become more mainstream, to a point where it has become the norm.
I am wondering whether we are seeing a regression in terms of affordability, and if we will see a return to a time when the luxury to which we have become accustomed again becomes the preserve of only the wealthier in society.
You could be onto something there. I know Nottingham pretty well, still live not far away. I remember how quiet restaurants and some bars were back in the financial crash, but the difference then was that prices seemed more reasonable. When I was a child, for most people going to the theatre was a big night out. Eating at nice restaurants, driving expensive cars, foreign holidays were all the preserve of a small percentage of society. The rest of us had an occasional special night at the Wimpy, a second-hand Escort and a week on the Kent coast once a year.
Over the last forty years luxury has become more mainstream, to a point where it has become the norm.
I am wondering whether we are seeing a regression in terms of affordability, and if we will see a return to a time when the luxury to which we have become accustomed again becomes the preserve of only the wealthier in society.
Still seems busy round Hockley on Saturday afternoon/evening, but a lot are students.
Fusion777 said:
Furbo said:
I've thought about this in the broader context of the divide between "rich" and "poor".
When I was a child, for most people going to the theatre was a big night out. Eating at nice restaurants, driving expensive cars, foreign holidays were all the preserve of a small percentage of society. The rest of us had an occasional special night at the Wimpy, a second-hand Escort and a week on the Kent coast once a year.
Over the last forty years luxury has become more mainstream, to a point where it has become the norm.
I am wondering whether we are seeing a regression in terms of affordability, and if we will see a return to a time when the luxury to which we have become accustomed again becomes the preserve of only the wealthier in society.
You could be onto something there. I know Nottingham pretty well, still live not far away. I remember how quiet restaurants and some bars were back in the financial crash, but the difference then was that prices seemed more reasonable. When I was a child, for most people going to the theatre was a big night out. Eating at nice restaurants, driving expensive cars, foreign holidays were all the preserve of a small percentage of society. The rest of us had an occasional special night at the Wimpy, a second-hand Escort and a week on the Kent coast once a year.
Over the last forty years luxury has become more mainstream, to a point where it has become the norm.
I am wondering whether we are seeing a regression in terms of affordability, and if we will see a return to a time when the luxury to which we have become accustomed again becomes the preserve of only the wealthier in society.
Still seems busy round Hockley on Saturday afternoon/evening, but a lot are students.
Last night too, 80% of people "out" appeared to be students. Particularly female, with skimpy clothes. I took notice of this only for the purposes of my socio-economic study you understand. There seemed to be fewer lads out.
Maybe Nottingham is regressing to the mythical 3-1 women to men ratio (which I suspect dates back to the lace making industry).
If you think about how many "nice" restaurants we hade here 1994-2004 it's quite a change isn't it. Many of these you could eat at late. I remember being served in one at 04:45 on one occasion!
Its as I've said on a few other threads: Wage compression.
The very things the OP is describing tend to be provided by people on lower wages, but consumed by people on higher wages.
Over recent years, the lower wages have been pushed up at a fair greater rate than the higher wages. That therefore increases the price of the things the people on higher wages are consuming (in this case, on their night out). But, those very consumers have not seen anything like the same increase in their income. Hence, everything is now much more expensive for them than it used to. And therefore they decide they are not prepared to spend their money on such things.
The very things the OP is describing tend to be provided by people on lower wages, but consumed by people on higher wages.
Over recent years, the lower wages have been pushed up at a fair greater rate than the higher wages. That therefore increases the price of the things the people on higher wages are consuming (in this case, on their night out). But, those very consumers have not seen anything like the same increase in their income. Hence, everything is now much more expensive for them than it used to. And therefore they decide they are not prepared to spend their money on such things.
52 here, totally agree I think I am at the point where I would gladly never go out again. 30 years ago I didn't even notice the cost of going out, now I feel like I am being mugged.
£18 fish and chips, £22 cinema tickets, £13 for a double gin and tonic (£18 at the O2)
Last time the four of us went out for lunch at Bill's and the Cinema afterwards I spent £200, absolutely mental. Plus virtually no decent films have been released in the last 20 years, all instantly forgettable dross.
You can see why you struggle to get a table anytime you go into Wetherspoon as it is the only place that has decent prices.
I was at the O2 recently and someone ordered four sad looking burger and chips and it was £80. How did the person feel who was serving when handing over four cardboard trays of crap food that probably cost more than they would take home from their shift?
£18 fish and chips, £22 cinema tickets, £13 for a double gin and tonic (£18 at the O2)
Last time the four of us went out for lunch at Bill's and the Cinema afterwards I spent £200, absolutely mental. Plus virtually no decent films have been released in the last 20 years, all instantly forgettable dross.
You can see why you struggle to get a table anytime you go into Wetherspoon as it is the only place that has decent prices.
I was at the O2 recently and someone ordered four sad looking burger and chips and it was £80. How did the person feel who was serving when handing over four cardboard trays of crap food that probably cost more than they would take home from their shift?
Edited by ThingsBehindTheSun on Saturday 11th October 10:17
snuffy said:
Its as I've said on a few other threads: Wage compression.
The very things the OP is describing tend to be provided by people on lower wages, but consumed by people on higher wages.
Over recent years, the lower wages have been pushed up at a fair greater rate than the higher wages. That therefore increases the price of the things the people on higher wages are consuming (in this case, on their night out). But, those very consumers have not seen anything like the same increase in their income. Hence, everything is now much more expensive for them than it used to. And therefore they decide they are not prepared to spend their money on such things.
So, the waiters, baristas are now relatively more affluent whilst the older, family / professional / career-progressed are relatively poorer you're saying? The very things the OP is describing tend to be provided by people on lower wages, but consumed by people on higher wages.
Over recent years, the lower wages have been pushed up at a fair greater rate than the higher wages. That therefore increases the price of the things the people on higher wages are consuming (in this case, on their night out). But, those very consumers have not seen anything like the same increase in their income. Hence, everything is now much more expensive for them than it used to. And therefore they decide they are not prepared to spend their money on such things.
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